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I think that a lot of the hanging on to what is not to be, is ego. We refuse to believe that the other person can't see what we see about ourselves inside.

If we looked at this rationally, we'd see that this would be impossible, but in wanting to be with someone, sooooooooo much, raging hormones, love-sick and all, we are rarely rational, so delude ourselves into thinking there is hope, and so hang on in there, often destroying something of who we are in the process.

These are painful lessons to learn, but we all, to some degree, have to go through it in order to later protect our hearts and emotions from being destroyed altogether and our self esteem along with it.......

It's our first adult lesson in social/relationship limitations I think.

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People often mistake letting go as being a sign of weakness and giving up...You can't make someone feel what they don't and no good comes by hanging on....It only serves to make you miserable and prolongs the inevitable.....Letting go is a sign of strength and the willingness to let another move on to the places that make they happy....even if it's not with you.....That can also be the ultimate sign of love for another because it takes less selfishness to let go then it does to attemp to hold someone in a place they don't want to be for your own sake....

Excellent thread, hun. I may add to it later.

I really can't understand why anyone would want to be with someone who didn't want them. My problem has been staying too long with someone just because they wanted me there, when I wasn't getting anything from the relationship.

Love really can't be analyzed, but we can use our heads a little more as we grow and learn, and make the choices that are best for us, not simply those that others want us to make. We are not fools for making mistakes, we are fools if we don't learn from them though.

Zarah wrote:
The one that loves the least always controls the relationship..
I think with some people it is simply they want what they cannot have



I think it is because the opposite of love is control. And even a true romantic will learn that the truth of love is freedom and the freedom of love is truth....If you never know truth then you never know love.
In love I always seek to understand the other then to understand myself. That may possibly be the best gift I have received from real love....self-understanding. Even if I was caught up in a romantic notion, real love conquers all.

To me, either way it is the same, we are settling for less than what we deserve but to achieve it first we must believe it.

I am going through this myself right now. I haven't been able to let go for 6 months. I hold onto hope, however I am starting to realize she will never come back.

I truely loved her. I knew in my mind it was over a long time ago. But my heart was the culprit that has held onto hope for so long. My heart is gaining strength again.

I guess I am a fool, but I like to think of myself as more human than fool.

No you're not a fool...when you love someone...Time is what it takes to let go and heal....Yes the mind and heart aren't always in agreement unfortunately!!!!!!!!!!

So true gingerb...your post covers a lot of ground for a good portion of the people. I would say depending on the dynamics of a relationship, and the mindset of the individual, there would be a lot more complicated factors outside of ego. I can discuss more later.




True, letting go is a sign that you respect and love yourself. Great post Hugz....




I really like your last sentence. It's the only way we gain wisdom by learning. I am a bit surprised that you can't understand why anyone would want to be with someone who didn't want them. No harm, no foul.




We are all human. Perfectly normal what you are experiencing mbcasey. Ultimately, it takes time. Let me say this, at some point you have to make that choice to move on so you can let go in your own way and feel like the person you want to be. I know it hurts. Find a process to heal up in your own way, and believe that there is some lovely woman who will love you unconditionally. Try to not take it personal. You can only control your half.Nice to meet you btw

Oh, the thread title was inspired by the Doobie Brothers..."What A Fool Believes" performed by Michael McDonald.....I am not in any way calling anyone a fool. That is why I posted a pic of the Doobie Brothers in my op.

I shall add some of my experiences and insight in a while. It may complicate the thread....

Lust is a powerful thing at times....

Yep - i think thats very true

somehow, the weaker of the 2 is always the one who tends to bow to the needs of the other. Its a quastion in the end of how long do you keep up with the seemingly 1 sided compromises?

As for the feelimngs and yearnings for someone that just isnt interested (if they even ever were?), then I find that cold, hard logic and facing up to the facts help to do the trick. In other words, if you are not together then there are a number of good reason

1 The other person actually loves somebody else
2 The other person sees you simply as a friend and no more
3 Possibly, there is an age difference making the match unrealistic
4 Cultural attitudes can be a major reason for 2 people not clicking at thr right time
5 Maybe you like each other, but the sexual attraction is 1 sided?
6 Pure differences in mentality - simply not having the same view points due to, for example, the need to be a parent, or simply 1 person being to immature to manage and identify correctly with the other

i have been thru all these things lately and have come very unstuck and and it was not because of my own fault (at least - thats what i think! lol).

Anyway, for me its difficult because I have to work with this paerson and se her enearly everyday - I just want to be normal as she is a colleague, but i realised lately this is never going to happen and it almost makes my position untenable - sometimes i think I should quit just to avoid her but thats too drastic a measure. I think we simply need some arbitration between us so we can sort the mess out, because i am so fed up of having to ignore her and act like she doesnt exist because i know that if I do try to start a normal conversation with her then it will all go pear shaped again!

Anyway, for me its difficult because I have to work with this paerson and se her enearly everyday - I just want to be normal as she is a colleague, but i realised lately this is never going to happen and it almost makes my position untenable - sometimes i think I should quit just to avoid her but thats too drastic a measure. I think we simply need some arbitration between us so we can sort the mess out, because i am so fed up of having to ignore her and act like she doesnt exist because i know that if I do try to start a normal conversation with her then it will all go pear shaped again!

Neil, just tell her how you feel and quit playing around... you might be surprised... honesty is the policy..

Anyway, for me its difficult because I have to work with this paerson and se her enearly everyday - I just want to be normal as she is a colleague, but i realised lately this is never going to happen and it almost makes my position untenable - sometimes i think I should quit just to avoid her but thats too drastic a measure. I think we simply need some arbitration between us so we can sort the mess out, because i am so fed up of having to ignore her and act like she doesnt exist because i know that if I do try to start a normal conversation with her then it will all go pear shaped again!

Neil, just tell her how you feel and quit playing around... you might be surprised... honesty is the policy..



I hate the b%%%h

yes honesty is the best policy but be prepared for the outcome. It could go either way and you need to be prepared for the worst as well as the best

As long as we know our limitations we should be all right

I have been on both sides with this one. Was with someone on and off for 2 yrs that I couldn't let go of. He moved in with someone and I still couldn't let go, so when he called a couple of months later I took him back. Dumb move He was very controlling, while not physically abusive, was mentally and verbally abusive. When he finally left it was like a weight had been lifted off of me.

Have also been on the other side where the guy couldn't let go. He would call and send flowers. Finally stopped taking his calls and refusing his flowers. Ignored him all together. Not sure if I was right but was all I could think to do at the time.

Great conversation here! Lots of real-world wisdom with poetry from Fleetwood, Doobies and a Lizard King.

I want to comment on the pain. It is a powerful force, but need not be overpowering. Suppression, denial only multiply its effects.

Pain is like any other feeling or emotion... meant to be experienced.

Those of us that have denied or suppressed it have only filled cancerous baggage, to be carried until such time that we face it, FEEL it, and get on with our healthier life.

For me, part of living healthy is too recognize my feelings, AS THEY HAPPEN, and to simply feel them... pain, rage, love, bliss. We have such an immense range...

Good one, StressFree

Many people hold on because they dont want to deal with the pain. The pain is real and it hurts so much. They have been there before when the pain is so bad and it makes your heart and soul feel like hell. You just want to go some where and die. WE have all been there. Some of us walk away, some of us what for the other to do so. It hurts no matter what or who walks away first. LOVE HURTS. I have done both.

So I had coffee today with my most recent ex. I was approaching it as a friendly coffee, but I had my suspicions about her intentions.

Anyways, her current relationship is on the rocks, and all of the sudden she tells me that she does not care to have a child...we broke up becuase I did not want to have kids. So then she goes on about all the good times we had and how she misses me. She basically was giving me a sales pitch....telling me about how we can have such a wonderful future and all. Also, she now magically sees our differences on practical matters and individual liberty as a good thing.

Funny stuff indeed. She cheated on me with the guy she is with now, she left me for him because he promised her a kid (guess he told her what she wanted to hear at the time), and she is still with him.

Yeah, I aint no security blanket....and I aint no fool. She is the fool for believing in something that will never be. She needs to find strength and happiness from within, not from her boyfriends. She is looking for somebody to hand her happiness. I was not angry with her or anything, just could not believe a woman of 38 years would be so immature....

I politely told her that it is not meant to be....and that I have an internet girlfriend who I plan on meeting....

Any other takes on this?

I can say I was the fool this spring with my kids mother...she continuously dropped hints that she wanted me back while I was with my girlfriend at the time...so things happened for one night, and it was not meant to be. Man, I mean, my ex and I broke it off for various reasons, but the main thing was that I had my kids mother in the back of my mind and it kind of dictated how things ended up with my ex girlfriend...and it turned out to be a dud..lol

I'm over this matter, but still. Why did my ex spend so many months of putting some kind of effort to keep my interest up, then when the opportunity was there, she vanished like the wind...was I a fool for giving her a chance? I mean, I did have a great thing going with my recent ex...man, whatever....