Terrorism - the definition ( Archived) (108)

Apr 18, 2012 1:51 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
Kofi Annan;

""Among my specific proposals in this area, I ask all states to complete, sign and implement the comprehensive convention on terrorism, based on a clear and agreed definition, as well as the convention on nuclear terrorism and the fissile material cut-off treaty,” he added.

The report backs the definition of terrorism – an issue so divisive agreement on it has long eluded the world community – as any action “intended to cause death or serious bodily harm to civilians or non-combatants with the purpose of intimidating a population or compelling a government or an international organization to do or abstain from doing any act. ""

So that's his, Bruce Hoffman (see creds below) has a list of what the criteria is to define terrorism.

On page 41 of his book 'Inside terrorism, 2 ed., Columbia University Press, 2006' he writes that what differentiates a terrorist from a criminal is that the act is;

""- ineluctably political in aims and motives
- violent – or, equally important, threatens violence
- designed to have far-reaching psychological repercussions beyond the immediate victim or target
- conducted by an organization with an identifiable chain of command or conspiratorial cell structure (whose members wear no uniform or identifying insignia) and
- perpetrated by a subnational group or non-state entity""

As for why people are so quick to call any violent act 'terrorism' he also writes on page 32;

""On one point, at least, everyone agrees: terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. What is called terrorism,' Brian Jenkins has written, 'thus seems to depend on one's point of view. Use of the term implies a moral judgment; and if one party can successfully attach the label terrorist to its opponent, then it has indirectly persuaded others to adopt its moral viewpoint.' Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization terrorist becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned. If one identifies with the victim of the violence, for example, then the act is terrorism. If, however, one identifies with the perpetrator, the violent act is regarded in a more sympathetic, if not positive (or, at the worst, an ambivalent) light; and it is not terrorism.""

Then there is state terrorism. Acts such as the German Bombing of London or the bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima which might fall under this as they fit Hoffman's criteria to affect political change however, they were at the time conducted by uniformed national entities.

In any case, normally a nation does not conduct terrorism as it instead conducts warfare within legal boundaries and, uses force rather than terror to implement it's will with terror as an unnecessary by product rather than the prime motive.

So, my question is, what is your widely accepted definition for terrorism?

""Professor Bruce Hoffman has been studying terrorism and insurgency for more than thirty years. He is currently Director of the Center for Peace and Security Studies, Director of the Security Studies Program, and a tenured professor at Georgetown University’s Edmund A. Walsh School of Foreign Service, Washington, DC. Professor Hoffman previously held the Corporate Chair in Counterterrorism and Counterinsurgency at the RAND Corporation and was also Director of RAND’s Washington, D.C. Office. From 2001 to 2004, he served as RAND’s Vice President for External Affairs and in 2004 he also was Acting Director of RAND’s Center for Middle East Public Policy. ""
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Apr 18, 2012 2:13 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
no just my thoughts, something i've often wondered about, the VC won

Some people think that enemies should stand out in the open and get themselves killed, think terrorists think better to ensure a high price is paid
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Apr 18, 2012 2:17 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
robplum: no just my thoughts, something i've often wondered about, the VC won

Some people think that enemies should stand out in the open and get themselves killed, think terrorists think better to ensure a high price is paid
'cause you had to fight with one Hand tied behind your back?
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Apr 18, 2012 2:19 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
robplum: no just my thoughts, something i've often wondered about, the VC won

Some people think that enemies should stand out in the open and get themselves killed, think terrorists think better to ensure a high price is paid


A terrorist is s soldier of sorts as he or she serves a political master same as legitimate troops. They attack those who are weakest in order to propagate a message that nobody is safe so that others like the victims either demand action from the government to safe guard them or, lose confidence in their ability to do so. In either case, the government is weakened so that the political end of the terrorist's leaders can exploit the chaos.

Terrorism is a means, not an end.
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Apr 18, 2012 2:23 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost: Kofi Annan;

""Among my specific proposals in this area, I ask all states to complete, sign and implement the comprehensive convention on terrorism, based on a clear and agreed definition, as well as the convention on nuclear terrorism and the fissile material cut-off treaty,” he added.

The report backs the definition of terrorism – an issue so divisive agreement on it has long eluded the world community – as any action “intended to cause death or serious bodily harm to civilians or non-combatants with the purpose of intimidating a population or compelling a government or an international organization to do or abstain from doing any act. ""

So that's his, Bruce Hoffman (see creds below) has a list of what the criteria is to define terrorism.

On page 41 of his book 'Inside terrorism, 2 ed., Columbia University Press, 2006' he writes that what differentiates a terrorist from a criminal is that the act is;

""- ineluctably political in aims and motives
- violent – or, equally important, threatens violence
- designed to have far-reaching psychological repercussions beyond the immediate victim or target
- conducted by an organization with an identifiable chain of command or conspiratorial cell structure (whose members wear no uniform or identifying insignia) and
- perpetrated by a subnational group or non-state entity""

As for why people are so quick to call any violent act 'terrorism' he also writes on page 32;

""On one point, at least, everyone agrees: terrorism is a pejorative term. It is a word with intrinsically negative connotations that is generally applied to one's enemies and opponents, or to those with whom one disagrees and would otherwise prefer to ignore. What is called terrorism,' Brian Jenkins has written, 'thus seems to depend on one's point of view. Use of the term implies a moral judgment; and if one party can successfully attach the label terrorist to its opponent, then it has indirectly persuaded others to adopt its moral viewpoint.' Hence the decision to call someone or label some organization terrorist becomes almost unavoidably subjective, depending largely on whether one sympathizes with or opposes the person/group/cause concerned. If one identifies with the victim of the violence, for example, then the act is terrorism. If, however, one identifies with the perpetrator, the violent act is regarded in a more sympathetic, if not positive (or, at the worst, an ambivalent) light; and it is not terrorism.""

Then there is state terrorism. Acts such as the German Bombing of London or the bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima which might fall under this as they fit Hoffman's criteria to affect political change however, they were at the time conducted by uniformed national entities.

In any case, normally a nation does not conduct terrorism as it instead conducts warfare within legal boundaries and, uses force rather than terror to implement it's will with terror as an unnecessary by product rather than the prime motive.

So, my question is, what is your widely accepted definition for terrorism?

""Professor Bruce Hoffman has been studying terrorism and insurgency for more than thirty years. He is currently Director of the Center for Peace and Security Studies, Director of the Security Studies Program, and a tenured professor at Georgetown University’s Edmund A. Walsh School of Foreign Service, Washington, DC. Professor Hoffman previously held the Corporate Chair in Counterterrorism and Counterinsurgency at the RAND Corporation and was also Director of RAND’s Washington, D.C. Office. From 2001 to 2004, he served as RAND’s Vice President for External Affairs and in 2004 he also was Acting Director of RAND’s Center for Middle East Public Policy. ""
terrorism Defination . To become a wild Animal /evil and Kill the Poor Peoples for the self benefits .Story end
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Apr 18, 2012 2:23 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
cause is as much political as anything else, who ever heard of a soldier starting a war
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Apr 18, 2012 2:24 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
bestbefore
bestbeforebestbeforesomewhere, Dorset, England UK116 Threads 2 Polls 4,701 Posts
Albertaghost: A terrorist is s soldier of sorts as he or she serves a political master same as legitimate troops. They attack those who are weakest in order to propagate a message that nobody is safe so that others like the victims either demand action from the government to safe guard them or, lose confidence in their ability to do so. In either case, the government is weakened so that the political end of the terrorist's leaders can exploit the chaos.

Terrorism is a means, not an end.


Well isn't that what Breivek was doing,sending a message to his Government.

He certainly terrorised his innocent victims.sigh
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Apr 18, 2012 2:25 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
oh i suppose they in Africa but there is usually politics involved
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Apr 18, 2012 2:27 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
he was a Norwegian Soldier, probably believed what there army told him
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Apr 18, 2012 2:27 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
ali110: terrorism Defination . To become a wild Animal /evil and Kill the Poor Peoples for the self benefits .Story end


And that widely accepted definition is found where?
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Apr 18, 2012 2:28 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
robplum: oh i suppose they in Africa but there is usually politics involved
thumbs up
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Apr 18, 2012 2:28 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
bestbefore: Well isn't that what Breivek was doing,sending a message to his Government.

He certainly terrorised his innocent victims.


What message BB? 'Better do as I say or I won't eat breakfast?'
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Apr 18, 2012 2:32 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
robplum: he was a Norwegian Soldier, probably believed what there army told him
actually he wasn't!
Never served a day in the Norwegian Forces!


Breivik was exempt from conscription to military service in the Norwegian Army and has no military training. The Norwegian Defence Security Department, which conducts the vetting process, say he was deemed "unfit for service" at the mandatory conscript assessment.WIKI
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Apr 18, 2012 2:34 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
bestbefore: Well isn't that what Breivek was doing,sending a message to his Government.

He certainly terrorised his innocent victims.


""designed to have far-reaching psychological repercussions beyond the immediate victim or target""

Scaring the bejeesus out of kids is not furthering a terrorists goals. He or she has to be able or intent to garner a government change. In this case, Breivek was not a terrorist. Certainly scaring people is the same as terrorizing the victims but in order to be a terrorist as per a widely accepted definition you have to be within a definition. Scaring the heck out of people with actions is not necessarily terrorism but could be wild driving patterns, a threatening letter from the IRS, a bully in a bar or a legal letter from your ex's lawyer. None of which have a political end for a third party to react to out of fear.
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Apr 18, 2012 2:37 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
bestbefore
bestbeforebestbeforesomewhere, Dorset, England UK116 Threads 2 Polls 4,701 Posts
Albertaghost: What message BB? 'Better do as I say or I won't eat breakfast?'



Watch the trial.The only time he cried was when they showed the video that he had produced as a right wing extremist.

911 in reverse, except this was a one man band.
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Apr 18, 2012 2:37 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
before i went to Vietnam i was told the VC mostly just had pitch forks and sharp sticks and were nothing to worry about. In reality they carried better weapons than the American Infantry, the AK47 which fired a rimless round, they could use SEATO ammo but our side couldn't use there's, they had shoulder fired anti-aircraft rockets, mines, lots of drugs to pass out and a will to fight and die for there cause

any army that under estimates disrespects there enemy probably loose
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Apr 18, 2012 2:40 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Conrad73: actually he wasn't!
Never served a day in the Norwegian Forces!Breivik was exempt from conscription to military service in the Norwegian Army and has no military training. The Norwegian Defence Security Department, which conducts the vetting process, say he was deemed "unfit for service" at the mandatory conscript assessment.WIKI

I guess they would denie that however he looked pretty good in the photos of him in his uniform
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Apr 18, 2012 2:43 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
bestbefore: Watch the trial.The only time he cried was when they showed the video that he had produced as a right wing extremist.

911 in reverse, except this was a one man band.


So it was not conducted by ......

""an organization with an identifiable chain of command or conspiratorial cell structure (whose members wear no uniform or identifying insignia) and
- perpetrated by a subnational group or non-state entity""

Hmmm. Sounds like it was a one man show and the guy is now in jail getting his cheeks spread by guards looking for contraband. Not much of a threat to the government is he?

So much for Annan's definition of conducting for ""the purpose of intimidating a population or compelling a government or an international organization to do or abstain from doing any act. ""
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Apr 18, 2012 2:46 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
added this to My Documents in January!

The UN in 2004 said """criminal acts, including against civilians, committed with the intent to cause death or serious bodily injury, or taking of hostages, with the purpose to provoke a state of terror in the general public or in a group of persons or particular persons, intimidate a population or compel a government or an international organization to do or to abstain from doing any act, which constitute offences within the scope of and as defined in the international conventions and protocols relating to terrorism, are under no circumstances justifiable by considerations of a political, philosophical, ideological, racial, ethnic, religious or other similar nature,"""

Those with military power do not need to intimidate as they can force, a military does not need to create a state of terror as they can force the desired action and the key is 'criminal action' which is no such when it is approved by a Status of Forces Agreement but is not when the insurgents are using the above actions against a civilian population.


Still think Breivik ought to be prosecuted as a common Murderer!
Would deprive him of the Circus he's turning his Trial into!
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Apr 18, 2012 2:52 AM CST Terrorism - the definition
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
Conrad73: Still think Breivik ought to be prosecuted as a common Murderer!
Would deprive him of the Circus he's turning his Trial into!


Gets worse Conrad. Once he beats the terrorism charge he gets a second trial as a murderer and, gets to take the crazy test all over again.
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