Bit of a tiff? (26)
Halv0: Well, if we take the smokescreen politics out of it, Indonesia's real beef with Australia is stopping the lucrative people trade.
Most refugees are financial refugees, not political refugees.
Indonesian politicians get a lot of financial kick-backs and are also behind a lot of the "refugee trade". They are making a motza.
The spying scandal is the smokescreen they are using to keep their profits from this people trade flowing into their pockets.
Australia is stupid enough to go into a foreign countries national waters to "rescue" boats while the country that sends them out doesn't give a toss after they get their money.
Statistically out of over 1.6 million refugees worldwide in 2012 (I think the stats were for) only 220,000 were found to be genuine refugees.
Many of the people getting on these boats have paid a motza for the ride. They have the money, just don't want to wait like my financee had to.
I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who pay a lot of money to climb on one of these boats.
Genuine refugees would be happy to go to any country where they are safe from persecution.
Non-genuine refugees are sold a ride like any other commercial travel venture and what to get to the destination they bought their ticket for.
JMO
my cousins a pro fisherman up there,and theyconstantly see asylum boats hanging back inside the Indonesian zone waiting for our patrol boats to disappear,then they race in.They,ll hang around for days,and our boats just cant do that,too costly.Their fishermen come in and steal our mud crabsall the time,someones going to put a bullet in them soon,and then see the sparks fly.Most refugees are financial refugees, not political refugees.
Indonesian politicians get a lot of financial kick-backs and are also behind a lot of the "refugee trade". They are making a motza.
The spying scandal is the smokescreen they are using to keep their profits from this people trade flowing into their pockets.
Australia is stupid enough to go into a foreign countries national waters to "rescue" boats while the country that sends them out doesn't give a toss after they get their money.
Statistically out of over 1.6 million refugees worldwide in 2012 (I think the stats were for) only 220,000 were found to be genuine refugees.
Many of the people getting on these boats have paid a motza for the ride. They have the money, just don't want to wait like my financee had to.
I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who pay a lot of money to climb on one of these boats.
Genuine refugees would be happy to go to any country where they are safe from persecution.
Non-genuine refugees are sold a ride like any other commercial travel venture and what to get to the destination they bought their ticket for.
JMO
robplum: Abbott knows what he is doing, utter rubbish look here clearly China thinks Australia Indonesia relationship is dead
China has demarcated an "air-defence identification zone" over an area of the East China Sea, covering islands that are also claimed by Japan.
good as as a deceleration of war
China has demarcated an "air-defence identification zone" over an area of the East China Sea, covering islands that are also claimed by Japan.
good as as a deceleration of war
Not to forget the South China Sea which has been controversial with Veitnam, the Phillipines and Indonesia claims.
Indoensia has been an issue for a long time, 70 years since WWII. Mainly because they are 98% Muslim while we have been a predominantly Chirstian outpost. And also the barrier between the Commies and "free" democracy.
I've been almost daily been following events in South China Sea for a while.
Vietnam just sold India a stake in oil and gas reserves. While it seems Taiwan appears to got lot closer to China lately.
Russia got a feet parked out the back of China, Sri Lanka has jumped into be with China and if you believe the Chinese reports this morning NZ is about to sign a Defence Pack with China to.
Mean while lot people been rejecting Christianity over past few years, your prognosis of 90% is long way of the mark
from the 2011 Census, 2012–2013
Since the first Census, the majority of Australians have reported an affiliation with a Christian religion. However, there has been a long-term decrease in affiliation to Christianity from 96% in 1911 to 61% in 2011. Conversely, although Christian religions are still predominant in Australia, there have been increases in those reporting an affiliation to non-Christian religions, and those reporting 'No Religion'.
In the past decade, the proportion of the population reporting an affiliation to a Christian religion decreased from 68% in 2001 to 61% in 2011. This trend was also seen for the two most commonly reported denominations. In 2001, 27% of the population reported an affiliation to Catholicism. This decreased to 25% of the population in 2011. There was a slightly larger decrease for Anglicans from 21% of the population in 2001 to 17% in 2011.
Between 2001 and 2011, the number of people reporting a non-Christian faith increased considerably, from around 0.9 million to 1.5 million, accounting for 7.2% of the total population in 2011 (up from 4.9% in 2001). The most common non-Christian religions in 2011 were Buddhism (accounting for 2.5% of the population), Islam (2.2%) and Hinduism (1.3%). Of these, Hinduism had experienced the fastest growth since 2001, increasing by 189% to 275,500, followed by Islam (increased by 69% to 476,300) and Buddhism (increased by 48% to 529,000 people).
Vietnam just sold India a stake in oil and gas reserves. While it seems Taiwan appears to got lot closer to China lately.
Russia got a feet parked out the back of China, Sri Lanka has jumped into be with China and if you believe the Chinese reports this morning NZ is about to sign a Defence Pack with China to.
Mean while lot people been rejecting Christianity over past few years, your prognosis of 90% is long way of the mark
from the 2011 Census, 2012–2013
Since the first Census, the majority of Australians have reported an affiliation with a Christian religion. However, there has been a long-term decrease in affiliation to Christianity from 96% in 1911 to 61% in 2011. Conversely, although Christian religions are still predominant in Australia, there have been increases in those reporting an affiliation to non-Christian religions, and those reporting 'No Religion'.
In the past decade, the proportion of the population reporting an affiliation to a Christian religion decreased from 68% in 2001 to 61% in 2011. This trend was also seen for the two most commonly reported denominations. In 2001, 27% of the population reported an affiliation to Catholicism. This decreased to 25% of the population in 2011. There was a slightly larger decrease for Anglicans from 21% of the population in 2001 to 17% in 2011.
Between 2001 and 2011, the number of people reporting a non-Christian faith increased considerably, from around 0.9 million to 1.5 million, accounting for 7.2% of the total population in 2011 (up from 4.9% in 2001). The most common non-Christian religions in 2011 were Buddhism (accounting for 2.5% of the population), Islam (2.2%) and Hinduism (1.3%). Of these, Hinduism had experienced the fastest growth since 2001, increasing by 189% to 275,500, followed by Islam (increased by 69% to 476,300) and Buddhism (increased by 48% to 529,000 people).
robplum:
Between 2001 and 2011, the number of people reporting a non-Christian faith increased considerably, from around 0.9 million to 1.5 million, accounting for 7.2% of the total population in 2011 (up from 4.9% in 2001). The most common non-Christian religions in 2011 were Buddhism (accounting for 2.5% of the population), Islam (2.2%) and Hinduism (1.3%). Of these, Hinduism had experienced the fastest growth since 2001, increasing by 189% to 275,500, followed by Islam (increased by 69% to 476,300) and Buddhism (increased by 48% to 529,000 people).
.Between 2001 and 2011, the number of people reporting a non-Christian faith increased considerably, from around 0.9 million to 1.5 million, accounting for 7.2% of the total population in 2011 (up from 4.9% in 2001). The most common non-Christian religions in 2011 were Buddhism (accounting for 2.5% of the population), Islam (2.2%) and Hinduism (1.3%). Of these, Hinduism had experienced the fastest growth since 2001, increasing by 189% to 275,500, followed by Islam (increased by 69% to 476,300) and Buddhism (increased by 48% to 529,000 people).
I was baptised Presbyterian. Ex#1 was baptised C of E. Daughter was baptised Catholic (at 22yo as she had intended to marry a Catholic). Son was not baptised. Essentially, we all have had christian upbringing (children attended a Church school - partly to let them be aware of christian ways) but are not religious. I can only speak for myself about what was put in the census but no doubt all would have ticked "No Religion." Like many of my family and friends.
So playing with statistics, 7.2% of the total population in 2011 reported a non-Christian faith and 61% who say they have an "affiliation" with christian religion. From what I see, 92.8% of the population does not subscribe to non-Christian beliefs.
31.8% have no "religious affiliation." I would class myself, and a lot of my extended family, in that category - NO religious affiliation. But most of us have been brought with Christian beliefs. We do have a few Hindus & Bhuddists in the family.
From what I see, 92.8% of the population does not subscribe to non-Christian beliefs.
Now going back to the earliest census taking, there were a large number of exclusions. Aborigines and Chinese were definitely not included. Okay, the Chinese got it a long time before the Aborigines. People in jail had lost all rights and would most likely not have been included. And then did the census include only those that had the "Right to Vote" (was something hard to get). Then add in the number of "illegals" (had at least 1 in the family that I know of) in this country who would never want to be included in any census.
i went to sunday school and bible class to but found good reason to mistrust christians so looked elsewhere
i don't really care whether others call themselves christian jesuit, catholic, presbyterian, muslim or any other faith based belief. That is the right of every person in this country, just as it my right to call myself buddhist or whatever. The values of Australia are not necessarily based on religious belief but unfortunately lack of understanding of what buddhist believe is the true nature of compassion, greed, killing for sport to entertain mind and or a view other people doing things different should be murdered (vietnam, iraq, afghanistan foremost come to mind) and especially at this time when indonesian president sort reassurance that he wouldn't be stabbed in the back by australian politicians and howards flunky downer tells jesuit abbott to make admission varying from the truth in reply i mind as the lies are been told in our names
i don't really care whether others call themselves christian jesuit, catholic, presbyterian, muslim or any other faith based belief. That is the right of every person in this country, just as it my right to call myself buddhist or whatever. The values of Australia are not necessarily based on religious belief but unfortunately lack of understanding of what buddhist believe is the true nature of compassion, greed, killing for sport to entertain mind and or a view other people doing things different should be murdered (vietnam, iraq, afghanistan foremost come to mind) and especially at this time when indonesian president sort reassurance that he wouldn't be stabbed in the back by australian politicians and howards flunky downer tells jesuit abbott to make admission varying from the truth in reply i mind as the lies are been told in our names
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China has demarcated an "air-defence identification zone" over an area of the East China Sea, covering islands that are also claimed by Japan.
good as as a deceleration of war