SilverBirch Forum Posts (3,158)

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

No hippie rants, just genuine "gentile" passion.
I see a nation so gifted yet so vicious. The persecuted become persecutors. And wonder why? Is it selective "husbandry", genetic grooming? Have all the "goodness" been Pruned out?
Revealing a "us against the world" mind set?

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

Alberta, What of the 400 Plaestinian children killed last year?

Sick old man.

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

There is no post, anywhere in any thread, where I have said killing is a viable tool in this conflict.
I am sickened by this barbarity and every senseless loss of life that happens.

Hamas is as wrong as Netanyahu with his barbarity.

United Nations forces would curtail the rocketry and the purges.
The down side is these poor soldiers would surly be at risk too.

How is it the world has focused on this "theater"?

Does it not play like the universal struggle?

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

We all know that the parties involved, Hamas and Netanyahu, don't want the United Nations in there. For Obvious reasons. But the rocket fire would be curtailed. The purges would be monitored and possibly, with time, cooler heads would prevail.

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

Albertoe! How'd you do the Large Letter Dude? That's awesome

United Nations Peace Keepers in Gaza

It is obvious that while Hamas is at the helm in Gaza the prospect for Peace is non-existant. Their charter of Death to Israel is unacceptable. Until there can be a change in leadership, hopefully with the next elections, should the United Nations introduce a peace keeping force to aid in stopping the rockets and thus reduce the threat to Israeli citizens?

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

cOME ON FOLKS, You can do it! I know a good name, " How to slaughter nine Peace Makers and get away with it!

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

How about "The Goy who JUST WON'T GO AWAY"

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Israeli Government Refuses to Secure Criminal Evidence
by Ann Wright

Despite appeals from 750 passengers on the Gaza flotilla to their governments to pressure the Israeli government to protect and return their personal belongings that were taken by Israeli commandos on May 31, 2010, when they forcefully boarded the six ships of the flotilla, the Israeli government has left millions of dollars of computers, cameras and cell phones and hundreds of thousands of cash unsecured and un-inventoried.

An Israeli newspaper has revealed that four to six computers among the hundreds that were taken from passengers on the six ships have been sold by an Israeli First Lieutenant to three junior military personnel. On August 18, a second officer was arrested in connection with the theft. An Israeli military official described the case as "embarrassing and shameful." Eitan Kabel, a member of parliament from the Labour party, told Israeli media: "This is an embarrassing, humiliating and infuriating act."

Israeli government informed of passengers' property by Embassies

Passengers from the six ships gave detailed lists of their property to consular officers from their respective Embassies while the passengers were in the Beer-Shiva prison on June 2. All passengers who were flown from Israel on June 4 to Turkey also gave another list of their possessions to consular officials in Istanbul, Turkey. Most passengers followed up with letters to their respective Ministries of Foreign Affairs or Department of State and to lawyers who will be filing lawsuits for deaths and injuries inflicted by the Israeli military and claims for stolen property.

Evidence of commandos' actions on cameras, cell phones and computers should be available for independent investigation and possible criminal cases.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Blue eyes? Comeing by for the final bash?

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Albertagoat: One thing I forgot to point out is that we feel that the ends justify the means. Kind of like the Pee Wee Herman thing or the Monika Lewinski deal. You know, like,...whatever? Or Jonathan Pollard. We try a whole bunch of stuff and hope we can, you know,...baffle them with BS,..sorta.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

There HAS to be a change or there WILL NOT be any hope for PEACE.

The only way Hamas is going to be delt with is for United Nations Observers to be introduced.

These are the prerequiste steps that MUST occur.

I would hope the international community understands this.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

As another thread draws to a close, we find ourselves, again, having accomplished nothing of consequence.

I'll start first.

Hamas is truly the real problem with the Palestinian position.
There has to be a change, on the Palestinian side with the "distruction of Israel" stance or all hope for a peaceful settlement is unatainable.

There should be a total cessation of rocket attacks.
They should allow United Nation observers in to totally disarm Hamas.

JMHO

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

More Zionist propaganda.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

And so you challenge the stance of the Christian Science Monitor?
Are they out to get you too?

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

So international opinion is clearly that the blockade is illegal.
With this logic in place the flotilla masacre was murder, pure and simple.

Gets back to my original statement that, as in the case of the Dubai assination, When a country lies, its much like when an individual lies, you just can't trust them anymore.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

The World Food program has said that 400 trucks are needed in Gaza per day, or 2,800 per week, to meet basic nutritional needs. According to Israeli data (PDF), an average of 371 truckloads of food products were delivered per week in 2009 and 310 per week so far in 2010.

Skip to next paragraph
Photo Gallery
The Gaza flotilla and the aftermath of the Israeli naval raid
.Related Stories
Was Israel's raid on Gaza Freedom Flotilla legal?
Israel's Netanyahu balks at UN investigation of Gaza flotilla raid
Israel news coverage
.Israel's legal argument for flotilla raid
Confusion remains over whether Israel extended its naval blockade from 20 to 68 miles into the open sea – or whether Israel never extended but simply intercepted the ships on grounds they had intent to bust the blockade.

Israel claims its flotilla raid was legal under the San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea. Israel says the law entitles it to enforce a blockade, even in international waters.

Clause 67 of San Remo does allow interdiction of neutral ships in a war among states if, as the clause spells out, the ship is “reasonably” suspected of “breaching a blockade.” Yet San Remo is not a consensus treaty or legally binding, according to the Red Cross; moreover, it doesn’t offer authority for extending military jurisdiction into open seas without a formal conflict.

But few legal experts agree that Israel can suspend the paramount UN Charter on the Law of the Sea to expand a blockade overnight or preemptively intercept ships.

Under the UN charter, vessels on the high seas are subject to the jurisdiction of the flag state of that vessel. No one can board. Exceptions include: a vessel that doesn’t fly a flag, a vessel suspected of being pirated, or vessels suspected of violating international sanctions, such as North Korean ships thought to carry nuclear materials. Even carrying weapons at sea doesn’t violate international law.

That’s why most international jurists say Israel cannot legally justify the boarding of a sovereign ship protected under the charter. “In legal terms, the Turkish ship [the biggest in the aid flotilla] was Turkish territory,” argues former British Ambassador Craig Murray, a fellow at the University of Lancaster School of Law.

Marcelo Kohen, a law professor at Geneva’s Graduate Institute of International Studies, agrees that the requirements needed to claim a San Remo justification were not complete. “Hamas is not a state," he says. "There is also at present a cease-fire on Gaza," whereas San Remo is assumed to be relevant in a state of war, says Kohen.

"Under logic one could maintain a maritime blockade unendingly," he adds. "It only requires one party to consider itself as being in a ‘state of war.’ ”

Gaza specialist Sara Roy at Harvard University, an author and frequent critic of Israeli policy, argues that legal questions can distort more basic issues: “After its 2005 withdrawal from Gaza, Israel claims no longer to be an occupier. It claims no responsibility, but acts with total control. Meanwhile, the international community pays the bills and feeds the people.”

I

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Israel: International law not mature enough to deal with Hamas threat
Israel sees it differently. Its justification for the flotilla attack and its Gaza policy rests on two pillars: First, Israel maintains – in the face of intense international disagreement – that Palestinians are not unduly suffering in Gaza. Second, it argues that international law is not mature enough to handle Israel’s unique security problems; Israel lives in a rough neighborhood with a threat from Hamas too severe for law professors to grasp, and it must rely on its own interpretation of international law.

Michael Oren, Israel’s ambassador to the US, told Fox News that the flotilla raid was “perfectly legal, perfectly humane,” and that “Israel acted in accord with international law.... Any state has the right to protect itself, certainly from a terrorist threat such as Hamas, including on the open seas.”

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu asserted on June 2 that Hamas continues to smuggle rockets and that “there’s no humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Each week an average of 10,000 tons of goods enter Gaza. There’s no shortage of food. There’s no shortage of medicine. There’s no shortage of other goods. So our naval personnel had no choice but to board these vessels.”

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Never mind the 'Freedom Flotilla.' Is Israel's Gaza blockade legal?
Israel has laid out a meticulous legal justification for its fatal raid on a Turkish-flagged boat, which was sailing in international waters as part of the 'Freedom Flotilla.' But most countries have focused on whether Israel's Gaza blockade is legal.

A woman and youth pass by shops in Jerusalem’s Old City June 1. Businesses were closed by Palestinians as part of general strike to protest Israel’s deadly raid on a Turkish-flagged ship bound for Gaza.

Tara Todras-Whitehill/AP
.Enlarge

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By Robert Marquand, Staff writer / June 8, 2010

Paris
Israel’s raid of a “Freedom Flotilla” of activists that ended with nine deaths brought a global firestorm of protest, dimmed the chances for a peace deal, and threatened Israel’s relations with Turkey, its closest ally in the region.

Skip to next paragraph
Photo Gallery
The Gaza flotilla and the aftermath of the Israeli naval raid
.Related Stories
Was Israel's raid on Gaza Freedom Flotilla legal?
Israel's Netanyahu balks at UN investigation of Gaza flotilla raid
Israel news coverage
.Both sides immediately claimed the protection of international law, with Israel citing legal justification for effectively extending its naval blockade into international waters where the flotilla was heading for Gaza. Yet for most Western governments, with the exception of the United States, the question is not so much the legality or illegality of Israel’s action. Rather, European countries from Germany to Britain are focusing on the broader legal context of Israel’s blockade of the Gaza Strip and the suffering of civilians there.

Lists of items forbidden to enter under the blockade include everything from canned fruit and fishing rods to musical instruments, donkeys, and nutmeg. A ban on concrete and iron, carried by the “Freedom Flotilla,” aims to stop the building of rocket-proof bunkers – but has hampered reconstruction in the wake of Israel’s 2009 offensive to stop Hamas rocket fire.

IN PICTURES: The Gaza flotilla and the aftermath of the Israeli naval raid

Three reports last month assessed the damage a year after the offensive ended. The United Nations Development Program said three-quarters of the damage “remains unrepaired and unreconstructed.” The UN's Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs noted some 40 percent of Gazans lack adequate food, while American Near East Relief found 8 in 10 people need aid. In addition, pools of untreated sewage have grown as large as 100 acres in recent months.

Why some say legality of flotilla attack is a moot point
Indeed, living conditions in Gaza are so bad that by some readings of international law, the legality of the flotilla attack is a moot point.

“There is a clear link between conditions in Gaza and international law that is relevant this week,” says Mark Ellis, executive director of the International Bar Association in London. “At the heart of humanitarian law, the laws of war, and human rights law is a need to ensure that civilians are protected and do not disproportionately suffer from the actions of a state.

“Right now, every objective assessment is that Gazans are suffering. The elephant in the room in flotilla-attack legal debates is the blockade. The real need is a focus on the legality of the conditions of people in Gaza.”

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Except....International Maritime law permits military vessels to stop and search civilian vessels on the high seas. Which is exactly the same situation of the Gaza blockaide.


Sorry ttom, You still are murdering people if you kill them during these inspections.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Sorry ttom, the US is done fighting your wars, enough of the Rumsfeld induced trickery, enough Americans dieing to defend your sorry arses.

We're not talking about Iran.

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

Gaza is a prison, Cameron was rigt

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

What benifits???????? How about slaughtering people at sea and justifying it with some lame Blockade crap!!!!!

IT WAS MURDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

The same condesending crap that you do to me still today, This aire of superiority, the omnipotence, the solipsist attitude. And yet you still feel the world is against you. Why don't you take your head out of the bloodstained sand and fess up!!! You and Netanyahu are no better than me or anybody else on this planet!! YU CAN'T MAKE UP YOUR OWN LAWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

You can't enjoy the benifits and not meet the oblgations GonmaD

The world see this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Tard??????????????????

THEY ARE WORLD OINION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You still don't get it do you??????????

RE: "Gaza is like a prison camp"

So the blockade is ilegal and the murders at sea were a war crime!!


all of the above violations are predicated on the assumption that the San Remo Manual even applies to the territorial entities involved, in this case, Gaza and Israel.



The Manual only applies to "belligerent states" and "neutral states" as clearly indicated in Section IV. Gaza, which is part of the Palestinian Occupied Territories along with the West Bank, is not a state, due in large part, ironically, to Israeli intransigence. Gaza was occupied by Israel in 1967 and, under customary international law, Israel has been the belligerent occupier of the strip since. Despite ending their colonization of the Gaza Strip in 2005 when they withdrew the colonies they had developed and populated with their civilians, Israel still maintains "effective control" over the Gaza Strip through control of its borders, air space and of course, sea lanes