Which begs the question isn't it the job of every REASONABLE muslim to INSIST their mullah sticks their head above the parapet? Or if their mullah preaches hate and violence to do something about it? Because that is not what people across the world are seeing. You, as a muslim, are allowing your religion to be hijacked by a small minority of bigoted, hate-filled, cretins. We, the non-muslim world cannot, will not and should not do anything about it because to do so would limit your freedom of religion. You as (I assume) a devout muslim MUST do the work I'm afraid.
Iuchi_Zien: Which begs the question isn't it the job of every REASONABLE muslim to INSIST their mullah sticks their head above the parapet? Or if their mullah preaches hate and violence to do something about it? Because that is not what people across the world are seeing. You, as a muslim, are allowing your religion to be hijacked by a small minority of bigoted, hate-filled, cretins. We, the non-muslim world cannot, will not and should not do anything about it because to do so would limit your freedom of religion. You as (I assume) a devout muslim MUST do the work I'm afraid.
yes we can and we should, but same thing has to be done from your side when a small minority of non muslim worlds distorted truth( like WMD) to start a violent war and kill so many innocent people every day.
notagottalottaAarhus, Central Jutland Denmark67 posts
handsonesam: there is misundrstanfing, people in both sides mix it muslims hate american government not american people americans confused they tink most mulims and arabs are terrorists what do u think lets find out reasons for both sides trying to clear it ofr both
American people...such a diverse international melting pot of cultures imported to build "The brave New World" We tend too generalise far too quickly...should we say perhaps..white america,red america,yellow america,brown america,coffee america,dark america....or is this melting pot so "stars and stripes" it has no meaning...?
mahoo: yes we can and we should, but same thing has to be done from your side when a small minority of non muslim worlds distorted truth( like WMD) to start a violent war and kill so many innocent people every day.
I assume you are talking about the war in Iraq, which had (I suspect) nothing to do with the population being Islamic. If Islam is seen as an accepting peaceful religion you take the ground out from under the hate-mongers. For example how do you preach fear about Budhists? Who, are more likely to immolate themselves than others if they disagree with you! Do you see the point? By changing the point of view of the world you show the hate-mongers up for who they really are, on both sides.
In response to: there is misundrstanfing, people in both sides mix it muslims hate american government not american people americans confused they tink most mulims and arabs are terrorists what do u think lets find out reasons for both sides trying to clear it ofr both
It's not really a "misunderstanding", it's the result of intentional bias that has been programmed into the population on both sides.
For example, the famous Arab language hi-tech media network Al Jezeera that broadcasts from Qatar (home base of the US presence in the middle east) is, and always has been, a CIA operation.
From that same station they broadcast both supposed "extremist muslim" calls for jihad and programs aimed at swaying Arabs toward western thinking.
Why?
Because the violent rhetoric (usually broadcast at times when nobody is listening) can be cited in the western media as if it typified Muslim thought (which it doesn't at all) and thereby used to generate popular support in the US for invasions and occupations and other stuff the CIA likes to do. Meanwhile the pro-western stuff is broadcast at prime-time and is aimed at long-term preparation of the Arabic speaking world for accepting western-dominated global government.
The CIA (using arab assets of course) set up Al Jezeera more than 2 decades before they actually invaded the area. That's how long-term the planning really is for such global engineering projects.
Meanwhile staged "terrorist attacks" such as 911, and the train bombings in England and Spain, were engineered to falsely blame Muslims and serve as the pretext for the actual invasions, occupations, and the like.
When it was time to invade, the globalist controlled media strongly campaigned to whip up fear and hatred of muslims in the west. But now that the occupational armies are already in place there is a gradual tapering off. Now Islam is not the problem, it's just those elusive militants who are causing all the trouble and require eternalizing the occupation, (for the sake of the local inhabitants). The shock and awe invasion and the brutal occupation have been repainted as a humanitarian endeavor to bring peace and prosperity to people who don't know how to govern themselves.
Iuchi_Zien: I assume you are talking about the war in Iraq, which had (I suspect) nothing to do with the population being Islamic. If Islam is seen as an accepting peaceful religion you take the ground out from under the hate-mongers. For example how do you preach fear about Budhists? Who, are more likely to immolate themselves than others if they disagree with you! Do you see the point? By changing the point of view of the world you show the hate-mongers up for who they really are, on both sides.
I agree Islam has nothing to do with invading Iraq , its all about oil . Earlier you were taking about perception , same way many Muslims thinks that is a war against Muslims.
I cannot really understand what you mean by Buddhists??!!Do you mean some Muslim attack Buddists ?If that is so then I tell you a what is happening in my side of the world, do you know every day Buddhist Myanmar kicks thousand of Rohingas to my poor country ? do know why? because they are Muslims
If you blame Muslims for every evil then not only you do a gross mistake but also you presents completely opposite picture.Contrary to the perception , it is Muslims who are under attack not the vice versa .hope you get my point.
Iuchi_Zien: I assume you are talking about the war in Iraq, which had (I suspect) nothing to do with the population being Islamic. If Islam is seen as an accepting peaceful religion you take the ground out from under the hate-mongers. For example how do you preach fear about Budhists? Who, are more likely to immolate themselves than others if they disagree with you! Do you see the point? By changing the point of view of the world you show the hate-mongers up for who they really are, on both sides.
It's pretty hard to take the ground out from under the hate-mongers, because they run things.
I agree that Budhists are far more likely than Muslims to actually commit suicide, However, Yankee ingenuity has come up with the perfect solution for that problem...the "Suicide Bomber" ®.
It's a labor-saving invention. I mean, why would anyone just leave their bomb-bag on a train and get off before it explodes when they could just sit comfortably and wait to be blown to bits?
And it's just so much more convenient when the suspects "self-destruct". You can say anything you like about them and invent all sorts of details about the plot that fit perfectly with your overall lies, and who's going to contradict you about it? The suspect is dead, and anyone who dares claim otherwise can be easily silenced in all "legality" under the military commissions act.
And it's all so easy to arrange. All it takes is a bomb.
The suspects don't even have to be anywhere near the scene. They just have to disappear at the right time. Any needed evidence can be "found" after the blast at the scene, in parked cars, in the suspects apartments, etc etc. etc.
mahoo: I cannot really understand what you mean by Buddhists??!!Do you mean some Muslim attack Buddists ?If that is so then I tell you a what is happening in my side of the world, do you know every day Buddhist Myanmar kicks thousand of Rohingas to my poor country ? do know why? because they are Muslims
Sorry if I did not make myself clear, what I was trying to say is that it is difficult to preach fear and religious intolerance (by anybody) against the Buddhists when it is clear that the Buddhists are not a violent religion. By the way to describe the military Junta running Burma/Myanmar as Buddhist has probably already resulted in several Buddhists self-immolating (joke! I hope!)
Iuchi_Zien: Sorry if I did not make myself clear, what I was trying to say is that it is difficult to preach fear and religious intolerance (by anybody) against the Buddhists when it is clear that the Buddhists are not a violent religion. By the way to describe the military Junta running Burma/Myanmar as Buddhist has probably already resulted in several Buddhists self-immolating (joke! I hope!)
I know but as you say its all about perception , as I found no Buddist monk oppose it(sending Rohinga).
Anyway my friend for today I am going to sign out, it is nice to share thoughts with you.
handsonesamOPgreenford, Greater London, England UK444 posts
RayfromUSA: It's not really a "misunderstanding", it's the result of intentional bias that has been programmed into the population on both sides.
For example, the famous Arab language hi-tech media network Al Jezeera that broadcasts from Qatar (home base of the US presence in the middle east) is, and always has been, a CIA operation.
From that same station they broadcast both supposed "extremist muslim" calls for jihad and programs aimed at swaying Arabs toward western thinking.
Why?
Because the violent rhetoric (usually broadcast at times when nobody is listening) can be cited in the western media as if it typified Muslim thought (which it doesn't at all) and thereby used to generate popular support in the US for invasions and occupations and other stuff the CIA likes to do. Meanwhile the pro-western stuff is broadcast at prime-time and is aimed at long-term preparation of the Arabic speaking world for accepting western-dominated global government.
The CIA (using arab assets of course) set up Al Jezeera more than 2 decades before they actually invaded the area. That's how long-term the planning really is for such global engineering projects.
Meanwhile staged "terrorist attacks" such as 911, and the train bombings in England and Spain, were engineered to falsely blame Muslims and serve as the pretext for the actual invasions, occupations, and the like.
When it was time to invade, the globalist controlled media strongly campaigned to whip up fear and hatred of muslims in the west. But now that the occupational armies are already in place there is a gradual tapering off. Now Islam is not the problem, it's just those elusive militants who are causing all the trouble and require eternalizing the occupation, (for the sake of the local inhabitants). The shock and awe invasion and the brutal occupation have been repainted as a humanitarian endeavor to bring peace and prosperity to people who don't know how to govern themselves.
RayfromUSA: It's not really a "misunderstanding", it's the result of intentional bias that has been programmed into the population on both sides.
For example, the famous Arab language hi-tech media network Al Jezeera that broadcasts from Qatar (home base of the US presence in the middle east) is, and always has been, a CIA operation.
From that same station they broadcast both supposed "extremist muslim" calls for jihad and programs aimed at swaying Arabs toward western thinking.
Why?
Because the violent rhetoric (usually broadcast at times when nobody is listening) can be cited in the western media as if it typified Muslim thought (which it doesn't at all) and thereby used to generate popular support in the US for invasions and occupations and other stuff the CIA likes to do. Meanwhile the pro-western stuff is broadcast at prime-time and is aimed at long-term preparation of the Arabic speaking world for accepting western-dominated global government.
The CIA (using arab assets of course) set up Al Jezeera more than 2 decades before they actually invaded the area. That's how long-term the planning really is for such global engineering projects.
Meanwhile staged "terrorist attacks" such as 911, and the train bombings in England and Spain, were engineered to falsely blame Muslims and serve as the pretext for the actual invasions, occupations, and the like.
When it was time to invade, the globalist controlled media strongly campaigned to whip up fear and hatred of muslims in the west. But now that the occupational armies are already in place there is a gradual tapering off. Now Islam is not the problem, it's just those elusive militants who are causing all the trouble and require eternalizing the occupation, (for the sake of the local inhabitants). The shock and awe invasion and the brutal occupation have been repainted as a humanitarian endeavor to bring peace and prosperity to people who don't know how to govern themselves.
Evidence my friend, until then it's just another theory and the world is FULL of those.
Iuchi_Zien: Evidence my friend, until then it's just another theory and the world is FULL of those.
When combatting official lies, solid evidence is hard to come by.
It is a well known disinformation tactic to demand proof that isn't attainable, and to refuse to consider any claim that contradicts the "official" story unless the claim can be "proven".
From the 27 rules of disinformation: 16. Demand complete solutions instead of conceding truth point by point...refuse to concede any truth at all as long as there is any gap in your opponent's story that you can point to.
21. Ignore evidence presented, but demand impossible proof ... that is impossible for the opponent to come by.
To be truly objective one would have to demand the same burden of "proof" from all sides.
So be specific here. What claim do you want me to prove? And can you offer any counter proof to what I say?
For example, can I prove that Al Jezeera is CIA? No. Can you prove it isn't? No.
So it comes down to a question of probability.
Qatar became "independent" in 1971. Before that, it was a British protectorate. The government is held in place by the US military.
It is ruled by a dictator whose regime is supported by the US. There is no democracy in Qatar. No elections have been held since 1970, when there were partial elections to an advisory council. Since then Council members have had their terms extended every four years.
The US has its largest military base in the world in Qatar.
I don't see any need to "prove" that Qatar is CIA controlled. Under the circumstances, that goes without saying.
RayfromUSA: When combatting official lies, solid evidence is hard to come by.
It is a well known disinformation tactic to demand proof that isn't attainable, and to refuse to consider any claim that contradicts the "official" story unless the claim can be "proven".
From the 27 rules of disinformation:
16. Demand complete solutions instead of conceding truth point by point...refuse to concede any truth at all as long as there is any gap in your opponent's story that you can point to.
21. Ignore evidence presented, but demand impossible proof ... that is impossible for the opponent to come by.
To be truly objective one would have to demand the same burden of "proof" from all sides.
So be specific here. What claim do you want me to prove? And can you offer any counter proof to what I say?
For example, can I prove that Al Jezeera is CIA? No. Can you prove it isn't? No.
So it comes down to a question of probability.
Qatar became "independent" in 1971. Before that, it was a British protectorate. The government is held in place by the US military.
It is ruled by a dictator whose regime is supported by the US. There is no democracy in Qatar. No elections have been held since 1970, when there were partial elections to an advisory council. Since then Council members have had their terms extended every four years.
The US has its largest military base in the world in Qatar.
I don't see any need to "prove" that Qatar is CIA controlled. Under the circumstances, that goes without saying.
Try to prove it isn't.
You made the Claim,Ray,it is up to you to prove it!
Iuchi_Zien: ...The Mujahedin, some of which later split away to form the Taliban was composed of genuine Afghans, mercenaries from all over the middle-east and fundamentalists who were fighting against 'an evil atheist state which violently suppressed Islam'.
Nope, sorry, that's the manufactured myth.
Afghanistan was a soviet style communist republic and friendly with the USSR. Officially, secular, of course, but then the US was, and still is, officially secular too, isn't it?
The words "atheist" and "evil" are just buzz words on your part to create emotional shock.
Although the government was secular, most Afghanis were, and still are, nominal Muslims, albeit not fanatical about it. They didn't consider secularism something worth killing over. They just kept their religion at home.
Then the US created the Mujaheddin as a mercenary force to fight, not the Russians, but Afghan troops.
Yes I can prove that the US began to fund and supply the Mujaheddin long before the Russians even entered Afghanistan. Don't take my word for it. Read the words of Zbigniew Brzezinski who brags about having created the Mujaheddin with the express purpose of baiting the Russians into sending troops into Afghanistan.
handsonesam: yes true but look some off them such as that person called conrad try to to push people to get angery to close the thread
Go fly a Kite Samuel.You are the Angry one without the Mettle to take on your wild Co-Religionists!I ain't he one that shouts in Capital Letters here like you
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Which begs the question isn't it the job of every REASONABLE muslim to INSIST their mullah sticks their head above the parapet? Or if their mullah preaches hate and violence to do something about it? Because that is not what people across the world are seeing. You, as a muslim, are allowing your religion to be hijacked by a small minority of bigoted, hate-filled, cretins. We, the non-muslim world cannot, will not and should not do anything about it because to do so would limit your freedom of religion. You as (I assume) a devout muslim MUST do the work I'm afraid.