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my dear muslem all one has to do is look at the continent of africa to see how peaceloving muslems really are . They are raping and plundering everywhere they go . Of course it is only the infadels they are killing in the name of Allah. And i am not a zionist but a fundamental christian exercising my right of free speach which the muslem world would like to take away from me.just remember mohamed is dead only jesus lives.

Its one thing to have freedom of speech but to abuse such a privilege is wrong, which ever way you look at it.

The vast majority of Muslims are peaceloving,it is a tiny majority that are causing mayhem, just as a tiny minortity of so called Christians do the same, fanatical minorities in ANY RELIGION are the cause of pain and grief not the majority.

My goodness the American education system has a lot to answer for!

Don't forget to include the "other" group of fundamentalists - Zionists

I did Patrick, read it again, I said ANY RELIGION, I do include Zionist within that group.

I have never condoned what the Zionist element have done at times, I have always tried to put forward a balanced view.

But in your eyes even that is wrong, I just can't win can I

"Balanced view" depends where you are on the pendulum

Read my posts again, where have I ever knocked the Palestinians, where have I ever knocked Islam, where have I ever knocked Christianity.

Where have I said that I think people should die, by any means

Where have I said that Zionism is totally correct in its actions

Where is this unbalanced view, just maybe in your camp Patrick as its you who have cast blame here there and everywhere except at one population, not once have you said that hamas has done wrong

You views have always been totally slanted against one population and never showed the whole picture.

This is unquestionably disputable!

And this..

I can go on but what is here will suffice to illustrate my point!
Now will you answer one question?

Where in the World have you seen the Israeli approach to hamas work?

Israel has created this problem, It is not a whole lot different to South African apartheid, nor to the situtation that existed in Northern ireland.

The manner in which they were dealt with is the manner that this one will be dealt with in order to bring it to an end! peacefully!

Now I am out of here but "I shall return"

The Aix Group, "a semi-official political-economic backchannel" is developing a plan for Palestinian refugees. The Aix Group's members include Israeli, Palestinian and international economic experts, academics, members of economic organizations, and officials from international institutions, including the World Bank, the International Monetary Fund and the European Union, who participate in the Aix Group in their personal capacities.

The group is administered by a steering committee led by Prof. Gilbert Benhayoun, a Moroccan-born Frenchman, Prof. Arie Arnon, economics professor from Ben-Gurion University in Be’er Sheva, Said Bamya, the former deputy minister for economic affairs in the Palestinian Authority, Dr. Ron Pundak, director of the Peres Center and Dr. Samir Hazbun from DATA Studies and Consultation. Other partners include the European Union, French donors, the World Bank, the French Foreign Ministry, the International Development Research Center in Canada, the General Council of the Bouches du Rhone, and the Regional Council of Provence-Alpes-Cote d'Azur.

The Aix Group's document opens with a declaration of principles stating that an agreed and just long-term solution to the problem of the 1948 refugees must be based on the relevant United Nations resolutions, including General Assembly Resolution 194, but then nullifies that statement by saying that "a literal application of this Resolution is no longer possible given the substantial changes on the ground." The document then describes an arrangement that would substitute for the U.N. resolution which they have deemed no longer applicable, stating that, "The parties would agree that the measures recommended in the paper implement Resolution 194."

The reference to "substantial changes on the ground" as an obstacle that renders the UN resolution inapplicable perpetuates the myth that physical or material obstacles render return impossible. According to Salman Abu Sitta an expert on the Palestinian refugee issue, "90% of the village sites are still vacant, 7% are partially built-over, and only 3% are totally built over in Tel Aviv and West Jerusalem." Of course, there are obvious issues that would have to be addressed. But these problems have been dealt with in many places, such as Bosnia, Kosovo and Tajikistan, to name a few, and pose no obstacle in and of themselves to return.

A hint to what the real obstacle may be lies in Ha'aretz correspondent Akiva Eldar's statement that "The Aix Group is convinced that if bold steps are not taken in the right direction, the vision of one state for two peoples, based on joint citizenship and equality before the law, will be placed on the agenda."

The group suggests that an international committee of experts would determine what constitutes "fair and full" compensation for property claims. They estimate that the total cost of these claims will be between $15 billion and $30 billion.

The group makes it clear that in cases in which "fair and full compensation" is offered, "restitution" (the right of return) will not be considered.
This formulation turns the basic principle set in the UN Principles on Housing and Property Restitution for Refugees and Displaced Persons totally on end.
The UN principles clearly note that restitution is the primary remedy, and compensation only comes into play if refugees themselves choose compensation, or if restitution is factually not possible as determined by an independent tribunal.

cont.//...

"Palestinian refugees will be asked to choose a permanent place of residence, the group proposes that the individuals choose more than one alternative and rank their priorities."
But the implementation of this choice depends on "the states concerned", including Israel.
Aix proposes to create an International Agency for the Palestinian Refugees (IAPR) that will be responsible "to ensure that the final decisions satisfy the wishes of the refugees as much as possible and are in line with the overall agreements to be signed between the representatives of the two sides, and possibly also with the relevant host countries and other countries."

The Aix group expects that a large number of refugees will choose to relocate to other countries at the cost of $8 billion to $19 billion, depending on how many refugees will choose to move from their current country of residence. The plan suggests that some of the Palestinian refugees will be rehabilitated in their current locations and will receive compensation "in kind or in money" at a cost of $10 billion to $14 billion.

In addition, the group recommends the creation of a fourth fund, which will require about $22 billion, for compensation relating to "refugeehood" not related to property claims or the other programs. All the registered refugees will receive a uniform amount of about $5,000 each. According to Ha’aretz, the money can be attained in a period spread out over 10 years and with extensive, generous international aid.

Under international humanitarian law the right of refugees to return to their homes is an inalienable, individual human right. Like all human rights, it is invaluable and cannot be bought. Under Israel and Bush’s "solution", Palestinian refugee families who had been expelled from what is now Israel would be consigned to return, not to their homes, but to small, non-contiguous parts of less than 22% of their original homeland.
Jews from anywhere in the world, on the other hand, would be free to "return" to more than 78% of historic Palestine, frequently to live on land seized from those same Palestinian refugees.
Such clear discrimination against Palestinian refugees and privileging of Jews from anywhere in the world illustrates clearly that these proposals would further a separate but unequal solution that cannot result in peace.

my dear Fundamental christian..

wow the Muslim world would like to take away your free speech..
very cool..


the Koran ordered us to believe in "Moses and Jesus and all the prophets" peace upon on all of them..before be a Muslim..

Mohamed the prophet of gad"peace be upon on him" he was just a Human Lives and die and the only god almighty never die.. so no need to remind me Thank you Dear..

Jesus "PBUH" still alive yes up in Heaven but gonna die one day
when he back and end his message on earth..


and regarding the Muslims in the Continent of Africa may god
help them and guide their souls for the right thing and stop raping and Plundering specially with their Christian as you and Jews Brothers..its shame on them bloody


By the way to be Zionist no need to be a Jew if you like i can help you " i have good contact super" Shalom

Here is something from within Gaza that shows that even with the Israeli bombing, not all Palestinians from within the territory beleive in what Hamas is doing. It goes to show that even they are divided with their emotions and feelings too! Guess the sentiments run high on both sides of the fence. He was very brave to speak out.

AHMED, in Nuseirat refugee camp
There is no mutual accord between Hamas and Israel in this ceasefire - each side has its own truce and conditions. So people think the violence might start again, once Barack Obama has been inaugurated as US president.

Everything has stopped now, apart from the drones circling 200m above our heads, round and round. It's a constant buzzing noise, very wearing.



It's like an adventure for Hamas, but people's lives are not a game




Yesterday was great though, people began to get back to normal.

The Hamas statements in the media, 'We didn't leave our homes, we will stay on in our broken houses, in a tent if we have to' are nonsense. There is so much suffering.

Why tease Israel, why play with fire? It's like an adventure for Hamas, but people's lives are not a game. Why bring about this war? It's not to open the crossings, because that can be achieved by the Palestinian Authority and Egypt.

What's the point of making enemies with Israel? Israeli people can be good, we can live with them. But the amount of hatred here in Gaza, both for Israel and for Hamas... yes, hatred for both. You can feel it.

My family is divided over who to blame for this. My mother blames Israel for responding so harshly. The other members of my family blame Hamas for all this. But these views are for indoors only, no one must hear them outside.

When someone speaks out, Hamas are afraid, so they shut him up using force. Former Soviet leader Joseph Stalin used the same techniques.

A couple of days ago they shot someone in the legs here in Nuseirat camp, after he made jokes about the Hamas interior minister, Said Siyam being killed in a strike. Fatah people especially hated him.

Hamas has its spies who overheard him and they told the head of the intelligence services!

After they shot his legs, the man was shouting 'God bless Hamas!', so they wouldn't kill him. They left him bleeding in the street in the dark, and people only rescued him after the gunmen had gone.

We must stop playing these dirty games. Palestinian and Israeli residents should visit each other to discuss and explain things, the situation can't be solved by the leaders.

If we don't move forward, things will move backwards to violence, and very soon, I'm sure.



MUHAMMAD ABUSHABAN, in central Gaza City

Here is something from within Gaza that shows that even with the Israeli bombing, not all Palestinians from within the territory beleive in what Hamas is doing. It goes to show that even they are divided with their emotions and feelings too! Guess the sentiments run high on both sides of the fence. He was very brave to speak out.

Just to add and for your information..unfortunately in Gaza alone
they're more than 1000 spy's are working with the Israeli Occupation army.. they sold their souls land and People for
money and sometimes for promises to help them find works in USA CANADA and many... so in Israelis point of view they are Brave Heroes..

Hmams fired a rockets and that's no one denied it but why?

not to tease israil cuz Israil do not need to be tease cuz since
1948 they did not stop killing civilians..hamas and the Palestine's resistant groups did fire to respond and end occupation..and that's their rights writeen in all religions and constitutes..

Gorge Washington became a hero cuz was fighting the English occupation and are many like him just read the history before
you sleep...

Lillylady -

Again - I think you keep on getting mixed-up -
I have not seen anyone posting here that Hamas is the best solution for representing the Palestinians -
but one thing is sure - it happens to be a reaction to the sealing off the Gaza Strip - leaving its people trapped, supplies, water, food and medicine only at the "goodwill" of Israel, raiding any time houses, arresting People without record or trial. And don´t say they are all terrorists - they are not ! You know how they are treated in Israels prison ? Get reports from Amnisty !

I am sure also you know that Israels land seizures, oppressions and direct attacks (also from settlers on occupied land) go way back to the very beginning of their history - Palestinan´s always where a playball in Middle East politics, started by the British and then the Zionists wanting to "create the greater of great Israel", Palestinians only naturally where fed-up of the constant humilation and suffering in this way. Unfortunately Hamas is a product of that treatment, and somehow it seems Israel has been rather intrigued by their "luck to blame someone" enabeling going on and on - paying only lipservice for real talks - and not accepting Hamas in it.
Also, if you would make an effort to look at the maps and the walls being build always further into whats left of the Palestinian territory - would you say that this is a given right to create the "Greater Israel" by expelling and bulldozing people out of their homes and ancesters land ?
If you like I will give you plenty of ORIGINAL HISTORIC STATEMENTS way back in time of the Zionist movement -

you give them the right answer

If it was a false statement, why did Egypt and Saudi both sign the treaties allowing the continuation of Israel.

Why, if you are correct and Israel has not right to be, have the rest of the Arab countries not forced Israel out, and not just now but 60 odd years ago when they were nothing like as well organised as now.
It would seem to me that as they accepted the British hand in setting up Israel, then you should also, if you disagreed with the 1948 resolution then so be it, but it is and remains, in place.