Poll: The Army Is A Shambles Should We Get The Soldiers Home

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trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Nov 15, 2008 : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

created by: trish123 | Nov 15, 2008

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82 votes

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I cant remember if it was here in the UK forum that I commented a few months ago about soldiers complaining they dont have enough kit but heres another one anyway........

Army officer 'told of kit shortage'

A heroic officer killed in Afghanistan complained of equipment shortages to his fiancee just days before his death in a firefight, it was revealed.

Captain David Hicks, who received the Military Cross for gallantry, told his partner Nicola Billen his men were "sitting ducks" for the Taliban at their makeshift base. In letters and conversations, he repeatedly spoke of his "frustration" that demands for kit went unheeded.

Miss Billen told the Daily Telegraph Capt Hicks had not specified what they were missing, but said: "I keep asking for things and I'm not getting them".

Blaming a helicopter shortage - which hit supplies so badly that on one occasion they had to stop firing mortar rounds to preserve ammunition - he added: "It is ridiculous that we have to make do."

On several occasions the 26-year-old had asked for a doctor for be sent to the remote Inkerman base, north of the volatile town of Sangin, because they were being attacked twice a day by the Taliban. But it was not until he was killed in a battle with the enemy on August 11 last year that a doctor was permanently stationed at the base.

Earlier this week, the coroner at Capt Hicks's inquest criticised the Ministry of Defence for forcing troops to "make do".

In a letter to 32-year-old Miss Billen, just two days before he was killed as he tried bravely to locate Taliban positions, Capt Hicks wrote: "It still remains pretty busy at the minute with a few niggling problems that concern me but I won't go into them now."

The officer, of 1st Battalion Royal Anglians, was in charge of 60 men at the outpost. On the morning Capt Hicks died was he was devastated that a fellow Royal Anglian, Pte Tony Rawson, had been killed the day before. In a final phone call to Miss Billen, minutes before he was killed, he said: "I'm not taking any unnecessary risks but we are being attacked twice a day - it's just too much, we can't keep going like this."

Miss Billen said: "Then we started talking about other things and then the explosion went off and he said 'Sweetheart I have got to go. I will speak to you later I love you'."

Capt Hicks was hit by a shell as he tried to locate enemy position from the top of a sangar observation platform. He could have returned to the UK weeks before his death as he had handed in his resignation, but chose to stay on until his six-month tour was finished.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:04 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

What was all that rubbish about on Remembrance Day?

If they cant even kit out the lads who are over there right now it really makes a mockery of ceremonies that tell us how much they care - thats a bit sick if you ask me really...........

Theres rumblings in the news today about sending even more lads out, of course at the moment this is being denied.........

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:12 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

We should pull out of both threatres ( Iraq nd Afghanistan)

Given all the latest statistics that say the people want us to the government should have by now insisted that others in the United nations allianace who are not pulling their weight should take over the roles we are now allegedly there for.
We should not even wast time with more talk and just get out NOW

The Yanks are rumoured to be sending even more canon fodder there after Obama takes office next year.

We have been up their bloody arse since B liar under illegal terms.
I think Brown was in agreement and thus has not got the guts to pull out now for corrupt reasons.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:26 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

mike1937: We should pull out of both threatres ( Iraq nd Afghanistan)

Given all the latest statistics that say the people want us to the government should have by now insisted that others in the United nations allianace who are not pulling their weight should take over the roles we are now allegedly there for.
We should not even wast time with more talk and just get out NOW

The Yanks are rumoured to be sending even more canon fodder there after Obama takes office next year.

We have been up their bloody arse since B liar under illegal terms.
I think Brown was in agreement and thus has not got the guts to pull out now for corrupt reasons.

Agreed Mike

Theres a lot of money being made from these wars - pity none of it is getting spent on the poor guys on the front lines.........

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:32 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: What was all that rubbish about on Remembrance Day?

If they cant even kit out the lads who are over there right now it really makes a mockery of ceremonies that tell us how much they care - thats a bit sick if you ask me really...........

Theres rumblings in the news today about sending even more lads out, of course at the moment this is being denied.........

Trish - Please do not mock remembrance day.
Many older than you whose family members died in the last war to preserve our freedom to say our piece NOW deserve the rights to remember them every year. -

I lost four in WW2 - Three in the RAF, all decorated pilots and a PO in the Navy on a destroyer in the Atlantic protecting the convoys from the U boats.

We also remember it first hand and I especially have a duty to observe it IMO especially having taken the queens shilling myself with pride in the RAF at the time when we could all be proud of all our developments.

We all know that politicians are hypocrites and the MOD sabotaged the lads there now but people who lost relatives are not guilty so keep them out of the discussion !!
I have a serving relative too who is a lance corporal signaller who could be sent out anytime now - Chewing the fat here is not productive - lobby YOUR MP.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:40 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

mike1937: Trish - Please do not mock remembrance day.
Many older than you whose family members died in the last war to preserve our freedom to say our piece NOW deserve the rights to remember them every year. -

I lost four in WW2 - Three in the RAF, all decorated pilots and a PO in the Navy on a destroyer in the Atlantic protecting the convoys from the U boats.

We also remember it first hand and I especially have a duty to observe it IMO especially having taken the queens shilling myself with pride in the RAF at the time when we could all be proud of all our developments.

We all know that politicians are hypocrites and the MOD sabotaged the lads there now but people who lost relatives are not guilty so keep them out of the discussion !!
I have a serving relative too who is a lance corporal signaller who could be sent out anytime now - Chewing the fat here is not productive - lobby YOUR MP.

Will answer the rest of your post in a sec Mike but just want you to know that Im not mocking rememdrance day in the least - I cry my eyes out every time I see the ceremony - every year........ my comment was about the government making a mockery of their own soldiers - no way would I ever EVER mock such a serious matter..........

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:45 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

mike1937: Trish - Please do not mock remembrance day.
Many older than you whose family members died in the last war to preserve our freedom to say our piece NOW deserve the rights to remember them every year. -

I lost four in WW2 - Three in the RAF, all decorated pilots and a PO in the Navy on a destroyer in the Atlantic protecting the convoys from the U boats.

We also remember it first hand and I especially have a duty to observe it IMO especially having taken the queens shilling myself with pride in the RAF at the time when we could all be proud of all our developments.

We all know that politicians are hypocrites and the MOD sabotaged the lads there now but people who lost relatives are not guilty so keep them out of the discussion !!
I have a serving relative too who is a lance corporal signaller who could be sent out anytime now - Chewing the fat here is not productive - lobby YOUR MP.

I can only reitterate Mike - I am not mocking Remembrance Day.........

I used to go to the ceremony with my Dad every year, he was in the Cheshires in WW11 - he would never speak of his experiences of war other than to say how much he missed some of the lads he grew up with who had died - i grew up thinking of war as amongst the cruellest of trials to be visited on the masses - cannon fodder.......

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:54 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: What was all that rubbish about on Remembrance Day?

If they cant even kit out the lads who are over there right now it really makes a mockery of ceremonies that tell us how much they care - thats a bit sick if you ask me really...........

Theres rumblings in the news today about sending even more lads out, of course at the moment this is being denied.........

OK, guess Id better explain this a bit better Mike.

I meant that all the care and concern and the prime minister serving sandwiches to the three remaining veterans of WW1 counts for naught in the face of the failure to kit out the current troops - it puts the lie to their care and concern when there are calls from commanders for better kit which are being ingnored by the 'powers that be' - my criticism is of the 'powers that be' Mike.........

I do hope this is clear now.........

rizlared ., Shanghai China

Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:05 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: OK, guess Id better explain this a bit better Mike.

I meant that all the care and concern and the prime minister serving sandwiches to the three remaining veterans of WW1 counts for naught in the face of the failure to kit out the current troops - it puts the lie to their care and concern when there are calls from commanders for better kit which are being ingnored by the 'powers that be' - my criticism is of the 'powers that be' Mike.........

I do hope this is clear now.........

I see where your coming from Trish, and agree, it's not the remembrance service at fault, its the hypocrisy that attaches itself to such, like the fact the Government has taken 50+ years to recognise the bravery of the Gurkha's and actually allow them to live here in peace.

Instead of bailing out the rich cats of the banking world, what a great use of that money if it went to ensure our troops had all the equipment they needed when in troubled areas.

I also agree with Mike, we have done what we can in Afghan and Iraq, bring them all back to a heros welcome.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:13 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

rizlared: I see where your coming from Trish, and agree, it's not the remembrance service at fault, its the hypocrisy that attaches itself to such, like the fact the Government has taken 50+ years to recognise the bravery of the Gurkha's and actually allow them to live here in peace.

Instead of bailing out the rich cats of the banking world, what a great use of that money if it went to ensure our troops had all the equipment they needed when in troubled areas.

I also agree with Mike, we have done what we can in Afghan and Iraq, bring them all back to a heros welcome.

Yes, Dad used to really praise the Ghurkas, after fighting alongside them he said they were the bravest of the brave - I was happy too when they finally got recognition - but that they had been denied this by successive governments is another indication of how little value is actually, realistically assigned to the guys on the front lines...........

Yes, just a time fraction of the money from the bailout debacle would have possibly saved the lives of some of that number of 33 deaths which was reached this week.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:14 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: Yes, Dad used to really praise the Ghurkas, after fighting alongside them he said they were the bravest of the brave - I was happy too when they finally got recognition - but that they had been denied this by successive governments is another indication of how little value is actually, realistically assigned to the guys on the front lines...........

Yes, just a tiny fraction of the money from the bailout debacle would have possibly saved the lives of some of that number of 33 deaths which was reached this week.

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:14 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

bugg*r 300 deaths..........

rizlared ., Shanghai China

Sat Nov 15, 2008 5:27 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: bugg*r 300 deaths..........

1 is 1 too many, but I get your drift

Sat Nov 15, 2008 6:53 AM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: OK, guess Id better explain this a bit better Mike.

I meant that all the care and concern and the prime minister serving sandwiches to the three remaining veterans of WW1 counts for naught in the face of the failure to kit out the current troops - it puts the lie to their care and concern when there are calls from commanders for better kit which are being ingnored by the 'powers that be' - my criticism is of the 'powers that be' Mike.........

I do hope this is clear now.........

OK thanks Trish - Its just that I have always got hot under the collar when I think someone might be forgetting or overlooking - I agree with what Rizla mentioned too, re the Ghurkha's and the appaling way the government of Thatcher, Major, B LIAR and Brown have treated them.

The finest people in the world to serve alongside, according to ex Army mates here who have served with them.

gillyloves69 london, Inner London, England UK

Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:35 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: What was all that rubbish about on Remembrance Day?

If they cant even kit out the lads who are over there right now it really makes a mockery of ceremonies that tell us how much they care - thats a bit sick if you ask me really...........

Theres rumblings in the news today about sending even more lads out, of course at the moment this is being denied.........

i agree with every fucking word you say trish !

its disgracefull !

i'm not happy with the way surviving soldiers are being treated either

uptall durham, Durham, England UK

Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:46 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

gillyloves69: i agree with every fucking word you say trish !

its disgracefull !

i'm not happy with the way surviving soldiers are being treated either

agree with all that...Hi..gilly mate how ya doin

...................................................

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:51 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

gillyloves69: i agree with every fucking word you say trish !

its disgracefull !

i'm not happy with the way surviving soldiers are being treated either

Hiya Gilly Hun

Its a good poll - 21 people voted in agreement

Thats better than the poll in the Guardian - that one was only 68% - this is 100%

trish123 Lancashire, Lancashire, England UK

Sun Nov 16, 2008 3:51 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

uptall: agree with all that...Hi..gilly mate how ya doin
...................................................

Hi....

Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:08 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

gillyloves69: i agree with every fucking word you say trish !

its disgracefull !

i'm not happy with the way surviving soldiers are being treated either

Gilly
You are an ex Soldier so get in touch with your regimental association, Combat stress and your MP - I note we are 100% on this matter by the vote so avery record of any discussion MIGHT have some sway.

I have protested to the local MP at public meetings more than once, written to the Minister, got no reply and so has my Bro in law - He is also a Briigadier who went through the ranks, ex 16th Brigader Para, RTC, ADC to HMQ, ex CEO Combat Stress and still serves on the War pensions board who have lately been agitating for all ex serveces conditions as well as pensions and he stirs the shit up.

They have only just managed to do anything for the Ghurkha's long belated and highly deserved pension, let alone anything for our lads of all the services.

I am just as disgusted with both of the Scots bastards now in Downing street and the whole of NEW LABOUR - They are NOT listening to anything the people say on any matter - It is too serious and needs a mutiny by the forces and if they are not careful I suggest there could be a civil war too, like the police suggested when he tories were in power and were following the same dogma.

Mike Dennis Broadstairs - I will put my money where my mouth is on any protest

uptall durham, Durham, England UK

Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:09 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

trish123: Hi....

....Hi..trish....hows the art work goin..

.

...

Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:35 PM CST : The Army Is A Shambles - Should We Get The Soldiers Home

Does that inclide the British Soldiers stationed in the North of Ireland too?

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