8 prominent Doctors and scientists ... ( Archived) (191)

Oct 18, 2021 7:26 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Dedovix
DedovixDedovixBig Place, Central Serbia Serbia12 Threads 1 Polls 5,492 Posts
jac_the_gripper: How was that statistic collated?

It's not mentioned in the video.
how was the statistic made? I dont know i can only guess that it`s based on the research of Johns Hopkins ,James, John T. PhD

would you like a link to their claims?
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Oct 18, 2021 7:29 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
Dedovix: how was the statistic made? I dont know i can only guess that it`s based on the research of Johns Hopkins ,James, John T. PhD

would you like a link to their claims?
Yes, please.
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Oct 18, 2021 7:39 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Dedovix
DedovixDedovixBig Place, Central Serbia Serbia12 Threads 1 Polls 5,492 Posts
jac_the_gripper: Yes, please.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/22/medical-errors-third-leading-cause-of-death-in-america.html





for the first link -right click and choose go to
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Oct 18, 2021 7:51 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
bodleing2
bodleing2bodleing2Manchester, Greater Manchester, England UK84 Threads 6,132 Posts
This also appears on their website....

"Based on recommendations from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA), Johns Hopkins Medicine is offering the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine booster to eligible patients and a third dose of Pfizer or Moderna COVID-19 vaccines to eligible patients."
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Oct 18, 2021 9:22 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Selenite
SeleniteSeleniteMálaga, Andalusia Spain59 Threads 1 Polls 6,299 Posts
jac_the_gripper: What does that mean, the virus hasn't been 'isolated'?
Found this 'fact checker' which says the virus HAS been isolated but which sheds some light on what the Health Minister said here in Spain which was not totally clear ...

You can find the exact steps of what isolating virus entails on any internet virology site ...

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Oct 18, 2021 9:47 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
Selenite: Found this 'fact checker' which says the virus HAS been isolated but which sheds some light on what the Health Minister said here in Spain which was not totally clear ...

You can find the exact steps of what isolating virus entails on any internet virology site ...

I know what I understand to be the meaning of a virus being 'isolated', I was wondering what other people thought it meant.

I don't understand how people can think that vaccines can be produced and variants can be identified without identifying the virus. dunno

How can claims be made that covid leaked from the Wuhan lab, or is a bioweapon, etc. if the virus has never been isolated, identified, nor seen in any way?

It's important to recognise inconsistencies when filtering information.
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Oct 18, 2021 9:55 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
mikey4691
mikey4691mikey4691Knoxville, Tennessee USA8 Threads 6,868 Posts
Selenite: Found this 'fact checker' which says the virus HAS been isolated but which sheds some light on what the Health Minister said here in Spain which was not totally clear ...

You can find the exact steps of what isolating virus entails on any internet virology site ...

Beware the fact checkers... uh oh Especially one associated facebook...
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Oct 18, 2021 10:06 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Selenite
SeleniteSeleniteMálaga, Andalusia Spain59 Threads 1 Polls 6,299 Posts
jac_the_gripper: I know what I understand to be the meaning of a virus being 'isolated', I was wondering what other people thought it meant.

I don't understand how people can think that vaccines can be produced and variants can be identified without identifying the virus.

How can claims be made that covid leaked from the Wuhan lab, or is a bioweapon, etc. if the virus has never been isolated, identified, nor seen in any way?

It's important to recognise inconsistencies when filtering information.
All of that can happen when one has lost all trust in the people running their countries ...

Recognising inconsistencies when filtering information (from their own government and others) is exactely what many people have been doing. And it has proved very confusing for many. In my case, the fact that the news outlets and scientific information released by the 3 countries that are part of my family lineage of 4 generations, did not match from country to country. Some of my family members were being told one thing (in France) others totally different information (in the UK) and me yet some more different information (in Spain) ...
Surely science is science whichever country you live in!?
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Oct 18, 2021 10:07 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Selenite
SeleniteSeleniteMálaga, Andalusia Spain59 Threads 1 Polls 6,299 Posts
mikey4691: Beware the fact checkers... Especially one associated facebook...
I know...
Was pleased I'd found the words that the Health Minister has pronounced in Spain... Again each can draw their own conclusions ...
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Oct 18, 2021 10:33 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
ChesneyChrist
ChesneyChristChesneyChristManchester, Greater Manchester, England UK7,144 Posts
Selenite: All of that can happen when one has lost all trust in the people running their countries ...

Recognising inconsistencies when filtering information (from their own government and others) is exactely what many people have been doing. And it has proved very confusing for many. In my case, the fact that the news outlets and scientific information released by the 3 countries that are part of my family lineage of 4 generations, did not match from country to country. Some of my family members were being told one thing (in France) others totally different information (in the UK) and me yet some more different information (in Spain) ...
Surely science is science whichever country you live in!?
They're not 100% sure. And even if they were it wouldn't me we all react in the same way.

And politics is an art, politicians intuit what people need to hear which is usually not being full of doubt like Jimmy Carter.
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Oct 18, 2021 10:38 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
Selenite: All of that can happen when one has lost all trust in the people running their countries ...

Recognising inconsistencies when filtering information (from their own government and others) is exactely what many people have been doing. And it has proved very confusing for many. In my case, the fact that the news outlets and scientific information released by the 3 countries that are part of my family lineage of 4 generations, did not match from country to country. Some of my family members were being told one thing (in France) others totally different information (in the UK) and me yet some more different information (in Spain) ...
Surely science is science whichever country you live in!?
No, science doesn't quite work like that, but it's a common fallacy that it does which maybe leads to some of the confusion.

Research can't 'prove' something to be correct, or 'a fact'. What it can do is disprove, or indicate a probability that something is true. That information is then used to create the next hypotheses to disprove, or demonstrate a probability. In this way likelihood is accumulated over time.

So, researching the hypothesis that men are taller than women may produce the result that it's probable, but it doesn't prove it as fact - some women are taller than some men even if most men are taller than most women.

How you apply that information may affect how you present the results depending on your goal: an ergonomically designed space might not use overall average size, but consider that women are usually shorter than men.

I don't know what information you're comparing across countries, but multiple interacting factors and probabilities may impact upon decision making in each country to reach specific goals.
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Oct 18, 2021 10:41 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
ChesneyChrist
ChesneyChristChesneyChristManchester, Greater Manchester, England UK7,144 Posts
ChesneyChrist: They're not 100% sure. And even if they were it wouldn't me we all react in the same way.

And politics is an art, politicians intuit what people need to hear which is usually not being full of doubt like Jimmy Carter.
Wouldn't mean*
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Oct 18, 2021 11:40 AM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
Selenite: All of that can happen when one has lost all trust in the people running their countries ...
Yes, but again, that trust is about our emotional investment; we want to feel safe, but distrust creates anxiety and maybe anger directed at leaders/countries.

If we have an emotional investment in our expectations we are far more likely to seek out information which confirms our beliefs, or misinterpret information, rather than evaluate each 'event' from a neutral perspective. That's what the video makers were relying on when they produced inconsistent and meaningless sequences with their editing.

If we haven't got an emotinal investment, it's clearer when we're being played, or when we don't have all the information which may lead to different things beng said by different people, or at different times.

One of the distrust issues with people like Anthony Fauci is that he's said different things at different times. He has been consistent, however, if you take into account that onging research during the pandemic has provided new information, probabilites and hypotheses that have been disproved.
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Oct 18, 2021 1:45 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
Selenite
SeleniteSeleniteMálaga, Andalusia Spain59 Threads 1 Polls 6,299 Posts
jac_the_gripper: No, science doesn't quite work like that, but it's a common fallacy that it does which maybe leads to some of the confusion.

Research can't 'prove' something to be correct, or 'a fact'. What it can do is disprove, or indicate a probability that something is true. That information is then used to create the next hypotheses to disprove, or demonstrate a probability. In this way likelihood is accumulated over time.

So, researching the hypothesis that men are taller than women may produce the result that it's probable, but it doesn't prove it as fact - some women are taller than some men even if most men are taller than most women.

How you apply that information may affect how you present the results depending on your goal: an ergonomically designed space might not use overall average size, but consider that women are usually shorter than men.

I don't know what information you're comparing across countries, but multiple interacting factors and probabilities may impact upon decision making in each country to reach specific goals.
Exactly!

Considering that the well being and livelihood of their citizens was at stake in each country's decision making relating to managing covid it became only too apparent in many instances that there was little coherence in the parameters they set for protecting against covid.
If it's contagious at 8pm when bars/restaurants where made close it was also contagious at 2 pm when they were allowed to be open.
If supermarkets were allowed to sell shoes why were shoe shops not allowed to open ... and so many more inconsistences forcing many businesses to go bankrupt.
And so as you say, it makes you become aware that each country wants to reach a specific goal and makes you wonder what it is exactly ...
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Oct 18, 2021 2:33 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
Selenite: Exactly!

Considering that the well being and livelihood of their citizens was at stake in each country's decision making relating to managing covid it became only too apparent in many instances that there was little coherence in the parameters they set for protecting against covid.
If it's contagious at 8pm when bars/restaurants where made close it was also contagious at 2 pm when they were allowed to be open.
If supermarkets were allowed to sell shoes why were shoe shops not allowed to open ... and so many more inconsistences forcing many businesses to go bankrupt.
And so as you say, it makes you become aware that each country wants to reach a specific goal and makes you wonder what it is exactly ...
I agree, a lot of stuff appeared bonkers, but I imagine there were a number of reasons for those inconsistencies.

One of them would have been the simplification of parameters, however complex that became in reality. For example, at one point we could buy food, but not clothes, household goods and other daily non-essentials. That meant grocery stores had to remove, or tape off certain displays - I could walk past the stationary to get to the Valentine's chocolates, but couldn't pick up a writing pad for my grandchildren's remote learning. laugh

Other factors would have been politician's remoteness from everyday human existence and everyday humans remoteness from the complexities of trying to manage a pandemic with new information and research data constantly changing the picture.

None of that means our governments are totally evil, nor totally competent and caring. Inevitably there will be self-interest given how ambitious you have to be to become a leader, but that doesn't mean it's all one big global conspiracy.

And those practical inconsistencies aren't the same as the misinformation and manipulation kind that are on the video you cited.

I like the idea of a global community involving co-operation and fairness and I like the idea of small communities where everyone has an input. The one thing that doesn't seem to work very well is the one thing most of us have got - big, unwieldy countries.
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Oct 18, 2021 2:46 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
snowlynx: Can you not understand basic maths?
Don't bother trying to school that moron. Conman has another agenda. Deny; deflect; divert.
Math and science are skills that some people refuse to learn. Facts are not useful unless they serve an already decided upon scenario. These people are the problem - and will continue to be the problem for a democratic nation.
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Oct 18, 2021 2:49 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
president2525: Don't bother trying to school that moron. Conman has another agenda. Deny; deflect; divert.
Math and science are skills that some people refuse to learn. Facts are not useful unless they serve an already decided upon scenario. These people are the problem - and will continue to be the problem for a democratic nation.
Go back where you came from gaslighting Troll.comfort
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Oct 18, 2021 2:54 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
snowlynx: Can you not understand basic maths?
well,Sonnyboy,you are still short a 50%.
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Oct 18, 2021 2:56 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper
jac_the_gripperjac_the_gripperTonyrefail, South Glamorgan, Wales UK24 Threads 5,363 Posts
In response to: Psychologists use the term “gaslighting” to refer to a specific type of manipulation where the manipulator is trying to get someone else (or a group of people) to question their own reality, memory or perceptions.
I don't think 'gaslighting' is the term you're looking for, Conrad.

Unless President's comment has lead you to question your own reality and sanity.
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Oct 18, 2021 3:05 PM CST 8 prominent Doctors and scientists ...
jac_the_gripper: I don't think 'gaslighting' is the term you're looking for, Conrad.

Unless President's comment has lead you to question your own reality and sanity.
rolling on the floor laughing
Well,the wannabe-Pres is trying hard,almost as hard as you are here on this site!
Besides,2525 has to get up a bit earlier if he wants to try that!
And so do you!
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