No;feminist should not fight for Muslim women righ
11
18%
because Sharia law is only Muslim buisnis in west
0
0%
Muslim women do not need "saving "
21
34%
Total Votes
62
Culture matters ! It ‘s the primary source of social progress or regression. Nowhere do we see this more clearly than in the status of women. The Judeo-Christian culture —and perhaps a more apt word is civilization—has produced over time the law codes, language and material prosperity that have greatly elevated women's status. But this progress is not shared everywhere.
There are still hundreds of millions of people that live in a culture—the Islamic, for instance—that takes female inferiority for granted. Until recently, these cultures—the Western and the Islamic—were, for the most part, separated. But that is changing. Dramatically so.
Large numbers of immigrant men from the Middle East, South Asia and various parts of Africa have brought a different set of values to the West, specifically Europe. More than a million arrived in 2015 alone. More are on the way...
As a result, crimes against girls and women—groping, harassments, assaults and rape—have risen sharply. These crimes illustrate the stark difference between the Western culture of the victims and that of the perpetrators.
Let me be clear: not all immigrant men, or even most, indulge in sex attacks or approve of such attacks, but it’s a grave mistake to deny that the value system of the attackers is radically different from the value system of the West. In the West women are emancipated and sexually autonomous. Religiosity and s*xual behaviour or s*xual restraint is determined by women's individual wishes. The other value system is one in which women are viewed as either commodities (that is, their worth depends on their virginity), or on the level of a prostitute if they are guilty of public "immodesty" (wearing a short skirt for example).
These different value systems in the west can not coexist !!! The question is which value system will prevail in the west remains an open question.
What do you think; what values system should prevail in the west ?
The current situation in Europe is deeply troubling: not only are Muslim women within Europe subject to considerable oppression in many ways, such norms now risk spreading to non-Muslim women who face harassment from Muslim men. One would think that Western feminists in the United States and Europe would be very disturbed by this obvious misogyny. But sadly, with few exceptions, this does not appear to be the case.
Common among many Western feminists is a type of moral confusion, in which women are said to be oppressed everywhere and that this oppression, in feminist is "exactly the same" around the world; in the West just as in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Iran.
This suggests too much moral relativism and an inadequate understanding of Sharia law. It is true that the situation for women in the West is not perfect, but can anyone truly deny that women enjoy greater freedom and opportunities in the United States, France and Finland than they do in Iran, Pakistan or Saudi Arabia?
Other feminists have also argued that non-Western women do not need "saving" and that any suggestion that they "need" help from Western feminists is insulting and condescending to non-Western women. Share your views.
If you take a baboon out of Africa and put him in Trafalgar Square or any other part of Europe you will have a relocated baboon. You will not have a civilised human being. If you doubt this ask the women of Cologne.
All women in all parts of the world to me are all equal. Some cultures need to change their view on women and join the rest of the world in the 21'st century.
Having said that, there are some in the so called modernized world who need to update their attitudes as well.
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
Track16: All women in all parts of the world to me are all equal. Some cultures need to change their view on women and join the rest of the world in the 21'st century.
Having said that, there are some in the so called modernized world who need to update their attitudes as well.
In the so called modernised world what attitudes some women need to update ??? Like what exacly your implying to ? It's ok. for any men to elaborate without being fried on the barbecue...
123whisper: In the so called modernised world what attitudes some women need to update ??? Like what exacly your implying to ? It's ok. for any men to elaborate without being fried on the barbecue...
I'm talking about the men, not the women. Discrimination still happens regularly in the modernized world.
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
chris27292729: Who knows??? After 100 years when the Frence Suffragettes appearance.
We might witnessed the Muslim's version.
Muslim Suffragettes.
One day has to happen,those Muslim women,will rise up, demanding their TOTAL liberation.
Many women of muslim religion (who are born in the western country !) decided to take off scarf from their head and facing threats from their imidiate family (so called 'honour killing') for which this women need to seek special protection to relocate. Obviously this muslim women who decides for themselves not to wear scarf is under great threats to be feeling liberated in the western country that gives them choice but this women are never free from fear of those that follow Islam.
Track16: All women in all parts of the world to me are all equal. Some cultures need to change their view on women and join the rest of the world in the 21'st century. Having said that, there are some in the so called modernized world who need to update their attitudes as well.
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
truheart1941: ..It would be like telling the Pope....to change his faith to being Jewish.a waste of time and energy.let them fight their own wars.
Let them fight their own wars on Western culture how women dress is all our buissnis. This thread is not suggesting that anyone should change religion but rather is it certain religious beliefs compatible to the western culture freedom of choice and which culture in the west should prevailed; western or Islam culture ?
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
TheRedSquirrel87: I'd agree with this bunch as I seldom support the planetary designs of anyone feminist or otherwise. The frame would be different as I'd argue this is putting western people(in this case women)first. However, once a non-westerner settles in the west they are expected to become a westerner and adopt our values.
You can't help someone who isn't looking for help. Muslim women should stand up and voice their willingness for a change. They are the ones to start, lead and win this battle, we can only support them.
123whisper: Since when you are scared to share your views?
I am NOT but you started the thread and having heard it all before socially years ago from forceful women on both sides of the argument, I believed then, as I do now, Falstaff's Line in Shakespeare's Henry IV, when translated into modern language is "Discretion is the better part of Valour"
Proverb "It is better to avoid a dangerous situation than to confront it" So that said, I would add to that "and live to fight another day" Now have a smile, a glass of wine and accept a peace Bouquet :
123whisper: Many women of muslim religion (who are born in the western country !) decided to take off scarf from their head and facing threats from their imidiate family (so called 'honour killing') for which this women need to seek special protection to relocate. Obviously this muslim women who decides for themselves not to wear scarf is under great threats to be feeling liberated in the western country that gives them choice but this women are never free from fear of those that follow Islam.
It looks like the Muslim men,leaving in the Western world,need to liberate themselves first,before accepting the liberation of their women.
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
KremaP: You can't help someone who isn't looking for help. Muslim women should stand up and voice their willingness for a change. They are the ones to start, lead and win this battle, we can only support them.
Perhaps your right... What I can't make sense of is;how can western feminist support this kind of multiculturalism that is deeply oppressive towards women freedom and at the same time hiding victims of the same religious -culture that needs help when under threat of honour killing !???
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
chris27292729: It looks like the Muslim men,leaving in the Western world,need to liberate themselves first,before accepting the liberation of their women.
Perhaps the western law should be clear enough to liberate muslim men.
TheRedSquirrel87: Yes, you can only help people who want to help themselves. I'd go one further and say that our "help" actually drives them deeper into Islam. They take one mortified look at modern white women and believe that Islam is the only way to avoid such a decrepit fate.
And it is not just the women, look at the young, Western style breed men who turn into fanatics, ready to lose their lives for a blurred promise of an imaginary honoured life after dead... What the life in the modern West helps them see is that this is the wrong way of life (for them).
KremaP: And it is not just the women, look at the young, Western style breed men who turn into fanatics, ready to lose their lives for a blurred promise of an imaginary honoured life after death... What the life in the modern West helps them see is that this is the wrong way of life (for them).
Every sign of concern from your side is seen as an arrogance... Who are you to rule out what is right and what wrong?! And yes, the Western world gives them too much evidence of the opposite...
which comes to the point....all muslims should return home...from their adopted,,,coutries......and live in peace with their own culture....in their own lands.jmo.
123whisperOPMelbourne, Victoria Australia2,116 posts
truheart1941: which comes to the point....all muslims should return home...from their adopted,,,coutries......and live in peace with their own culture....in their own lands.jmo.
But the Muslim's who doesn't want to go back in their own land's -should place loyalty to western law of the country where they live - before Sharia law and Muhammed !!!
Jul 3, 2016 7:22 AM CST Should feminist activists fight for Muslim women rights, since it effects culture of the west ?
adventure4upinehurst nc, North Carolina USA75 Posts
adventure4upinehurst nc, North Carolina USA75 posts
WESTERN LIBERALS ARE ONLY INTERESTED IN GETTING RID OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH O THE GROUNDS THAT CHRISTIAN DOCTRINE IS ANTI GAY AND MUST BE BANNED BECAUSE CHRISTIAN SERMONS INCITE ANTI GAY SPEECH AND ACTIONS> ONCE HILLIARY GETS JUST OE MORE LIBERAL ON THE EXTREME COURT THIS ARGUMENT WILL WIN AND FREEDOM OF FAITH WILL END I USA AS IT ALREADY HAS I CANADA AND UK> GAY EQUALITY AND FREEDOM OF FAITH AND SPEECH ABSOLUTELY CANNOT CO EXIST AND EVERYONE KNOWS IT. THE STATE HAS CHOSEN GAY EQUALITY NOT FREEDOM OF FAITH THE STATE IS NOT JUST UNGODLY IT IS OPENLY ANTI GOD INN USA AND EUROPE IN THE NAME OF GAY EQUALITY> WESTERN LIBERALS REMAIN SILENT AS GAYS GET THROWN OFF ROOFS I MUSLIM STATES BECAUSE ITS THE CHRISTIANS THE LIBERALS HATE NOT MUSLIMS
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Should feminist activists fight for Muslim women rights, since it effects culture of the west ?(Vote Below)
Culture matters ! It ‘s the primary source of social progress or regression. Nowhere do we see this more clearly than in the status of women. The Judeo-Christian culture —and perhaps a more apt word is civilization—has produced over time the law codes, language and material prosperity that have greatly elevated women's status.
But this progress is not shared everywhere.
There are still hundreds of millions of people that live in a culture—the Islamic, for instance—that takes female inferiority for granted. Until recently, these cultures—the Western and the Islamic—were, for the most part, separated. But that is changing. Dramatically so.
Large numbers of immigrant men from the Middle East, South Asia and various parts of Africa have brought a different set of values to the West, specifically Europe. More than a million arrived in 2015 alone. More are on the way...
As a result, crimes against girls and women—groping, harassments, assaults and rape—have risen sharply. These crimes illustrate the stark difference between the Western culture of the victims and that of the perpetrators.
Let me be clear: not all immigrant men, or even most, indulge in sex attacks or approve of such attacks, but it’s a grave mistake to deny that the value system of the attackers is radically different from the value system of the West. In the West women are emancipated and sexually autonomous. Religiosity and s*xual behaviour or s*xual restraint is determined by women's individual wishes.
The other value system is one in which women are viewed as either commodities (that is, their worth depends on their virginity), or on the level of a prostitute if they are guilty of public "immodesty" (wearing a short skirt for example).
These different value systems in the west can not coexist !!!
The question is which value system will prevail in the west remains an open question.
What do you think; what values system should prevail in the west ?
The current situation in Europe is deeply troubling: not only are Muslim women within Europe subject to considerable oppression in many ways, such norms now risk spreading to non-Muslim women who face harassment from Muslim men.
One would think that Western feminists in the United States and Europe would be very disturbed by this obvious misogyny. But sadly, with few exceptions, this does not appear to be the case.
Common among many Western feminists is a type of moral confusion, in which women are said to be oppressed everywhere and that this oppression, in feminist is "exactly the same" around the world; in the West just as in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and Iran.
This suggests too much moral relativism and an inadequate understanding of Sharia law.
It is true that the situation for women in the West is not perfect, but can anyone truly deny that women enjoy greater freedom and opportunities in the United States, France and Finland than they do in Iran, Pakistan or Saudi Arabia?
Other feminists have also argued that non-Western women do not need "saving" and that any suggestion that they "need" help from Western feminists is insulting and condescending to non-Western women.
Share your views.