Connecting Singles^® Forums 100% Free Online Dating

dazzling_dave:

1. from bondage to spiritual faith;

2. from spiritual faith to great courage;

3. from courage to liberty;

4. from liberty to abundance;

5. from abundance to complacency;

6. from complacency to apathy;

7. from apathy to dependence;

8. From dependence back into bondage."

dazzling_dave: Hi BeB.

Found this on another forum. It is an interesting perspective.

About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new
constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at
the University of Edinburgh , had this to say about the fall of the
Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier: "A democracy is always
temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of
government." "A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that
voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury." "From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."

"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the
beginning of history, has been about 200 years." "During those 200
years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence:

1. from bondage to spiritual faith;

2. from spiritual faith to great courage;

3. from courage to liberty;

4. from liberty to abundance;

5. from abundance to complacency;

6. from complacency to apathy;

7. from apathy to dependence;

8. From dependence back into bondage."

Professor Joseph Olson of Hamline University School of Law, St.Paul,
Minnesota, points out some interesting facts co ncerning the 2000
Presidential election: Number of States won by: Gore: 19; Bush: 29
Square miles of land won by: Gore: 580,000; Bush: 2,427,000 Population of counties won by: Gore: 127 million; Bush: 143 million Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by: Gore: 13.2; Bush: 2.1

Professor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this great
country. Gore's territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in
government-owned tenements and living off various forms of government welfare..."Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the "complacency and apathy" phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached the "governmental dependency" phase. If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million criminal invaders called illegals and they vote, then we can say goodbye to the USA in fewer than five years

BnaturAl: sooooooo we're done?

the misconception that money is the root of all evil .. taken out of context;
when the correct phrase should read something more like ..

"the 'love' of money is the root of all evil" ..

trish123: Thats all great Dave but the big difference is in education of the masses - and we have that. Traditionally, rulers have come from the ruling 'classes' - now, rulers are coming from a diversity of backgrounds - ideologies are meeting.

Just because something always was - is no indication whatsoever that it will always be thus

trish123: or maybe 'the corruption engendered by' "the 'love' of money is the root of all evil" <- thats an ironic laugh, not a humorous
one -> that is a humorous one

dazzling_dave: I believe that the leaders really could care less as long as they can continue to remain in power. If you look take a look at the two sides of the upcoming election, it is pretty much as my last post states. You have the people on the one side with their hands out saying give me, and the other side wishing government would stay out of our lives as much as possible.

BnaturAl: Bush is from a diverse background? ummm .. is Blair, whats his background? And the guys in russia and china, hell Canada for that matter ... maybe I missed something youre talking about trish. what countries have this leader from diverse as opposed to ruling class background?

BnaturAl: true.So how do you feel about this Dave? What do you think needs to be done to change this?

trish123: they are coming up through the masses Al, we have the power to vote - well, theoretically at least
I know Im an ideallist - but this subdued world needs a bit of this to balance out all the right wing ideals we have lived under for so long
If people dont believe changes are possible then they will never happen - its like somebody whos having a bad day believing its gonna be that way forever - it is soon a case of visiting the GP with depression.
Get yr dancin shoes on
...

BnaturAl: In theory ... but therein lies another part of the problem. Personal apathy.. no point in changing that.. drug dependancy is rampant in persuit of this 'good day' feeling.

In theory but with a big IF ..

dazzling_dave: What needs to be done won't happen because of apathy. This generation of people does not understand what the second amendment to the constitution was all about. Our founding fathers gave us the right to bear arms just in case the things that are happening today, would happen.

We have far too many people in this country that want the government to take care of them from cradle to grave. Because of this, our elections will change nothing. The people are too concerned about their own insignificant lives to even begin to comprehend that it isn't all about them. Hard work and sacrifice got this country to where it is. Few people today can even begin to comprehend the word sacrifice.

dazzling_dave: Trish, now all I see are all those guys on crosses singing that song in "The Life of Brian"

dazzling_dave: Trish, now all I see are all those guys on crosses singing that song in "The Life of Brian"

trish123: yep, but even that - its in the interests of the governments to have a healthy black market to uphold flagging economies - its gone on for years.

When I was doing criminology, looking at prison populations and the drugs issues there was a lot of stuff from prison officers condoning drugs, not just the corrupt ones on the take either - it was about having the inmates subdued so there was no trouble.

The prisons are simply a microcosm of the criminals at large in society - it is better if they are kept bombed out of their brains - is there really enough employment for them anyway? and the illegal immigrant problems - black market and kick backs all along the lines - they are happy with the status quo if you ask me

BnaturAl: Are you suggesting revolt, rebellion.. Dave?

My son once brought that very amendment up in a conversation with some of my american friends in much the same way you have. Whats the point of the amendment if it's not 'understood" to begin with (because most only see it as protection , not as the pro-active element it was meant to be) and then not used when necessary ... How do you get enough people to stand against possibly the largest war machine in the world, in your own country.

If thats not what youre suggesting I take that back, but it seems to be from here.

BnaturAl: that is a great movie!!! what i thought too .. trish I think is related to one of them

dazzling_dave: That was my implication, yes. Why do you think the government is pushing so hard for gun control? The government doesn't care if the criminal element has guns because the criminals are just using them for their own selfish gain. Because of gun registration, the government now knows exactly who has guns. One day, they will come knocking on doors and take all the guns away. If I recall correctly, Hitler did the same thing.

Unfortunately, revolt will never happen. It shouldn't have to. If people would vote someone into office that cared more for this country than about themselves and keeping power, things could change. This might require that people would have to live with a bit of discomfort for a bit.