Who should pay for healthcare (36)
LiLee: I heard a discussion recently regarding the huge cost of healthcare in Australia. I imagine it's the same in NZ.
The comment was made that those who live an unhealthy life style throughout their life such as smoking drinking drug taking etc should make a larger contribution than those who don't. Seems to me it would be a nightmare to administer and what about those taking part in high risk activities such as sky diving or motor racing etc. Should they pay more as well.
It was mentioned to me by a knowledgeable person that smokers, for example, already pay an extra amount in taxes placed on cigarettes.
What do you think? Should healthcare contributions be based on lifestyle choices?
The comment was made that those who live an unhealthy life style throughout their life such as smoking drinking drug taking etc should make a larger contribution than those who don't. Seems to me it would be a nightmare to administer and what about those taking part in high risk activities such as sky diving or motor racing etc. Should they pay more as well.
It was mentioned to me by a knowledgeable person that smokers, for example, already pay an extra amount in taxes placed on cigarettes.
What do you think? Should healthcare contributions be based on lifestyle choices?
I've read a few articles that have stated that smokers contribute more in taxes than they could ever possibly take out in any possible added health care costs. Not sure if it would be the same for drinkers, but it could be possible.
As for other "high risk" activities, it might be a good idea to have extra insurance from a private provider, but I don't see how it could be enforced as a rule to charge more. There has been mention of it here too, but as far as I know, it died the death it deserved.
I think it would be unfairly singling out people, when really, you never know who's going to have an accident, get cancer, or have something in their genetic make up that predisposes them to certain illnesses/diseases. What would they do, test everyone for everything, then charge accordingly?
I hear what you are saying but it would be too difficult to monitor.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Carmengetme: I hear what you are saying but it would be too difficult to monitor.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Hi Carmengetme
I don't agree with what I heard, was just passing on the comments for a discussion.
Carmengetme: I hear what you are saying but it would be too difficult to monitor.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Impractical.
Smokers and drinkers already pay their taxes upon purchase of product...smokers an exorbitant amount in NZ.
Smokers and drinkers do pay a lot of taxes to enjoy what they want/crave. I was in NSW last week and bought a double pack of my brand of smokes in a rural town. $5 cheaper than in Victoria. And is less in Qld.
A few years ago, I was in Vanuatu and for the cost of 1 packet of tobacco in Victoria, I could buy 5 packets. And alcohol was about 1/3 of AU costs. A lot of taxes on them in AU.
Essentially, the smokers and drinkers who cark it early in life are financing all those healthy people who live to 100.
Interesting some of the new government want to charge us $6 a visit to the GP!!
Which while I can afford that it adds up when you go to get a form to have a blood test . Then go back to get results or you need scripts etc !!
And it was only last year or the year before that many large surgeries here in Adelaide were charging $50 just to see a GP. And no that wasn't refundable from medicare !! When the sick voted with their feet the fees were dropped !!
Seeing I don't smoke or drink slug them double or triple also up the prices of junk food like Macas
Wonder what would happen then !!
Which while I can afford that it adds up when you go to get a form to have a blood test . Then go back to get results or you need scripts etc !!
And it was only last year or the year before that many large surgeries here in Adelaide were charging $50 just to see a GP. And no that wasn't refundable from medicare !! When the sick voted with their feet the fees were dropped !!
Seeing I don't smoke or drink slug them double or triple also up the prices of junk food like Macas
Wonder what would happen then !!
mickyj63: Interesting some of the new government want to charge us $6 a visit to the GP!!
Which while I can afford that it adds up when you go to get a form to have a blood test . Then go back to get results or you need scripts etc !!
And it was only last year or the year before that many large surgeries here in Adelaide were charging $50 just to see a GP. And no that wasn't refundable from medicare !! When the sick voted with their feet the fees were dropped !!
Seeing I don't smoke or drink slug them double or triple also up the prices of junk food like Macas
Wonder what would happen then !!
Which while I can afford that it adds up when you go to get a form to have a blood test . Then go back to get results or you need scripts etc !!
And it was only last year or the year before that many large surgeries here in Adelaide were charging $50 just to see a GP. And no that wasn't refundable from medicare !! When the sick voted with their feet the fees were dropped !!
Seeing I don't smoke or drink slug them double or triple also up the prices of junk food like Macas
Wonder what would happen then !!
People like you would get strangled by people that can't afford cigs and booze.
kidatheart: People like you would get strangled by people that can't afford cigs and booze.
Why cause I suggest that
I do get funny looks at work when I suggest very loudly we should do drug and alcohol tests . And the panic looks I get from users of recreational drugs when. I declare I have asked why the company don't do tests on workers in the OHS committee I'm on
Companies reply they don't for the same reason they don't do bag checks . the cost and peoples liberties !!
Wasn't that long ago a Temp worker was arrested for stealing Sudafed
so why check bags And I know of certain forklift drivers who turn up drunk !!
So yeah am I an asrehole
kidatheart: People like you would get strangled by people that can't afford cigs and booze.
And it wasn't that long ago I couldn't afford to do just about anything brother so toughen up princess if u need to drink to have fun your stuffed already
wash2u: Smokers and drinkers do pay a lot of taxes to enjoy what they want/crave. I was in NSW last week and bought a double pack of my brand of smokes in a rural town. $5 cheaper than in Victoria. And is less in Qld.
A few years ago, I was in Vanuatu and for the cost of 1 packet of tobacco in Victoria, I could buy 5 packets. And alcohol was about 1/3 of AU costs. A lot of taxes on them in AU.
Essentially, the smokers and drinkers who cark it early in life are financing all those healthy people who live to 100.
A few years ago, I was in Vanuatu and for the cost of 1 packet of tobacco in Victoria, I could buy 5 packets. And alcohol was about 1/3 of AU costs. A lot of taxes on them in AU.
Essentially, the smokers and drinkers who cark it early in life are financing all those healthy people who live to 100.
So true Wash.
I don't like smoking and would like to quit(on my bucket list before the bucket hits me...lol)
Having said that, there's a huge price to pay in NZ for the luxury of having a smoke...
Beats away the mob of anti/reformed smokers...the huge taxes we pay here go straight into the government coffers to re-destribute back to
the health system for one AND all. It does make me sleep better at night, even if my purse is empty.
Please people no lectures on smoking. I know the dangers already. It's been a tough day at the office.
Carmengetme: So true Wash.
I don't like smoking and would like to quit(on my bucket list before the bucket hits me...lol)
Having said that, there's a huge price to pay in NZ for the luxury of having a smoke...
Beats away the mob of anti/reformed smokers...the huge taxes we pay here go straight into the government coffers to re-destribute back to
the health system for one AND all. It does make me sleep better at night, even if my purse is empty.
Please people no lectures on smoking. I know the dangers already. It's been a tough day at the office.
I don't like smoking and would like to quit(on my bucket list before the bucket hits me...lol)
Having said that, there's a huge price to pay in NZ for the luxury of having a smoke...
Beats away the mob of anti/reformed smokers...the huge taxes we pay here go straight into the government coffers to re-destribute back to
the health system for one AND all. It does make me sleep better at night, even if my purse is empty.
Please people no lectures on smoking. I know the dangers already. It's been a tough day at the office.
Yeah no bagging smokers guys. Nicotine is a very addictive drug and the hardest thing to give up.
LiLee: Yeah no bagging smokers guys. Nicotine is a very addictive drug and the hardest thing to give up.
yes it is I gave up many times until I had my wisdom teeth taken out haven't smoked since .Smoked from 12 to early 30's
mickyj63: Why cause I suggest that
I do get funny looks at work when I suggest very loudly we should do drug and alcohol tests . And the panic looks I get from users of recreational drugs when. I declare I have asked why the company don't do tests on workers in the OHS committee I'm on
Companies reply they don't for the same reason they don't do bag checks . the cost and peoples liberties !!
Wasn't that long ago a Temp worker was arrested for stealing Sudafed so why check bags
And I know of certain forklift drivers who turn up drunk !!
So yeah am I an asrehole
I do get funny looks at work when I suggest very loudly we should do drug and alcohol tests . And the panic looks I get from users of recreational drugs when. I declare I have asked why the company don't do tests on workers in the OHS committee I'm on
Companies reply they don't for the same reason they don't do bag checks . the cost and peoples liberties !!
Wasn't that long ago a Temp worker was arrested for stealing Sudafed so why check bags
And I know of certain forklift drivers who turn up drunk !!
So yeah am I an asrehole
I'm sure you do, and yes, I noticed.
kidatheart: I'm sure you do, and yes, I noticed.
That's funny how much do u know about Australian healthcare
probably nothing I guess
And Australia is a democracy may not feel it at times and I'm entitled to say tax the booze smokes and junk food more !!
Seriously what do I care my company gets at least a million bucks plus a year from the Australian govt to promote certain drugs in the cities and country areas !!
So let people drink smoke dope etc my employer is raking it in
mickyj63: That's funny how much do u know about Australian healthcare
probably nothing I guess
And Australia is a democracy may not feel it at times and I'm entitled to say tax the booze smokes and junk food more !!
Seriously what do I care my company gets at least a million bucks plus a year from the Australian govt to promote certain drugs in the cities and country areas !!
So let people drink smoke dope etc my employer is raking it in
probably nothing I guess
And Australia is a democracy may not feel it at times and I'm entitled to say tax the booze smokes and junk food more !!
Seriously what do I care my company gets at least a million bucks plus a year from the Australian govt to promote certain drugs in the cities and country areas !!
So let people drink smoke dope etc my employer is raking it in
ok ok Im an arsehole and grumpy pants
The whole healthcare debate is very complex and there is not easy answer.
Smoking is bad for your health, we all know that now, but as my in laws told me, she went to the doctor as a young women and wanted to loose weight, the doctor told her to take up smoking! Also, I believe they used to send smokes to the forces in combat zones in the second World War?? So I think it is unfair to expect people to stop now in that age bracket.
And yes, isn't it easier to get addicted to than heroin, and as hard to give up?? As far as that goes everyone is different, I know people who have said, 'When I have finished that packet - that is it" and after 30 odd years they did it.
Then there are the people who have tried everything, nicotine patches, cold turkey, hypnosis and it still doesn't work for them?
And the Govt is addicted to the revenue it gets from cigarettes so it is a Catch 22 situation? If most people stopped smoking, they would have a huge hole in revenue to fill somehow?
A real bloody conundrum
Newlife08: The whole healthcare debate is very complex and there is not easy answer.
Smoking is bad for your health, we all know that now, but as my in laws told me, she went to the doctor as a young women and wanted to loose weight, the doctor told her to take up smoking! Also, I believe they used to send smokes to the forces in combat zones in the second World War?? So I think it is unfair to expect people to stop now in that age bracket.
And yes, isn't it easier to get addicted to than heroin, and as hard to give up?? As far as that goes everyone is different, I know people who have said, 'When I have finished that packet - that is it" and after 30 odd years they did it.
Then there are the people who have tried everything, nicotine patches, cold turkey, hypnosis and it still doesn't work for them?
And the Govt is addicted to the revenue it gets from cigarettes so it is a Catch 22 situation? If most people stopped smoking, they would have a huge hole in revenue to fill somehow?
A real bloody conundrum
Smoking is bad for your health, we all know that now, but as my in laws told me, she went to the doctor as a young women and wanted to loose weight, the doctor told her to take up smoking! Also, I believe they used to send smokes to the forces in combat zones in the second World War?? So I think it is unfair to expect people to stop now in that age bracket.
And yes, isn't it easier to get addicted to than heroin, and as hard to give up?? As far as that goes everyone is different, I know people who have said, 'When I have finished that packet - that is it" and after 30 odd years they did it.
Then there are the people who have tried everything, nicotine patches, cold turkey, hypnosis and it still doesn't work for them?
And the Govt is addicted to the revenue it gets from cigarettes so it is a Catch 22 situation? If most people stopped smoking, they would have a huge hole in revenue to fill somehow?
A real bloody conundrum
That's something I was discussing with someone just a couple days ago. The Canadian government has hiked tobacco prices, yet again, and there's a rumour they'll go up again in the near future, to who knows what. If the idea is to tax people to death so they won't smoke, or simply can't afford it, who makes up for the shortfall?
It'll be 20 years, maybe even 40, before all the smokers are dead from whatever, and there won't be that tax base from tobacco to support all the costs associated with their health care, let alone the extra revenue that smokers never see any benefit from.
People get ill all the time, and the smokers and drinkers are also paying for their health care, moreso than they are themselves in taxes overall, compared to what they take out.
The other things is, all the smokers and drinkers are also keeping health care workers employed, as well as politician, who are continually looking for a bigger slice out of their wallets.
May not be the best arguments for smokers, but still, facts none the less. I'm not on here to promote it either, just tired of people that choose to partake being crapped on as they generally are in society. It's not like we're evil, or have horns, we just took a different path and will possibly pay the ultimate price for it, in the end, but we pay all along, for others as well.
I wonder if the anti smoking crowd will be willing to cough up the billions to cover the costs? If not, quit whining.
kidatheart: That's something I was discussing with someone just a couple days ago. The Canadian government has hiked tobacco prices, yet again, and there's a rumour they'll go up again in the near future, to who knows what. If the idea is to tax people to death so they won't smoke, or simply can't afford it, who makes up for the shortfall?
It'll be 20 years, maybe even 40, before all the smokers are dead from whatever, and there won't be that tax base from tobacco to support all the costs associated with their health care, let alone the extra revenue that smokers never see any benefit from.
People get ill all the time, and the smokers and drinkers are also paying for their health care, moreso than they are themselves in taxes overall, compared to what they take out.
The other things is, all the smokers and drinkers are also keeping health care workers employed, as well as politician, who are continually looking for a bigger slice out of their wallets.
May not be the best arguments for smokers, but still, facts none the less. I'm not on here to promote it either, just tired of people that choose to partake being crapped on as they generally are in society. It's not like we're evil, or have horns, we just took a different path and will possibly pay the ultimate price for it, in the end, but we pay all along, for others as well.
I wonder if the anti smoking crowd will be willing to cough up the billions to cover the costs? If not, quit whining.
It'll be 20 years, maybe even 40, before all the smokers are dead from whatever, and there won't be that tax base from tobacco to support all the costs associated with their health care, let alone the extra revenue that smokers never see any benefit from.
People get ill all the time, and the smokers and drinkers are also paying for their health care, moreso than they are themselves in taxes overall, compared to what they take out.
The other things is, all the smokers and drinkers are also keeping health care workers employed, as well as politician, who are continually looking for a bigger slice out of their wallets.
May not be the best arguments for smokers, but still, facts none the less. I'm not on here to promote it either, just tired of people that choose to partake being crapped on as they generally are in society. It's not like we're evil, or have horns, we just took a different path and will possibly pay the ultimate price for it, in the end, but we pay all along, for others as well.
I wonder if the anti smoking crowd will be willing to cough up the billions to cover the costs? If not, quit whining.
Just going to apologise for my comments last night . I have no idea what the hell got into me
LiLee: I heard a discussion recently regarding the huge cost of healthcare in Australia. I imagine it's the same in NZ.
The comment was made that those who live an unhealthy life style throughout their life such as smoking drinking drug taking etc should make a larger contribution than those who don't. Seems to me it would be a nightmare to administer and what about those taking part in high risk activities such as sky diving or motor racing etc. Should they pay more as well.
It was mentioned to me by a knowledgeable person that smokers, for example, already pay an extra amount in taxes placed on cigarettes.
What do you think? Should healthcare contributions be based on lifestyle choices?
I think all refugees should be taxed the max amount for the next 10 years as well as everyone else who has not been naturalised as an Australian.The comment was made that those who live an unhealthy life style throughout their life such as smoking drinking drug taking etc should make a larger contribution than those who don't. Seems to me it would be a nightmare to administer and what about those taking part in high risk activities such as sky diving or motor racing etc. Should they pay more as well.
It was mentioned to me by a knowledgeable person that smokers, for example, already pay an extra amount in taxes placed on cigarettes.
What do you think? Should healthcare contributions be based on lifestyle choices?
AgentAjax: I think all refugees should be taxed the max amount for the next 10 years as well as everyone else who has not been naturalised as an Australian.
Of course that should also apply to all the Aussies living and working abroad then who haven't been naturalised in whatever country they've chosen to live in?
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The comment was made that those who live an unhealthy life style throughout their life such as smoking drinking drug taking etc should make a larger contribution than those who don't. Seems to me it would be a nightmare to administer and what about those taking part in high risk activities such as sky diving or motor racing etc. Should they pay more as well.
It was mentioned to me by a knowledgeable person that smokers, for example, already pay an extra amount in taxes placed on cigarettes.
What do you think? Should healthcare contributions be based on lifestyle choices?