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eat less garlic

oh you said sense not sents..... hmmm

maybe you can borrow some of that old goatskin parchment writtings Trish was reffring to

what do i know i have no sense

it obviously comes from within. if you do something wrong then you feel guilt. if you feel u have been wronged then you feel a sense of injustice. if you see someone committing a crime against another you instinctively know that it's wrong and you know that these crimes should be punished. nothing to do with religion, just simple logic.

morals have been here for as long as people have been getting itchy backs - as in, you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours - all the reasoning which we take for granted and the niceties of manners werent there in the first place, they have all gone through their own processes of evolution or refinement.

The child who doesnt conform in a group situation is soon left on the sidelines until it learns that hitting (or whatever) isnt accepted. Once the niceties become a norm for any group they start to move on - behaviour evolves as people learn what and what isnt acceptable - on a larger scale, such as society, it takes longer because more variables are entered into the equation.

You can see it in lovers, giving their best to the object of their desire - the desired outcome is harmony with that person and if both people have learned the correct behaviour its 'hey presto' success - there are lots of little nuances and refinements too but its all been learned over time from the need for the pay off - whether this is on a one to one basis or a larger scale, people eventually learn right from wrong.

If I were to agree with your theory that it comes from within....would it be a fair statement to say then you think we are all born with this "sense" of right and wrong?

We all have heard of the Sermon on the Mount "Blessed are the Cheesemakers" but I don't know there the mushrooms (Morels) came from?

I wasn't sure where they came from until those very loooooong informative postings hehe..
But I often wonder where they went....

contrary to belief there really are no absolute rights or wrongs. unless you deem majority as having final say. a burglar a liar a cheat can all within the confines of there own reality justify what they do...

I think morals and justice should not ever be confused.


When one lives their entire life doing what is morally right they best believe that happiness and wealth are only obtained within the heart. Justice will bankrupt and destroy a morally person man in a nanosecond, if it chooses to

i agree ... It is geneticaly incoded in humans and powered by ages of experience of our human race.

I don't think it's hard codded Marina ... it is inherited somewhat but mostly we pass it along to our children what's right and wrong.

Origins of justice go back to Babylon and the first written law "An eye for an eye"

back then to those times you are talking about ... the main law was the so - called Law of Jungles. Tough times, tough morals. But even then the love and tenderness toward little kids and animals existed along with Respect for older people and friendship values.

I do believe no one invented them ... they all in our DNA. Responsibilities of parents are to teach their offsprings(by own example) ... if they do not Well ...Religion or a street gang takes everything in hands.

Yes i do agree that it is genetically inherited ( which is a prove of being incoded in DNA) That's why we have to be very careful with our choices in choosing a partner.

Morals as set of guide lines are human specific characteristics. Caring and tenderness can be witnessed in animal world. Qualities like nurture of the young and respect for elders ensures survival of the species. Morals have nothing to do with hard codded feelings.

I see what you saying though. We've evolved to obligate our selfs with morals. It's still a pattern like bird migration or passed on hunting skills and isn't genetic.

Yes I agree it has nothing to do with religion. I also agree that religion corrupts for the sake of gain and power. What people generally seem to miss is that religion and God is two very different subjects. What God offers is thrown out with religion.

Where do this knowledge from within comes from. It seems previous posts wants us to believe that it is a simple matter of development - or evolution of the brain processes under pressure from the world we live in. If this was so then surely we would have seen the emergence of the "self" as the accepted moral formant. The exact opposite is true. This knowledge from within guides us to feel guilty at putting the "self" before others and guides us to be compassionate towards the need of others. We "instinctively" know that we should help others and give up our own needs to do this. This is but one example. We know from within that it is wrong to abuse, kill, steal, hate, lie etc. More important this is universal to all cultures and most important is that this becomes more pronounced - even uncompromisable - to people who met God personally.

The bible gives us a clue why this is so. After Jesus death and resurection the bible tells us that believers were given the Spirit of God - which immediately changed their behaviour from passive (and even somewhat sceptical) onlookers to active participants who lived moral lives. To recognise a person who is filled with this Spirit is to see someone who lives his life according to the moral values that the bible gives us - this is not just the ten commandments which is the basis of the Jewish law - it is the teachings of Christ.

Thus this knowledge from within is given to everyone by the Spirit. Those who chose to surrender to God lives under the full guidance of the Spirit and these people aspire to the moral values that was taught by Jesus.

But this is nothing new. The highly anomalous character of what we all call "moral values" should alert us to the fact that the Spirit have always been around giving people this knowledge from within causing humanity to formulate morals values that does not reflect the envirmental pressure we are under - but God's character.

Easy. Originated from the beginning of creation. We are eternal beings in one form or another. I believe that goodness is cellular.
We just have the free will to choose to experience 'life' in many
eternal ways. We all have the ability to create to our hearts
extent.
Enjoy yourself, all. None of this is real.
One thing to remember, though...
There are consequences to our actions. (built-in)

Well, again this is my point Emotional intelligence is heritable. Lets observe Violence .... Do you believe that people who serve time in prisons came out families with a history of Violent behavior?Do you believe their children will spend their lifes balancing on a tiny edge to repeat their parents "deeds"?

respect for elders doesn't have nothing to do with survival of species (in the animal kingdom). Animals do not take care of their elders ... because reproduction and ability to kill for food are the main traits to assure the survival. You watch too many cartoons.

your turn

well said Dusty - I agree, it is survival and begins at the cellular level

sort of like the nature/nurture debate meeting biological imperatives

A very good question!!

sorry they were so long but i was busy am very happy you liked them and thanks

i too wonder where they went at times - maybe they get gobbled up by ego

Oh there are several species where elder is often a leader.
Violence in humans toward other humans is usually caused by emotional instability. Emotional instability is based on feelings (love,hate,fear) I can not honestly say if criminal behavior is hereditary or not. I think there is a research on a subject. I do know that nurture plays a big part.

oops - sorry meant to quote you Dina on the 'happy you liked them' comment

VERY short answer: all pack animals require rules and a kind of ethics to function cooperatively. Add to that basic imperative a vastly higher IQ, and you get morals.

In a very cramped nutshell.