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Obama Pros & Cons ( Archived) (26)

Sep 25, 2008 2:18 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Olsojente
OlsojenteOlsojenteOslo/Zadar, Oslo Norway68 Threads 5 Polls 6,857 Posts
Why should voters vote for Obama??

or

Why not???
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Sep 25, 2008 2:55 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Olsojente
OlsojenteOlsojenteOslo/Zadar, Oslo Norway68 Threads 5 Polls 6,857 Posts
Nor any reasons to vote for Obama??
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Sep 25, 2008 3:00 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
A Conservative for Obama
My party has slipped its moorings. It’s time for a true pragmatist to lead the country.
Leading Off By Wick Allison, Editor In Chief
Dallas Magazine


THE MORE I LISTEN TO AND READ ABOUT “the most liberal member of the U.S. Senate,” the more I like him. Barack Obama strikes a chord with me like no political figure since Ronald Reagan. To explain why, I need to explain why I am a conservative and what it means to me.

In 1964, at the age of 16, I organized the Dallas County Youth for Goldwater. My senior thesis at the University of Texas was on the conservative intellectual revival in America. Twenty years later, I was invited by William F. Buckley Jr. to join the board of National Review. I later became its publisher.

Conservatism to me is less a political philosophy than a stance, a recognition of the fallibility of man and of man’s institutions. Conservatives respect the past not for its antiquity but because it represents, as G.K. Chesterton said, the democracy of the dead; it gives the benefit of the doubt to customs and laws tried and tested in the crucible of time. Conservatives are skeptical of abstract theories and utopian schemes, doubtful that government is wiser than its citizens, and always ready to test any political program against actual results.

Liberalism always seemed to me to be a system of “oughts.” We ought to do this or that because it’s the right thing to do, regardless of whether it works or not. It is a doctrine based on intentions, not results, on feeling good rather than doing good.

But today it is so-called conservatives who are cemented to political programs when they clearly don’t work. The Bush tax cuts—a solution for which there was no real problem and which he refused to end even when the nation went to war—led to huge deficit spending and a $3 trillion growth in the federal debt. Facing this, John McCain pumps his “conservative” credentials by proposing even bigger tax cuts. Meanwhile, a movement that once fought for limited government has presided over the greatest growth of government in our history. That is not conservatism; it is profligacy using conservatism as a mask.

Today it is conservatives, not liberals, who talk with alarming bellicosity about making the world “safe for democracy.” It is John McCain who says America’s job is to “defeat evil,” a theological expansion of the nation’s mission that would make George Washington cough out his wooden teeth.
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Sep 25, 2008 3:00 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
agman
agmanagmanEagle, Idaho USA1 Threads 4,264 Posts
I vote for Obama because he is the lessor of two evils. grin
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Sep 25, 2008 3:01 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
This kind of conservatism, which is not conservative at all, has produced financial mismanagement, the waste of human lives, the loss of moral authority, and the wreckage of our economy that McCain now threatens to make worse.

Barack Obama is not my ideal candidate for president. (In fact, I made the maximum donation to John McCain during the primaries, when there was still hope he might come to his senses.) But I now see that Obama is almost the ideal candidate for this moment in American history. I disagree with him on many issues. But those don’t matter as much as what Obama offers, which is a deeply conservative view of the world. Nobody can read Obama’s books (which, it is worth noting, he wrote himself) or listen to him speak without realizing that this is a thoughtful, pragmatic, and prudent man. It gives me comfort just to think that after eight years of George W. Bush we will have a president who has actually read the Federalist Papers.

Most important, Obama will be a realist. I doubt he will taunt Russia, as McCain has, at the very moment when our national interest requires it as an ally. The crucial distinction in my mind is that, unlike John McCain, I am convinced he will not impulsively take us into another war unless American national interests are directly threatened.

“Every great cause,” Eric Hoffer wrote, “begins as a movement, becomes a business, and eventually degenerates into a racket.” As a cause, conservatism may be dead. But as a stance, as a way of making judgments in a complex and difficult world, I believe it is very much alive in the instincts and predispositions of a liberal named Barack Obama.
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Sep 25, 2008 7:05 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
ooby_dooby: A Conservative for Obama
My party has slipped its moorings. It’s time for a true pragmatist to lead the country.
Leading Off By Wick Allison, Editor In Chief
Dallas Magazine


THE MORE I LISTEN TO AND READ ABOUT “the most liberal member of the U.S. Senate,” the more I like him. Barack Obama strikes a chord with me like no political figure since Ronald Reagan. To explain why, I need to explain why I am a conservative and what it means to me.

In 1964, at the age of 16, I organized the Dallas County Youth for Goldwater. My senior thesis at the University of Texas was on the conservative intellectual revival in America. Twenty years later, I was invited by William F. Buckley Jr. to join the board of National Review. I later became its publisher.

Conservatism to me is less a political philosophy than a stance, a recognition of the fallibility of man and of man’s institutions. Conservatives respect the past not for its antiquity but because it represents, as G.K. Chesterton said, the democracy of the dead; it gives the benefit of the doubt to customs and laws tried and tested in the crucible of time. Conservatives are skeptical of abstract theories and utopian schemes, doubtful that government is wiser than its citizens, and always ready to test any political program against actual results.

Liberalism always seemed to me to be a system of “oughts.” We ought to do this or that because it’s the right thing to do, regardless of whether it works or not. It is a doctrine based on intentions, not results, on feeling good rather than doing good.



But today it is so-called conservatives who are cemented to political programs when they clearly don’t work. The Bush tax cuts—a solution for which there was no real problem and which he refused to end even when the nation went to war—led to huge deficit spending and a $3 trillion growth in the federal debt. Facing this, John McCain pumps his “conservative” credentials by proposing even bigger tax cuts. Meanwhile, a movement that once fought for limited government has presided over the greatest growth of government in our history. That is not conservatism; it is profligacy using conservatism as a mask.

Today it is conservatives, not liberals, who talk with alarming bellicosity about making the world “safe for democracy.” It is John McCain who says America’s job is to “defeat evil,” a theological expansion of the nation’s mission that would make George Washington cough out his wooden teeth.
professor professor
I knew Ronald Reagan. Ronald Reagan was a friend of mine.... and this dude is no Ronald Reagan.

professor
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Sep 25, 2008 7:07 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Hugz_n_Kissez
Hugz_n_KissezHugz_n_KissezSomeplace, Ontario Canada82 Threads 3 Polls 34,865 Posts
Indyfella: I knew Ronald Reagan. Ronald Reagan was a friend of mine.... and this dude is no Ronald Reagan.



WOW we have a celeb among us....wave roll eyes laugh
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Sep 25, 2008 7:09 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
shipoker58
shipoker58shipoker58Las Vegas, Nevada USA35 Threads 4,332 Posts
can't think of any pros or cons!!dunno
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Sep 25, 2008 7:43 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
Hugz_n_Kissez: WOW we have a celeb among us....


Yep...I'm that freakin old...rolling on the floor laughing
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Sep 25, 2008 8:50 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella: I knew Ronald Reagan. Ronald Reagan was a friend of mine.... and this dude is no Ronald Reagan.


Which dude? The author or Obama?

I don't see anybody claiming to be Reagan.

BTW, I find it ironic that you should paraphrase a democrat Senator Lloyd Bentsen with that line.
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Sep 25, 2008 9:10 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
ooby_dooby: Which dude? The author or Obama?

I don't see anybody claiming to be Reagan.

BTW, I find it ironic that you should paraphrase a democrat Senator Lloyd Bentsen with that line.



The Honorable vice-president Lloyd Bentsen?
confused laugh
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Sep 26, 2008 2:01 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Galactic_bodhi
Galactic_bodhiGalactic_bodhiAkron, Ohio USA786 Threads 2 Polls 12,449 Posts
Hmmm...actually reading "the Federalist"? doh

Hmmm...actually reading "The Wealth of Nations" doh

Hmmm...actually reading "Leviathan" and "The Prince"?

What good conservative reads that old junk anymoredoh
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Sep 26, 2008 4:55 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
agman: I vote for Obama because he is the lessor of two evils.
Are we talking about "The Man That Never Was" Obama?
The "Media Made Phantom" ?uh oh mumbling
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Sep 26, 2008 5:36 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
Well, he does have the great Senator Biden for VP candidate:

Joey Biden Gaffo-meter:
9/24/2008: General News Brief: Biden's Gaffs; "Pearls of Wisdom":

Senator Joe Biden was spinning folksy one-liners with CBS News anchor Katie Couric the other night, when he offered this pearl of wisdom about how real leaders act during times of national crisis:

"When the stock market crashed (in 1929), Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed. He said, 'Look, here's what happened' "

It was a great sound bite except for two things: Herbert Hoover, not Roosevelt, was president at the time, and commercial television didn't exist.

The good news for Biden was that hardly anyone noticed the historical error. The bad news? The blunder was overlooked only because the Democratic vice-presidential candidate was busy doing damage control Tuesday over two bigger gaffes that have landed him in Barack Obama's doghouse
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Sep 26, 2008 5:53 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella: Well, he does have the great Senator Biden for VP candidate:

Joey Biden Gaffo-meter:
9/24/2008: General News Brief: Biden's Gaffs; "Pearls of Wisdom":

Senator Joe Biden was spinning folksy one-liners with CBS News anchor Katie Couric the other night, when he offered this pearl of wisdom about how real leaders act during times of national crisis:

"When the stock market crashed (in 1929), Franklin Roosevelt got on the television and didn't just talk about the princes of greed. He said, 'Look, here's what happened' "

It was a great sound bite except for two things: Herbert Hoover, not Roosevelt, was president at the time, and commercial television didn't exist.

The good news for Biden was that hardly anyone noticed the historical error. The bad news? The blunder was overlooked only because the Democratic vice-presidential candidate was busy doing damage control Tuesday over two bigger gaffes that have landed him in Barack Obama's doghouse
Give the Fellow a Break;after all,he was only 10 years off!rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing
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Sep 26, 2008 5:56 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
Conrad73: Give the Fellow a Break;after all,he was only 10 years off!



I do wonder why all the TV stations aren't playing this up. This is some really good stuff. laugh
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Sep 26, 2008 5:58 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella: I do wonder why all the TV stations aren't playing this up. This is some really good stuff.
And all the other ones!
Too numerous to count!rolling on the floor laughing
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Sep 26, 2008 6:06 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Indyfella
IndyfellaIndyfellaindianapolis, Indiana USA230 Threads 9 Polls 27,698 Posts
After 2 bad weeks for McCain....and he's still tied w/Obummer... laugh
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Sep 26, 2008 9:12 AM CST Obama Pros & Cons
agman
agmanagmanEagle, Idaho USA1 Threads 4,264 Posts
Indyfella: I do wonder why all the TV stations aren't playing this up. This is some really good stuff.


I think he meant that FDR was left to deal with the problem. Which
he did. Was Hoover a Republican? grin
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Oct 6, 2008 8:19 PM CST Obama Pros & Cons
Luke213
Luke213Luke213Navarre, Florida USA1 Posts
Voters shouldnt vote for obama... he is trash
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