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The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama ( Archived) (53)

Sep 18, 2008 12:29 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA39 Threads 7 Polls 16,471 Posts
I just had lunch with my pastor.....we got into the issue Sanctity of Life, the cornerstone of the pro life arguement in the abortion debate.

I got thinking about Sanator Obama's positions on abortion. Also I am aware of his IL Senate speech on a aborted pre nup baby and the right to take this child's life after it lived for 45 minutes....breathing, crying, and doing what a normal infant would do. He argued that the baby could be killed, by the law of law today.

I also got thinking back to the days of ancient Egypt. When Moses was a Isreal baby. Then as the biblical story goes and even the later Eyptian writings attest....Moses because of the law of land...a decree by the Pharoah..... was to be put to death. His mother not wishing to do this....places him in a reed basket and floats him on the Nile. There found by a woman who was a member of the Pharoah court.....she saved him and raised as Egyptican prince.......and later became the man, God used to set the Nation of Isreal free.

So?

What if Barak Obama had found Moses drifting helpless in a reed basket. .....knew the law of the land.....was to kill Isreal infants. What do you think would happen, after knowing his position on abortion and on his IL Senate arguement to terminate the life of that aborted fetus that lived for 45 minutes.

I suggest that Barak Obama would have little problem.....walking down into the Nile River....taking the reed basket from under that infant's body.....and letting that infant sink into the river and drown.

You say that is murder....infancide. It is.

So was the death of that pre nup fetus that lived for 45 minutes.

Both had the law of the land approval, both were infants, both were helpless. So what is the difference?

In both cases the Sancity of Life was or would have been violated. Wish to make one worse that the other? Barak's stance on Roe v Wade does. He would argue that Roe v Wade sees that unwanted baby/child/fetus (take your pick) whether in the womb or outside the womb.....the fate of which is the woman' giving birth. When is not the woman's right to this fate? When the rule of the land says so. (More on that later in the post)

That the law of the land gives her that right. So Barak doesnot actually do the killing here....he lets the weight of that decision on the woman deciding to abort.

We know what Moses turned out to be. He was a brillant archectect and was number 3 man in Egypt prior to being forced out of Egypt. Then returned to Egypt and with God's help on a brutal Pharoah to set the nation of Isreal free.

We donot know, nor does Obama know, what this pre nup infant could have been. But to struggle for 45 minutes in the world following a late term abortion....this kid had sprint and spunk....and a strong will to live. That is the kind of stuff God uses.

My thought is that if Barak Obama can use Roe v Wade to justify infancide.....he is capable of just about anything. I could not do it....either back in the days of Moses birth or with a aborted pre nup fetus. I would be with that woman of Pharoah's court, figuring a way to keep that infant in the reed basket alive. But where would you be?

There was a another biblical figure that had birth and then 'law of the land' threat to his young life. Jesus of Nazreth.

This is a hard OP to read. I fully intended it to be. The fact in the last 10 years..some 140,000,000 million abortions were done. All within the rule of law of the land of the United States.

End of part One
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Sep 18, 2008 12:32 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
Olsojente
OlsojenteOlsojenteOslo/Zadar, Oslo Norway68 Threads 5 Polls 6,857 Posts
What's a "pre nup baby"??
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Sep 18, 2008 12:44 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA39 Threads 7 Polls 16,471 Posts
Part Two

This is a hard OP to read. I fully intended it be. This is a hard issue of concern to millions.

We know where Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin stand on this. John McCain says life begins at creation. Gov. Palin is a very pro life, both the example of herself and family.

But really where does Barak Obama stand? His answer during the Church Q & A...it is a 'paygrade above me' is cute. But does not tell
us anything. It is for lack of better words...a evasion.

That is why I brought this OP to the births of Moses, Chirst and this pre nup abortion in IL. If elected, Barak becomes the chief legislature in the land. His position as President gives him the ability to introduce
legislation into Congress.

But he leaves us hanging, guessing and debating what his real position to this is. If we look at his past record here....he would not have any trouble with a National Abortion law....that furthers take
away pro choice. It is done in China, where the law of the land limits a family to one child. The left and liberals see population control critical to saving the envrionment and to ecomonics within a country.

He would have no problem placing two liberal Supreme Court justices on the bench.....that not only rule in favor of Roe V Wade...but would likely refuse to even hear any case on point that could over turn it.

He likely would have little problem signing a Constitution Admendant that make Roe v Wade, law of the land......and this left and liberal position of population control via abortion as well. That is what I deduct from his IL Senate Arguement on the pre nup and on his pro choice position. Am I off? If so, where?
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Sep 18, 2008 12:47 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA39 Threads 7 Polls 16,471 Posts
Olsojente: What's a "pre nup baby"??


The baby was aborted in the late 1/3 trimester.....and was alive.....a nurse took the child to utility room and tried to hide it....I call it a pre nup....maybe my term is wrong.....pre mature.....is the correct term.
Sorry
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Sep 18, 2008 12:51 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
Olsojente
OlsojenteOlsojenteOslo/Zadar, Oslo Norway68 Threads 5 Polls 6,857 Posts
ttom500: The baby was aborted in the late 1/3 trimester.....and was alive.....a nurse took the child to utility room and tried to hide it....I call it a pre nup....maybe my term is wrong.....pre mature.....is the correct term.
Sorry



Oh ok..
Got a bit confused as I thought a pre nup was an agreement before marriage...
and couldn't figure out the baby thing..

laugh



I'lll read it again now...
nerd
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Sep 18, 2008 1:11 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
agman
agmanagmanEagle, Idaho USA1 Threads 4,264 Posts
Not sure one can infer anything from past history. What if Moses
was killed, maybe no Isrealites would be fighting today in the
land of Canaan. What if Hitler mother aborted her baby. Maybe
WWII would have never happened. drinking
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Sep 18, 2008 1:12 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
druidess6308
druidess6308druidess6308Aliquippa, Pennsylvania USA99 Threads 20,283 Posts
I believe that life is sacred, and that yes, it begins at the time of creation. However, there are reasons that I believe abortion is a valid choice. I have been raped...lost my virginity to it. Should I have been made to carry a child to term if one had been conceived during that act? Some women have chosen to do so, I don't know what my own choice would have been and I'm glad I didn't have to do so. I do know that I'm glad that I would have had a choice, and that because I had a choice it would have been done safely and medically instead of by some quack with a hanger in an unsanitary manner which would possibly have left me sterile for the rest of my life and unable to have children with a man I loved in the future, if I didn't bleed to death.

So, those of you who are "pro-life", I agree with and understand your reasons. However, I am "pro-choice" because I think that there are times and reasons that a woman shouldn't have to have the baby, and that if she doesn't, she has the right not to risk death or sterility to practice that choice. I don't believe in it being used as birth control, though. We have other means available for that. I do know that happens, and I'm sorry that it does. However, there are always those who abuse laws.

You have the right to your opinion. I have the right to mine, and I am glad that the laws exist.

As to killing the baby that had survived...that is an entirely different issue than a woman's right to choose abortion. Was that nurse willing to adopt and care for that baby? Would it have survived? Why was the mother terminating the pregnancy so late, anyway? There are many more things that I would have to know before I gave an opinion on that particular case.
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Sep 18, 2008 1:14 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
Fallingman
FallingmanFallingmanDublin, Ireland45 Threads 17 Polls 18,473 Posts
What if Barak Obama turned out to be a genuinely compassionate President who wished to lead his people well and wisely?

Just as likely as your scenario ttom......a lot more likely in fact!

scold
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Sep 18, 2008 1:18 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
lusciousmile
lusciousmilelusciousmileThere, Aland Islands Finland31 Threads 2 Polls 17,895 Posts
Fallingman: What if Barak Obama turned out to be a genuinely compassionate President who wished to lead his people well and wisely?

Just as likely as your scenario ttom......a lot more likely in fact!


Clever. laugh
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Sep 18, 2008 1:19 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
crotalus_p
crotalus_pcrotalus_pRush, Dublin Ireland57 Threads 7 Polls 3,812 Posts
ttom500: Am I off? If so, where?


Yes by a mile


ttom500:
We know where Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin stand on this. John McCain says life begins at creation. Gov. Palin is a very pro life, both the example of herself and family.


Even if you are anti choice that is not a good enough reason to vote Pailen in it’s something like a 1in 6 or a 1 in eight chance that Mc Cain will not make it past the first term leaving her as president and she is far from qualified to hold the position


ttom500:
That is why I brought this OP to the births of Moses, Chirst


There is no evidence for either outside the bible so using them is a mute point any way even if we where to grant the bible validity which it does not have one could say well if Hitler’s mother had the choice to abort .


ttom500: But he leaves us hanging, guessing and debating what his real position to this is. If we look at his past record here....he would not have any trouble with a National Abortion law....that furthers take away pro choice.


I don’t know how your system works but to amend the Irish constitution the people have to vote for it



ttom500:
He would have no problem placing two liberal Supreme Court justices on the bench.....that not only rule in favor of Roe V Wade...but would likely refuse to even hear any case on point that could over turn it.


There is noting wrong with being liberal, if there is a case to here they will hear it

The main problem is that you are basing who you want to vote for based on one issue , when that issue in the grand scheme of things ie how the candidate would handle the possibility of international is insignificant

Ps

As far as I am concerned if it can breath for 45 minutes and is viable it should be given every chance to survive but I do stress it must be viable
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Sep 18, 2008 1:24 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
druidess6308
druidess6308druidess6308Aliquippa, Pennsylvania USA99 Threads 20,283 Posts
crotalus_p:

Ps

As far as I am concerned if it can breath for 45 minutes and is viable it should be given every chance to survive but I do stress it must be viable


Yes, that would be why I said I would need to know more before I answered that part. I'm not sure from what he wrote if the baby was aborted late in the 1st trimester, or late in the 3rd trimester. If it was the 1st trimester, the chances that it was viable are slim. Late in the 3rd is a different story.
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Sep 18, 2008 1:25 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
dazzling_dave
dazzling_davedazzling_daveWaynesboro, Virginia USA7 Threads 2,686 Posts
The fact that the rest of the world wants Obama to be our next president is enough to tell me that he is NOT the man for the job.
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Sep 18, 2008 1:28 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
crotalus_p
crotalus_pcrotalus_pRush, Dublin Ireland57 Threads 7 Polls 3,812 Posts
crotalus_p:
The main problem is that you are basing who you want to vote for based on one issue , when that issue in the grand scheme of things ie how the candidate would handle the possibility of international is insignificant


The main problem is that you are basing who you want to vote for based on one issue , when that issue in the grand scheme of things is insignificant compared to other things
ie how the candidate would handle the possibility of international conflicts / politics do you really want some one with as little experience as Palin representing the US and trying to stare down Iran ? What’s more do you want her to have the nuke codes ???
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Sep 18, 2008 1:29 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
Fallingman
FallingmanFallingmanDublin, Ireland45 Threads 17 Polls 18,473 Posts
dazzling_dave: The fact that the rest of the world wants Obama to be our next president is enough to tell me that he is NOT the man for the job.


Good point. In fact excellent point! What would the rest of the world know about anything. They are all stupid and don't live in the United States so clearly they have no useful contributions to make about any aspect of US life or american policy.

On behalf of the rest of the world I apologise for breathing!

laugh
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Sep 18, 2008 1:31 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
lusciousmile
lusciousmilelusciousmileThere, Aland Islands Finland31 Threads 2 Polls 17,895 Posts
dazzling_dave: The fact that the rest of the world wants Obama to be our next president is enough to tell me that he is NOT the man for the job.


Do you think you would do a better job? conversing
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Sep 18, 2008 1:33 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
crotalus_p
crotalus_pcrotalus_pRush, Dublin Ireland57 Threads 7 Polls 3,812 Posts
druidess6308: Yes, that would be why I said I would need to know more before I answered that part. I'm not sure from what he wrote if the baby was aborted late in the 1st trimester, or late in the 3rd trimester. If it was the 1st trimester, the chances that it was viable are slim. Late in the 3rd is a different story.


Last time I heard it , a premature baby was considered viable at 20 weeks but there will always be exceptions


What I would like to know is what where the exact words that Obama used these things have a habit of being twisted and misinterpreted
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Sep 18, 2008 1:38 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
druidess6308
druidess6308druidess6308Aliquippa, Pennsylvania USA99 Threads 20,283 Posts
crotalus_p: Last time I heard it , a premature baby was considered viable at 20 weeks but there will always be exceptions What I would like to know is what where the exact words that Obama used these things have a habit of being twisted and misinterpreted


Ya think? confused

That point, I'll agree with you on, Crotty P. cheers
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Sep 18, 2008 1:38 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
druidess6308
druidess6308druidess6308Aliquippa, Pennsylvania USA99 Threads 20,283 Posts
dazzling_dave: The fact that the rest of the world wants Obama to be our next president is enough to tell me that he is NOT the man for the job.


Agreed. cheers
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Sep 18, 2008 1:39 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
Fallingman
FallingmanFallingmanDublin, Ireland45 Threads 17 Polls 18,473 Posts
druidess6308: Agreed.


And why would that be, Druidess? confused
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Sep 18, 2008 1:42 PM CST The Birth of Moses and Barak Obama
dazzling_dave: The fact that the rest of the world wants Obama to be our next president is enough to tell me that he is NOT the man for the job.
thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up
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