The Gospels...The Source of Hate? ( Archived) (44)

Apr 30, 2011 5:25 PM CST The Gospels...The Source of Hate?
stringman
stringmanstringmanwallaceburg, Ontario Canada649 Threads 1 Polls 7,049 Posts
AtwoZ: Abram became father of Ishmael at the age of 86...He became father of Isak at 100...

So far so good...but...

genesis 21:16 tells us,that at there was a festivity to celebrate that Isak had stopped breastfeeeding,which means isak was 3-4 yrs old....
At this very festivity,Abraham is sending away Hagar and Ishmael,-and off they go..into the desert...

We can read that she´s carrying a child on her shoulders,and that the child cries,-even God calls Ishmael a child..

Hmmm..by this time time,-he should have been 17-18 yrs old....

14 yrs between birth,and 3-4 more yrs til Isak stopped breastfeeding....
Sarah saw Hagar's son Ishmael playing, and Sarah told Abraham to cast Hagar and Ishmael out, saying that Ishmael would not share in Abraham’s inheritance with Isaac. (Genesis 21:9–10) Sarah’s words greatly distressed Abraham, but God told Abraham not to be distressed but to do whatever Sarah told him, for Isaac would carry on Abraham’s line, and God would make a nation of Ishmael, too. (Genesis 21:11–13) Early the next morning, Abraham placed some bread and water on Hagar’s shoulder, together with Ishmael, and sent them away. (Genesis 21:14)

Hagar and Ishmael wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba, and when the water ran out, she left the child under a bush, sat down a bowshot away so as not to see the child die, and burst into tears. (Genesis 21:14–16) God heard the cry of the boy, and an angel called to Hagar, saying not to fear, for God had heeded the boy’s cry, and would make of him a great nation. (Genesis 21:17–18) Then God opened her eyes to a well of water, and she and the boy drank. (Genesis 21:19) God was with Ishmael and he grew up in the wilderness and became a bowman. (Genesis 21:20) Ishmael lived in the wilderness of Paran, and Hagar got him an Egyptian wife. (Genesis 21:21)
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May 9, 2011 8:37 PM CST The Gospels...The Source of Hate?
revealer24
revealer24revealer24Arundel, Queensland Australia62 Threads 985 Posts
AtwoZ: No,I don´t have the answer,-but I have my theories...reading the Gospels,-the "hidden" message is there...Blaming the Jewish for everything.....,without seeing it,without knowing it....Why do some people love to "misunderstand" things.....Get one thing straight,-I´´m a DEFENDER of the Judaistic/Christian culture...


You referred to Paul's writing about Jews doing this and that. He did not refer to righteous Jews who did not instigate the death of Yeshua ben Yoseph, but the evil religious Jewish leadership. He certainly did not have all Jews in mind, but only a few and those who followed them.

It was not until after the Bar Kochba revolt was crushed that the Gentile congregations became antisemitic and excommunicated all the Jewish believers. From that point the Hebraic thought was lost and these Gentiles no longer could make sense of the Jewish writings, therefore, they began to interpret them by employing a mixture of Platonism, Zoroastrianism and Pagan religious ideas, and hence historical Christianity was born.

This was the "falling away" Paul prophesied. The mystery of lawlessness (ie Torah-lessness = rejection of the Torah) was already at work, it was the Jewish disciples and their scripture teaching that restrained it. Once they were removed from the Gentile congregations the doctrinal decline was rapid and soon the man of iniquity (lawless one = Torah-less one) appeared, about whom it was believed that he claimed himself to be God.

Do you realise that the virgin-born god-man saviour, who abolished the Torah of God is the fulfillment of this prophecy?

On the contrary, the historical Yeshua ben Yoseph, the patrilinear son of David worshiped his God and upheld/strengthened/established His Torah in his life, so that those who followed in his footsteps would also do the same ("walk as he himself also walked").
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May 9, 2011 8:47 PM CST The Gospels...The Source of Hate?
revealer24
revealer24revealer24Arundel, Queensland Australia62 Threads 985 Posts
Frankinstien: You'r right on this one . Christianity is not just a religion . It's a social message as well . . . . . . .On the subject of Paul, he was the one most resposable for starting what would be Chritianity today . Peter was the official head after Jesus died but he was constantly under the influence of James . James wanted to follow strict Jewish laws and coustoms . It was Paul who went to the rest of the world making converts . He wanted both Gentiles and Jews to be a part of the new movement , and by shear weight of numbers he eventualy won out .


Contrary to the general belief Paul did not teach Gentile converts that they did not have to keep God's laws. As we read in Acts, Jacov (incorrectly called James in English bibles) asked him to offer a sacrifice to *prove* that the accusations were false.

The quest of that time was what the minimum set of laws were that new Gentile converts were required to observe. These laws, that were required of Gentiles who lived among Jews, were derived from Lev. 17-18. Gentiles were trained up in the full Torah and could convert to be part of the covenant people of God later on, but this training took years.

There was no new movement. The early disciples were considered a sect within Judaism. It became a new movement after the Jewish disciples were excommunicated after the Bar Kochba revolt was crushed and the Gentile leadership replaced Hebraic thought they did not understand with a mix of Platonism, Zoroastrianism and Pagan religious ideas they were familiar with when they interpreted the Jewish writings we publish as the bible today.
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May 9, 2011 9:17 PM CST The Gospels...The Source of Hate?
Calliopesgirl
CalliopesgirlCalliopesgirlNashville, Tennessee USA2 Threads 374 Posts
AtwoZ: Yes..it was....You misunderstand me,-I´m pointing to the anti-Judaism,-where did it start?

With satan....
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