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95% AGREED

HI SWEET HONEY.....

why is the cost the reason why the death penalty should stay ?

like i said how much is a life worth ?


if my taxes help keep ppl in prison so be it

if my taxes help educate ppl so be it

if my taxes help house ppl so be it

if my taxes help give ppl benefits so be it


a life is valuable to me

even the life of a murderer

and if just one person is executed and they were innocent

then to me ............ the argument stops there

I use to be for the death penalty, but changed my mind. However, I am for people who would face the death penalty be given just a few things for the rest of their lives and nothing else.

A cell
A toilet
3 meals a day
Shower
A rope

No workout rooms, yard time, phone calls, tv, internet, visitors, mail

Nothing but 4 walls to stare at thinking about what they did for the rest of their lives.

What is the rope for?? Hopefully the prisoner will put it to good use around their own necks.

Let them pay for their heinous crimes. Let them take their own lives instead of all of us taking it for them

Sounds cruel and unusual? I think that question should be asked the family and friends of the victim....

JMO

Perfect example: Mi has no death penalty and Detroit ranks 1st in the nation and Flint 3rd in violent crimes. Coincidence?

thumbsup: YESSIR!!!!!!!:

Good one! I totally agree. Some people just CANNOT be rehabilitated.

I've posted about this before, and all I'll say is that I am always uncomfortable with the government having the ability to use state-sanctioned murder in any case, no matter how horrible the crime.

And no, it is not a deterrent to crime. There have been study after study done to show that! Criminals do not think they will get caught, so the idea of the death penalty is irrelevant to them.

I recommend "Kiss of Death: America's Love Affair With the Death Penalty" By John D. Bessler, as it's a quick read, but very accurate with its data and conclusions.

I am not trying to argue with you... I am trying to understand your point of view....

the cost is a HUGE factor here....concider the other things that the money could be used for....in 2001, there was almost $40 BILLION DOLLARS spent on keeping inmates in prisions and jails and the facilities that these inmates stayed in, in good repair...

take just 1/2 of that....$20 BILLION DOLLARS....that could have been used to educate our children, help house the homeless, help to retrain a person who has been injured or downsized...there are SO MANY POSITIVE things that could be done with that money...so much good

I am not saying that the life of an inmate is completely worthless...but why should they be allowed to live in a luxury condition i.e. having airconditioning, cable T.V. state of the art weight rooms, phone privlliges and other creature comforts, when the reasons that they are there may varry...they are still the same....THEY BROKE THE LAW..... so they should lose more than just their freedom....

I don't see anything wrong with what you are saying here Ken...I agree with it...


Thank you for your input

But that money will not be used for "education" or "homeless" people. Get real. It'll go back to the top 5% in the form of more tax cuts, or maybe a few more smart bombs for the war in Iraq. We've seen savings before (i.e. the balanced budget, tax revenue increases in the 90s, welfare reform) that did not help education, or poor people, or retraining.

And have you ever lost your freedom? No matter how much Cable TV a person can watch, they are stuck there. Forever. I think losing freedom is the biggest punishment we can hand out.

http://www.deathpenaltyfocus.org/

The death penalty is much more expensive than life without parole because the Constitution requires a long and complex judicial process for capital cases. This process is needed in order to ensure that innnocent men and woman are not executed for crimes they did not commit, and even with these protections the risk of executing an innocent person can not be completely eliminated.

If the death penalty was replaced with a sentence of Life Without the Possibility of Parole*, which costs millions less and also ensures that the public is protected while eliminating the risk of an irreversible mistake, the money saved could be spent on programs that actually improve the communities in which we live.

---

altho my own view is still that money shouldnt be the main factor

Yes let them take their own lives would be a good thing.But all you can hear out of their mouths is I don't want to die,but you feel it right in taking a life and ones being spared.I have sit in on cases in the study of law.And alot of the times the wheels of justice turn too slow,may too slow.Aman who should have been in jail for several attempts on my best friends life is out and running around.And in the time he was out free,he found his x my best friend and he did what he said he beat her to death.And want to know with all the beatings the attempts to kill her where he is?He is living his life a free man,had someone give him alibi.He done it because he said he would.But yet no arrest has been made,he goes on living.I have seen many from here who did not wait for justice they took it upon themself.Take for instance this 12 year old was attacked and raped,dumped on the side of the road out from her house.The law was called in,she told who did what.Do you think this guy was arrested no it was put off for hillbilly days was fixing to go on.And tempers were raging of this childs family.They wanted him to pay.The next day they found him hung out behind his house.Who did it,who is to say.But he did end up paying.I just hope he got to ask forgiveness for his miserable self.

Maybe we should go back to "an eye for an eye". I'll bet if the criminal knew if he molests some1 then he will get molested right back. Don't think he'd commit that crime.

dualy noted on the cost issue...I understand your point there...I am trying to figure out how things changed so much...

is it the fact that the laws have changed to favor the criminal so much...or that the punishment no longer fits the crime???


there are many factors that play into it...and yes....lawyers are to blame as well....they were the ones that have fought for the courts to change their opinions on the way a criminal should be treated...


what are your thoughts on that?

I agree with you squirrly, hillblyhoney and MB. We have a young offenders law here and it has to go. More crime started then. Sometmes I wonder if I would be better off in the Canadian Correctional Institution than out here struggling.

an eye for an eyes makes the whole world blind

if we all seek revenge where does it end??

kinda like fighting fire with fire makes a much bigger fire

anyway .............time for me to go for a bit

been a nice debate in here without ppl getting rude ........ nice to see




see ya later squirly x

Well for the first time I agree with Kev on something.Important issues as eduaction and homeless have been overlooked ,way to long.But every adminisration gets in say they are going to deal with these issues but its just not happening.And it has become a major issue in our society.What kind of society are we to let ones stay under a cardboard box,or eat out of garbage cans.It isn't saying too much for us.The goveernment needs to implement programs to help these down and out ,down on their luck poor souls.Things do happen in life you know,you can get laid off from your job,you can end up losing it all,being just like them in the streets.As for most of the prisons they ain't about punishment,they have cable tvs even internet.

Glad we coud debate this with out the flare ups that so often happen...


I look forward to the next time Dominatrix, until then...my fondest regardes and respect to you

ive done the rude thing
uh oh

ive read the op and this page only

but i think the amount we pay for housing is nuts
its like the 3.000 dollar hammer a few years back-its padded somewhere

the is it cruel question-
i dunno
we have gone to some pretty great lengths
to make it quick and painless-which is fair
its ruff on the families but ill bet some
breathe a sigh of relief as well.

they can now grieve the loss of their loved one-which in truth, happened long ago, as statistically those that get that far
into the system were arrested many times before-
and that is horrible pressure for the family all along the way

the 2 sides? someone dies who may have been better later
or we stop paying to care for them

also eye for eye is old testament-not a law
the commandments are a foundation of this country
and that says no murder
but is it murder?
i guess-kinda

its a tuff subject and all sides have validity to a point
thats why these things are voted on by the people
and thats a wonderful and appropriate thing...
problem is felons cant vote

as far as it being a deterrent? no way
the average criminal thinks they will get away w/ the crime
or in violent cases it was an accident/moment of emotional insanity
so the thot of the possibility of the death penalty isnt a factor

I hate to say this but most of your criminals start out as young offenders,and how are they dealt with,you guessed it rehabilitation.And because they are under a certain age and commit a crime they are first let out on probation they break that then its house arrest,and so on.They go thru so many stages just to deal with a young offender.And some they think they eliminate the problem and medicate them.They take away who they are by controlling them with meds because they have the easy solution.