The next wave of the depression (35)
Grandepensees: I second that sentiment...hear, hear!
Hard to tie them down, mind you - they scream blue murder and threaten to call the cops and, heck, in the end it's just not worth all the fuss and bother!
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depression is every week when i have to go shopping. i wish i was married. but thank god that feeling only last about 30 minutes. after shopping is done. depression is over.
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Scubadiva: In the US, the transformation from a manufacturing economy into a service economy has been ongoing for about 20 years.
Its all the more disheartning to see the car manufacturers having been bailed out because from an economic perspective, it makes NO sense at all. It's more of a symbolic act (with great psychological value), albeit an expensive one, to keep them alive.
By the way, I agree. It's not a science proper. Econometrics and the application of game- and chaos theory to economic problems are probably the closest you get to science, but that's somewhere in a realm where most people don't bother to go.
Its all the more disheartning to see the car manufacturers having been bailed out because from an economic perspective, it makes NO sense at all. It's more of a symbolic act (with great psychological value), albeit an expensive one, to keep them alive.
By the way, I agree. It's not a science proper. Econometrics and the application of game- and chaos theory to economic problems are probably the closest you get to science, but that's somewhere in a realm where most people don't bother to go.
The problem with the law of comparative advantage is that if other countries are more efficient at making EVERYTHING or providing better services than you then you can only compete by reducing your labour costs and we all know that the cost of labour is relatively 'inelastic' which poses another problem.
No worries about the Chinese though - as they get rich they'll be able to import cheaply produced American goods; it's all a lovely circle until somebody wants to jump off the merrigoround and start WW3 because they are now the losers instead of the winners.
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Scubadiva:
Now let's say for the fun of it that you're right that it's a meltdown, then what are you going to do about it?
Now let's say for the fun of it that you're right that it's a meltdown, then what are you going to do about it?
I can't do anything about the tsunami that's coming.
All I can do is to try to alert people to its approach and to how big the wave really is going to be.
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RayfromUSA: I can't do anything about the tsunami that's coming.
All I can do is to try to alert people to its approach and to how big the wave really is going to be.
All I can do is to try to alert people to its approach and to how big the wave really is going to be.
How big? 30 feet? More?
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RayfromUSA: I can't do anything about the tsunami that's coming.
All I can do is to try to alert people to its approach and to how big the wave really is going to be.
All I can do is to try to alert people to its approach and to how big the wave really is going to be.
Right... and since most people are in the same boat in that they can do nothing about it, to alert them serves what purpose? They can't run for the hill, you know.
... maybe we should start buying property in Africa?
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Scubadiva: Right... and since most people are in the same boat in that they can do nothing about it, to alert them serves what purpose? They can't run for the hill, you know.
Sure they can.
And they should.
It would have been best to make the move some years ago as soon as the coming crash could be seen.
But even now it's not to late to move to higher ground.
It's not too late until the wave hits.
Then it WILL be too late.
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RayfromUSA: Sure they can.
And they should.
It would have been best to make the move some years ago as soon as the coming crash could be seen.
But even now it's not to late to move to higher ground.
It's not too late until the wave hits.
Then it WILL be too late.
And they should.
It would have been best to make the move some years ago as soon as the coming crash could be seen.
But even now it's not to late to move to higher ground.
It's not too late until the wave hits.
Then it WILL be too late.
Okay, let's dispense with the metaphors then. Where and what's the hill, which is the way to get there.
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Getting back to the real subject of the thread, the impending collapse of the commercial property market in the US and, more generally, the complete collapse of the dollar.
Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
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RayfromUSA: Getting back to the real subject of the thread, the impending collapse of the commercial property market in the US and, more generally, the complete collapse of the dollar.
Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
If it does collapse ...I say let it ...won't be the first time and it won't be the last...Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
I personally do not worry about such things it is out of my control, and I think we need to go back to trading a chicken for a duck anyway....
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RayfromUSA: Getting back to the real subject of the thread, the impending collapse of the commercial property market in the US and, more generally, the complete collapse of the dollar.
Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
Ron Paul is a very good spokesperson for those who see the problem from a realistic rational perspective.
Ron Paul has been expressing this same POV for at least 25 years.
I do not dispute his thesis.
Yet the Inflation/Devaluation of the Dollar has become part of U.S. monetary policy dating to FDR
What's to prevent it continuing forever with no obvious ill effect besides the furthur destruction of the middle class?Some say the very existence of an affluent middle class was a bad idea in the first place.(tongue-in-cheek)
It is not novel that people turn away from paper money in times of high inflation.But you cannot eat Gold.
I claim no expertise in the area of Economics.
What are we going to use for money that cannot be manipulated by government?
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wonderworker:
...the Inflation/Devaluation of the Dollar has become part of U.S. monetary policy dating to FDR What's to prevent it continuing forever with no obvious ill effect besides the furthur destruction of the middle class?
...the Inflation/Devaluation of the Dollar has become part of U.S. monetary policy dating to FDR What's to prevent it continuing forever with no obvious ill effect besides the furthur destruction of the middle class?
Well first lets recap what has happened during the time you mentioned.
When FDR left office the dollar was at about 30 dollars to the ounce of gold. After Bretton Woods (1947) the dollar was pegged at 35 dollars to the ounce of gold. In 68 Nixon took the dollar totally off the gold standard. And since then the dollar has declined continually. The current price is about 1300 dollars to the ounce.
In other words the dollar is worth only 1/43 of what it was when FDR left office. So things are not nearly as constant and unchanging as you imagine.
What gives the illusion of constancy is the fact that America's lifestyle didn't diminish as the dollar did. That was accomplished by debt.
For decades the US managed to strong-arm the rest of the world into financing America's high lifestyle. But those days are long gone now. Ever since Iran opened up an oil exchange using Euros instead of dollars, nobody needs dollars anymore. So 100% of the dollars being created now transforms into inflation.
Imagine a con-artist who borrows from one bank to pay back the debt to another bank. Every bank gets paid back in time, but the new debt is always bigger than the old debt because it has to cover not only the original debt but also the amount spent on the lavish lifestyle and the interest. As long as a new lender can be found the scam continues. But eventually no bank will be willing to lend the amount demanded and the whole scam collapses.
That is exactly the current situation for the US. The scam has already collapsed. At present, the US is merely printing up paper money to pay its operating costs, and each dollar printed dilutes the value of every dollar already in circulation.
And meanwhile the massive national debt is still increasing just as fast as ever and the due dates for loan repayment are coming due faster and faster.
Any illusion of "business as usual" is exactly that. An illusion.
There is no comparing todays situation with that of the time of FDR or even with that of the time of Nixon.
It's only been 3 years since the world abandoned the dollar as the reserve currency and it's only been 2 years since the economy began to collapse.
Big things are happening and there is no way in the world that the US can continue to live as it has. The wolf is already at the door. America is already being carved up and sold to foreign interests and that process is accelerating.
!v=L0QoQuK4c34
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RayfromUSA: Well first lets recap what has happened during the time you mentioned.
When FDR left office the dollar was at about 30 dollars to the ounce of gold. After Bretton Woods (1947) the dollar was pegged at 35 dollars to the ounce of gold. In 68 Nixon took the dollar totally off the gold standard. And since then the dollar has declined continually. The current price is about 1300 dollars to the ounce.
In other words the dollar is worth only 1/43 of what it was when FDR left office. So things are not nearly as constant and unchanging as you imagine.
What gives the illusion of constancy is the fact that America's lifestyle didn't diminish as the dollar did. That was accomplished by debt.
For decades the US managed to strong-arm the rest of the world into financing America's high lifestyle. But those days are long gone now. Ever since Iran opened up an oil exchange using Euros instead of dollars, nobody needs dollars anymore. So 100% of the dollars being created now transforms into inflation.
Imagine a con-artist who borrows from one bank to pay back the debt to another bank. Every bank gets paid back in time, but the new debt is always bigger than the old debt because it has to cover not only the original debt but also the amount spent on the lavish lifestyle and the interest. As long as a new lender can be found the scam continues. But eventually no bank will be willing to lend the amount demanded and the whole scam collapses.
That is exactly the current situation for the US. The scam has already collapsed. At present, the US is merely printing up paper money to pay its operating costs, and each dollar printed dilutes the value of every dollar already in circulation.
And meanwhile the massive national debt is still increasing just as fast as ever and the due dates for loan repayment are coming due faster and faster.
Any illusion of "business as usual" is exactly that. An illusion.
There is no comparing todays situation with that of the time of FDR or even with that of the time of Nixon.
It's only been 3 years since the world abandoned the dollar as the reserve currency and it's only been 2 years since the economy began to collapse.
Big things are happening and there is no way in the world that the US can continue to live as it has. The wolf is already at the door. America is already being carved up and sold to foreign interests and that process is accelerating.
!v=L0QoQuK4c34
When FDR left office the dollar was at about 30 dollars to the ounce of gold. After Bretton Woods (1947) the dollar was pegged at 35 dollars to the ounce of gold. In 68 Nixon took the dollar totally off the gold standard. And since then the dollar has declined continually. The current price is about 1300 dollars to the ounce.
In other words the dollar is worth only 1/43 of what it was when FDR left office. So things are not nearly as constant and unchanging as you imagine.
What gives the illusion of constancy is the fact that America's lifestyle didn't diminish as the dollar did. That was accomplished by debt.
For decades the US managed to strong-arm the rest of the world into financing America's high lifestyle. But those days are long gone now. Ever since Iran opened up an oil exchange using Euros instead of dollars, nobody needs dollars anymore. So 100% of the dollars being created now transforms into inflation.
Imagine a con-artist who borrows from one bank to pay back the debt to another bank. Every bank gets paid back in time, but the new debt is always bigger than the old debt because it has to cover not only the original debt but also the amount spent on the lavish lifestyle and the interest. As long as a new lender can be found the scam continues. But eventually no bank will be willing to lend the amount demanded and the whole scam collapses.
That is exactly the current situation for the US. The scam has already collapsed. At present, the US is merely printing up paper money to pay its operating costs, and each dollar printed dilutes the value of every dollar already in circulation.
And meanwhile the massive national debt is still increasing just as fast as ever and the due dates for loan repayment are coming due faster and faster.
Any illusion of "business as usual" is exactly that. An illusion.
There is no comparing todays situation with that of the time of FDR or even with that of the time of Nixon.
It's only been 3 years since the world abandoned the dollar as the reserve currency and it's only been 2 years since the economy began to collapse.
Big things are happening and there is no way in the world that the US can continue to live as it has. The wolf is already at the door. America is already being carved up and sold to foreign interests and that process is accelerating.
!v=L0QoQuK4c34
yes it seems the world is about to wittness a new dictatorship on the horizion.the new world order.maybe the foreshadow of the mark of the beast.where no body can buy or sell unless they have the mark. maybe we should now be prepareing for the comeing of jesus.and the rapture.of all christians and saints from the earth. thats if you believe in them things
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royester24: yes it seems the world is about to wittness a new dictatorship on the horizion.the new world order.maybe the foreshadow of the mark of the beast.where no body can buy or sell unless they have the mark. maybe we should now be prepareing for the comeing of jesus.and the rapture.of all christians and saints from the earth. thats if you believe in them things
Those of us who do believe are ready.
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I do wish that the media's blindness were just a case of idiocy.
There might be some hope of improvement.
Unfortunately, the media is owned by the same force behind the scuttling of the economy. Globalism.
The media is actively and intentionally minimizing the economic situation because the depression and resulting chaos will be used to bring the US under globalist domination.