The Bible and the snake ( Archived) (60)

Jun 13, 2012 9:26 AM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
As I'm really an agnostic for now, whether the creature or entity we call God exist or not, is something of which I do not have any say on, as well as the rest of the creatures and events that are written about in the Bible, or any other religious book, I do not know, and I reject "knowledge" about it.

I can, however, think of a few things that would deserve and make sense of the use of the word God, things that aren't things, not reachable by thought, similarly as the essence of nothing, and is universal, as in the right sense of the word "itself".

I do believe that the Bible, however, as well as other books like it, has potentially profound meanings which can be extracted from the text.

So, I came to think about the snake, in the story of Adam and Eve. What is this creature all about? and how can it be related to us, if at all? or is it a coincidence or a symbol, not a relation?


If that is not the case, thank you for reading. If that is the case, what does it mean?
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Jun 13, 2012 11:06 AM CST The Bible and the snake
Boban1
Boban1Boban1bigplace, Central Serbia Serbia144 Threads 5 Polls 18,789 Posts
Im just speculating here :
Lucifer was the leader of the rebellion against God .The heavenly army led by archangel Michael expelled Lucifer from Eden
Lucifer took the likeness of the snake to tempt humans and doubt their faith
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Jun 13, 2012 11:18 AM CST The Bible and the snake
Boy67
Boy67Boy67Cyprus, Limassol Cyprus379 Posts
olaix: As I'm really an agnostic for now, whether the creature or entity we call God exist or not, is something of which I do not have any say on, as well as the rest of the creatures and events that are written about in the Bible, or any other religious book, I do not know, and I reject "knowledge" about it.

I can, however, think of a few things that would deserve and make sense of the use of the word God, things that aren't things, not reachable by thought, similarly as the essence of nothing, and is universal, as in the right sense of the word "itself".

I do believe that the Bible, however, as well as other books like it, has potentially profound meanings which can be extracted from the text.

So, I came to think about the snake, in the story of Adam and Eve. What is this creature all about? and how can it be related to us, if at all? or is it a coincidence or a symbol, not a relation?If that is not the case, thank you for reading. If that is the case, what does it mean?
SNAKE, the bible most probably is talking about the woman.
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Jun 13, 2012 12:01 PM CST The Bible and the snake
temptation as doing wrong, is the snake. do we know the results of doing wrong in life?
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Jun 13, 2012 4:51 PM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
Boban1: Im just speculating here :
Lucifer was the leader of the rebellion against God .The heavenly army led by archangel Michael expelled Lucifer from Eden
Lucifer took the likeness of the snake to tempt humans and doubt their faith


What exactly is Lucifer?
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Jun 13, 2012 7:41 PM CST The Bible and the snake
stringman
stringmanstringmanwallaceburg, Ontario Canada649 Threads 1 Polls 7,049 Posts
olaix: What exactly is Lucifer?
lucifer was a angel in heaven but thought he was more powerful than God so a battle came about in heaven and he lost and cased out of heaven down to earth where he is decieving man kind. the old story good and evil.
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Jun 14, 2012 12:54 AM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
stringman: lucifer was a angel in heaven but thought he was more powerful than God so a battle came about in heaven and he lost and cased out of heaven down to earth where he is decieving man kind. the old story good and evil.


How about its nature?
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Jun 14, 2012 3:51 AM CST The Bible and the snake
Boban1
Boban1Boban1bigplace, Central Serbia Serbia144 Threads 5 Polls 18,789 Posts
olaix: What exactly is Lucifer?

well Im not sure as I found him under different names in various mythologies and religions
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Jun 15, 2012 11:37 PM CST The Bible and the snake
Boy67: SNAKE, the bible most probably is talking about the woman.


...wouldn't a snake indicate phallic imagery?
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Jun 16, 2012 10:03 AM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
Abagail: As Oscar Wilde said, " I can resist anything, but temptation". He wasn't talking about women at the time.

Firstly ... Hello Olaix, it's nice to see you are still inciting us to think. With your title, it reminds me a little of the scene in Harry Potter where Nagini's (the snake-like creature)venom was the deciding factor in destroying the book that held such control. Whilst Harry Potter is simply a child's book, for entertainment purposes... So is the Original Sin story. Entertaining,but one could hardly take it literally.


Hi Abigail

Actually, I didn't think about the Original Sin, but knowledge. I think the word sin got attached to it because at some point it was believed to be a choice. Knowledge, that is.

Evolutionary, one of the first pieces of knowledge humans got, must have been about death, which lead to hurt and fear. These are still human traits, and they are similar across the globe (like a hungry man from Asia are hungry the same way you and I are hungry), and creates disorder in oneself, society, in the nation, and across the globe. We are not understanding them, I think, but both are used for an end in the various wars that are going on at the moment.

The Bible being very old, and hints several places towards knowledge to transcend these two things, as well as social science of the time, that may actually have been the point of it before various groups of authorities made it their instrument (which basically meant that they had all been eating apples for years then preaching bad apples to their people).

But what do I know grin nice to see you back
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Jun 16, 2012 6:25 PM CST The Bible and the snake
To some degree, knowledge is a choice. Some people seek it out, hungrily... They aspire to understand everything. They listen, they take on board what they have heard and they still research that. Passed on knowledge is often quite distorted, and yet... few people research it, trusting the recipient of the information to know their facts. This is where we get tied up with politics, often if a politician has a silver tongue, he will be more successful than a better candidate. ( Except in Australia's case, where our Prime Minister has a voice like nails across a blackboard)

Reading a book by Michael Shermer recently, I can directly take a quote from it here... " We are taught what to think, not how to think".

It really is nice to see you are still around. hug
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Jun 18, 2012 10:28 AM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
Abagail: To some degree, knowledge is a choice. Some people seek it out, hungrily... They aspire to understand everything. They listen, they take on board what they have heard and they still research that. Passed on knowledge is often quite distorted, and yet... few people research it, trusting the recipient of the information to know their facts. This is where we get tied up with politics, often if a politician has a silver tongue, he will be more successful than a better candidate. ( Except in Australia's case, where our Prime Minister has a voice like nails across a blackboard)

Reading a book by Michael Shermer recently, I can directly take a quote from it here... " We are taught what to think, not how to think".

It really is nice to see you are still around.


I agree with you. There is just one way to find out, and that is to look for the truth yourself. Funnily enough, you don't have to go so far. Finding the truth in oneself is as far as you have to go before things starts to make sense. And in that truth, you find the truth about everything else. That is what, I think, the Bible, and other similar books are trying to tell.

I wish I could tell you the truth, but even that would be, in some sense, distorted information

hug
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Jun 18, 2012 11:15 AM CST The Bible and the snake
Boban1
Boban1Boban1bigplace, Central Serbia Serbia144 Threads 5 Polls 18,789 Posts
olaix: What is the serpent doctrine? and who are the descendants? Didn't Cain get killed, or was it he who killed?


The serpent seed doctrine is a belief based on poor biblical interpretation and superstition. It is a primary doctrinal resource for those who want to use Scriptures to justify racial prejudice.



Cain killed Abel
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Jun 19, 2012 1:55 AM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
Boban1: The serpent seed doctrine is a belief based on poor biblical interpretation and superstition. It is a primary doctrinal resource for those who want to use Scriptures to justify racial prejudice.



Cain killed Abel


grin

There are really many beliefs out there grin
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Jun 19, 2012 9:13 PM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix: I agree with you. There is just one way to find out, and that is to look for the truth yourself. Funnily enough, you don't have to go so far. Finding the truth in oneself is as far as you have to go before things starts to make sense. And in that truth, you find the truth about everything else. That is what, I think, the Bible, and other similar books are trying to tell.

I wish I could tell you the truth, but even that would be, in some sense, distorted information


It's interesting that you bring this up... Michael Shermer believes that the evolutionary model of belief in God was developed by religions, to be used by religions. He defines it as " ...a social institution to create and promote myths, to encourage conformity and altruism, and to signal the level of commitment to cooperate and reciprocate among members of a community."

I find there is nothing wrong with believing that people should behave within the confines of ones community, when it does not stop the individuals from questioning life and therefore learning from it.
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Jun 19, 2012 9:27 PM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix
olaixolaixValhalla, Nordland Norway52 Threads 6 Polls 1,119 Posts
Abagail: It's interesting that you bring this up... Michael Shermer believes that the evolutionary model of belief in God was developed by religions, to be used by religions. He defines it as " ...a social institution to create and promote myths, to encourage conformity and altruism, and to signal the level of commitment to cooperate and reciprocate among members of a community."

I find there is nothing wrong with believing that people should behave within the confines of ones community, when it does not stop the individuals from questioning life and therefore learning from it.


I think he was wrong. The evolution was very gradual, we are amphibians who slowly gained the ability to reflect on objects, and eventually thoughts and ideas. That we have a spiritual part of us, or what word you prefer, is perhaps all we had before we gained the ability to think. The core of spirituality is love. Love is not ours, it comes into our lives in forms of spiritual enlightenment, but also through beauty, courage, compassion as well as love being the only neutral to be the fence in the two sides of justice.

So gradually slipping away, while the mind, with its greed, envy and the other "abominations", fear, desire etc grew in proportion, today, who even believe in love hehehe :) They say some guys in the Bible became almost 1000 years old. I am wondering if you can grow up without maturing. If you can, and the book is about spiritual enlightenment, then also you could mature in a way that potentially could be measured in these ridiculous numbers
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Jun 19, 2012 9:53 PM CST The Bible and the snake
tippaC29
tippaC29tippaC29tipperary, Tipperary Ireland4 Threads 4 Polls 26 Posts
I'm not religious but i think a common interpretation by most Christians is the snake is a metaphor for the temptation of the Devil. Then of course, you have Bible thumping fundamentalists who will believe that a snake actually talked.

The Bible is a book full of metaphors and figurative speech. I've not read it all, nowhere near. Parts of it especially the Old Testament are a very uninteresting read, tedious in parts..

The New Testament being a more readable part of it.
I'm not sure if there is a God or not, but i am open to the possiblity. However i would say God if one exists would not judge a person on wheter they were a Christian or not, or any religion or not, or a believer or not, but rather just see the person as an individual. I think a lot of Christian sects advocate a discriminatory worldview in some sense.
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Jun 19, 2012 9:59 PM CST The Bible and the snake
tippaC29
tippaC29tippaC29tipperary, Tipperary Ireland4 Threads 4 Polls 26 Posts
Also i forgot to add. I agree elements of the Bible have some sound advice even if you are not a Christian. But there are lots of it that are very difficult to understand. It's also been translated many times since it's Hebrew, Greek language.

I believe Jesus is supposed to have spoke Aramaic or something.
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Jun 21, 2012 8:24 PM CST The Bible and the snake
tippaC29: I'm not religious but i think a common interpretation by most Christians is the snake is a metaphor for the temptation of the Devil. Then of course, you have Bible thumping fundamentalists who will believe that a snake actually talked.

The Bible is a book full of metaphors and figurative speech. I've not read it all, nowhere near. Parts of it especially the Old Testament are a very uninteresting read, tedious in parts..

The New Testament being a more readable part of it.
I'm not sure if there is a God or not, but i am open to the possiblity. However i would say God if one exists would not judge a person on wheter they were a Christian or not, or any religion or not, or a believer or not, but rather just see the person as an individual. I think a lot of Christian sects advocate a discriminatory worldview in some sense.


Well he did talk in Jungle Book...http://amfeta.deviantart.com/art/Kaa-Hypnotize-Mowgli-161120827

You are Agnostic. You believe something is out there, so you continue to question and keep an open mind.
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Jun 21, 2012 8:28 PM CST The Bible and the snake
olaix: I think he was wrong. The evolution was very gradual, we are amphibians who slowly gained the ability to reflect on objects, and eventually thoughts and ideas. That we have a spiritual part of us, or what word you prefer, is perhaps all we had before we gained the ability to think. The core of spirituality is love. Love is not ours, it comes into our lives in forms of spiritual enlightenment, but also through beauty, courage, compassion as well as love being the only neutral to be the fence in the two sides of justice.

So gradually slipping away, while the mind, with its greed, envy and the other "abominations", fear, desire etc grew in proportion, today, who even believe in love hehehe :) They say some guys in the Bible became almost 1000 years old. I am wondering if you can grow up without maturing. If you can, and the book is about spiritual enlightenment, then also you could mature in a way that potentially could be measured in these ridiculous numbers


There have been many men who bear testament to the fact that you can grow old without growing up.smile

I also believe that Michael Shermer is onto something. We always seek out a figure head, someone to keep us in control... a figurehead. It's conflicting when politics enters the arena, because there are more figureheads. Although, we are more likely to question a politians omnipotence... When there is no actual figure in front of us, it's really limited to what information has been passed onto us. Making it very much the thing of myths.
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