Stress, know the second reason the cold war was called cold? Sure most think that it was because it never went hot. But they were calling cold before it ended....and none know it would not go hot?:-)
Here is the second reason it got the name. Because both side were coldly analytical to assessing the abilities of each other. Each time one got the least advantage....the other quickly adjusted and caught up.
As the nuclear club grows in number, and new technology of delivery, of stealth, of partnering occur (like NKorea selling a nuc to Iran)....the cold analytical assessments of the cold war cannot be done. It is simply to complex to assess.
Guarrantteed someone will miscalculate, under estimate, fudge a arms agreement, develop that technology they think is unstoppable.
It was hard when one only had the WARSAW Pact and NATO...China and SEATO. But this growing club of nuclear countries? With vastly different ideologies...well you have played poker in the club house.....the odds of drawing simple high pair and odds of keeping the world from doing a nuclear tango...the odds on the dance seem better to me.
Sorry Stress......that is a negative. All they need to do is add another boost section to the rocket.
But I do admit....the real threat is not a missile strike. That is national suciede with coutries that have more nucs, as the US, NATO and Isreal have.
A lot think tankers have put alot of thought into these developing situations, Stress. RAND Corp., The Strategic Studies Group, The War College, and many others, even independants like myself.
Remember early in the Dude threads....I mentioned "wiggle room"...that guys like Kim and Pres. A....you could not give 'wiggle room' to?
My take is....when President Obama....decided to go mano a mano with Kim .....the NKoreans saw it as 'wiggle room'.
Look what Pres A is doing with President Obama desire to talk. Pres A wants to do a 'debate' in the UN. What is decided or agreed to in a debate? They are not stating political positions....not for reaching agreements. Pres A wants wiggle room right now....that is why he asking for wiggle room with international opinion from a debate.
He wants the broad international community to decide if Iran has a right to nuclear materials. Of course the braod international community will say yes. Many countries want nuclear material programs. They will not limit their right to have them.
If President Obama take Pres A up on the UN debate....he truely is showing inexperience. JMO. If President Obama cannot squesse Kim like a tube of toothpaste...eg. take away his wiggle room... after Kim's nuc and missile tests....again very inexpereinced showing.
By the way....some DEMs in DC are talking arming Japan with nuc in repsonse to NKorea tests. Asking Japan to increase it military forces.
On the outside this look like a good solution. On the regional balance of power....it is a real unbalancer. China still remembers Japan's WWII activities. Japan with nucs.....scares them to no end....was a way to break the group of 6 and force China into NKorea's corner.
Iran last missile had a range of 1200 miles. And the NKorean missile was to go for about the same 1200 miles. One more boost in range.....and they are ICBMs. Not only that both have orbitting abilities presently.
Orbit the warhead, then drop it out of orbit where you want it to fall.
There are ways to reach the US other than a straight atmosphere shot. Most consider this the old and slow way that gives a long advanced warning because radars. But it is a doable solution with orbitting missiles to reach the US.
--------------------------------^------------------------ I have to admit the Powell endorsement of Obama surprised me. But for Powell to get slighted by Obama as he did.....well powerful people like Powell...don't take to that kindly. That he taying in the REP party, that he talking REP moderate values. All say he is staying REP.
Dude REP party? Last two year of the GWB adminstration, the DEMs were in control of Congress. All that pork from those years...was DEM fried and served. You cannot expect the minority party to make the legislation agenda. It has to be the majority party.
Like today. DEMs control Congress. The legislative agenda is thiers. The failouts, the pork, the new regs....all DEM. REP have a number of young canidates coming for Congress runs. Many are former military with service in iraq and Afghanistan. 2010 may not see REP in majority in Congress.....but closing the gap.
Dude...try as hard and blow as long as you can.....GWB and his administration is over. It ended Jan 20th. Just as Bush inherited some problems from Clinton. Obama inherited some from Bush. Obama's track record by the 2012 will be well established.
The problem is he is already fudging numbers. Remember when he said the stimulus packages employment goal was 4m? Then the auto industry fails....100,000 layoff and a ripple effect of 1m. Does he add that to the project number to make 5m? No.
Instead today he says the stimulus packages have saved or made 150,000 jobs. Is he subtracting from the 4m or 5m figure?
The Afghanistan war...now commonly called the Obama war....is at best a stand off. He has 3 years to figure a win. In 2012, the country will be in Afghanistan for 11 years. Without a win there.....why keep him as commander in chief....when Powell is running in 2012?
N. Korea. He breaks the group of 6....says I can do this mano a mano....NK has some missile and nucs tests....and he is running back to reset the group of 6. That is not international leadership.
Iran. Iran just said the same thing that N.Korea did. Don't inspect our ships on the high seas.....we consider it a act of war. Same reason that N.Korea has for the position? Nuclear weapon transport?
I will post my Obama report card sometime......
9/11 commission ....a bi partisan commission....looked at all the evidence within the gov't and a lot outside of the gov't. They could not find any 'actionable intelligence' that they GWB administration had to stop 9/11.
But.....until Obama comes clean with the GITMO memos.....Cheney is going press the issue. Cheney is doing exactly what VPs are suppose to do. They are the 'firebrand' for the President. The Presidents stay aloft from the political fray. Seen Biden get into this cat and dog fight? Quiet as a CA Marsh Mouse. While Obama and Polosi are engaged in it. Well Obama is engaged in it. Polosi is in it.
In the 2008, Obama got 90% of the black vote. That is 18% of the countries vote.
Say Powell runs as a REP. Then one would likely see a 50/50 split in the Black vote. That is 9 point gain in REP vote and a 9 point lose to the DEM vote.
McCain lost by 7 point. 54 to 47. The Black 10% that voted from him is very solid REP. Add the 9 black vote to McCain's 47.....55% Subtract 9 from the Obama.s 54.................................45%
The hispanic vote is the wild card with these two tickets. They vote heavily for Obama/Biden in 2008. 67% to 43%. But again say a 50/50 split. Hispanic vote is 16% of the countries vote.
Powell/Grinrich........would now be............................57% Obama/Biden....................................................43%
Assuming a near split of the womens vote, a near split of the 30-40 vote, Obama/Biden win the 20s, Powell/Grinrich win the seniors.
USA is REP in 2012. VERY INTERESTING..............
Looks like this present N. Korea situation could be President Obama's first real international crisis since taking office.
Interesting that the N. Koreans are saying if a US Navy Vessel or a S. Korean vessel stops any of their vessels....coastal (near the DMZ Line) or on the High Seas...they will consider it a act of war.
Remember under GWB the US Navy stopped N. Korean vessel carrying SCUD missiles to the middle east.
Looks like the N. Koreans are playing the el Presidente against the el Presidente card here. Only this time the stakes are greater. Now with a working nuc, North Korea Vessel could be taking it south of the DMZ or for delivery anywhere in the world.
President Obama needs to get his A Game going. Hillary is trying to get the group of 6 together. But Russia....seems to be dragging its feet some....saying....don't rush to punish North Korea. And China is staying pretty quiet, even with a flock of DEMs there now talking something of great importance....CO2 emission and global warming.
But still it comes back to President Obama...is this young man and inexperienced leader ready for such a challenge? Did he put the right team together to handle such a crisis? A crisis he had to know was coming, since North Korea had already exploded a nuc prior to his election in Nov.
The North Koreans are ready for war. War in a big way. The long range missile test, though short of American soil or Hawiian Islands....still could reach them. And now it has proven missilen with the range for both Japan and S. Korea.
Time for the A Game, President Obama...none less will keep the country and world safe.
The reason that N. Korea is rattling sabers is keep inspection of vessels coming from N. Korea.....that might have a nuc onboard. N. Korea with a working nuc is in the position to sell to the highest bidder(s)in world under ground arms market.
One of those bidders could very well be one, Osama bin Laden. Who at last report was walking into Pakistan, your home country. Now let us say for arguement sake....bin Laden is the winner of this nuc auction that the North Korean's can have.
He needs a lay over point for his nuc(s).....a place to store them, take pics and to train his people on how to use them. Think that Pakistan just might be that layover point?
How do you like a bin Laden nuc attack in Islamabad? Pakistan is not high on his like list right now. Nor is the US, UK, Europe, Saudi, Afganistan........
So if bin Laden is the winner of the North Korea Nuc auction, we all on his target list......
We will see....he is sure talking like a politician at present here. Trying to reunite the REP party behind moderate values, trying to keep his presence in the public view. I have to agree he is not like a community organizer either.....not in the least.
Think about the Collin Powell situation a little more.
Collin Powell breaks with his long time friend, John McCain to endorse Barack Obama for the Presidency. Then once elected, President Obama first makes Hillary Clinton Sect. of State. A political opponent to him. But Collin Powell's old position.
Then President Obama keeps REP Sect of Defense Gates onboard as his Sect of Defense. Now Sect. Gate is a very good administrator. But he lacks General Powell military experience. The country is two conflicts. Surely Powell with a warrior's heart, wants to be in them in some manner. President Obama kept him from the fight with this cabinet decision.
Now, former General Powell is talking about the importance of moderate REP values and positions. In the REP party where leadership is at best weak or damaged....General Powell is starting to gather moderate REP support. My guess is he is starting to move for the party leadership.......
President Obama dished him over the cabinet choices. Making political enemies after they have give you a hand to winning an election...is not smart.
Maybe Dude you are right....Powell will shift parties. But if he did not during the first 100 days? Why now when things only get harder? If he does, it looks like he playing for a position in the Obama administration....one that was denied him when Obama set his cabinet up.
But my guess.....Powell is a REP force in the 2012 in some way.
The indictment was handled down in 1998...a full two years prior to GWB/Cheney election.
Now....stop for a moment. Remember when the US went into Panama for Noreiga? What grounds did the President use for the invasion of Panama? A FED indictment of Noreiga by a Miami court.
The Manhattan conspiracy indictment of bin Laden, that I just learned also implicates both Saddam and Iran...is just another legal ground for the Iraq invasion. GWB had legal grounds with either Congress or the UN for the Iraq invasion.
Now this was done in absentia....meaning that bin Laden, Saddam, Iran were not present to represent themselves in the indictment. Such indictment are normal sealed..untill a arrest is made.
That indictment is still sitting there in a Manhattan court with one of the parties being Iran. President Obama....is getting ready to have talks with Iran. He better figure out a way to open this indictment first, find out what evidence is there to Iran's involvement and connection to bin Laden, first. Is my recommendation to him.
As said...people underestimate Cheney. He is getting ready to tap some real tough words on President Obama legacy stone.
----------------------------^------------------------- Yeah right....you would suspend paper work when a catastrophey hit....LOL.....then what happens? Think that those FEMA trailers would ever come back to the Gov't? Or that the blue tarps on roofs would ever get collected? Or that insurance companies would be able to determine actual claims from others?
Dude you prove again that your idea of Gov't is massive give aways. When good governance in a shared responsiblity of the people and the government.
Next time I run into a heart patient here in the US...I will mention that Dude....a health professional in Denmark....made the recommendation to have his/her heart treatment in Cuba. At which time I hope 911 is very close, as this heart patient is likely to soon be clutching his heart in attack.
I doubt is Americans traveling illegally to Cuba are placed on any lists here. First how would HHS know of the travel diversion? Secondly, why? Unless Fidel is getting close to Iran's President A and is trying to smuggle a nuc into Cuba.....we could care less how goes there.
Powell is still calling himself a REP. Powell knew that 2008 was not a good REP year. Maybe he just gave Obama the old dippzy doddle.The old razzle dazzle.
Gave him an endorsement...so latter, Obama cannot make him a opponnet very easily. Pretty hard to knock a guy that endorsed you for the Presidency.
But Powell can always say....hey this is not the American agenda, I signed up for when I gave the endorsement. This discrediting of American military and intelligence services by the DEMs. This massive spending in this face of economy hard times. This inability to succeed in Afghanistan (e.g. to get bin Laden).
Former General Powell.....is a pretty shrewd character...and a man with a lot of character. Add Grinrich to the ticket as VP, a Washington insider that would decimate Biden or Clinton in a one on one debate ...and you got a potent 2012 ticket for the REPs.
In four years, those 30s some that supported Obama in 2008....will be now in their late 30s and early 40s....time to do the shift in political views.....from liberal to conservative.....Powell may have it right for a run in 2012.
McCain/Palin in 2012 Palin/Romney in 2012 Romney/Palin in 2012 Palin/McCain in 2012 Grinrich/Palin in 2012 Palin/Grinrich in 2012 Romney/Grinrich in 2012 Grinrich/Romny in 2012 McCain/Romney in 2012 Romney/McCain in 2012
best yet.........
Powell/Grinrich in 2012 or Grinrich/Powell in 2012
Powell is still a REP and is fighting presently for Moderate REP views......interesting, very interesting......as they use to say on Laugh In.
Yesterday in a C-Span interview with Steve Scully, President Obama announced.......
"WE ARE OUT OF MONEY NOW. WE ARE OPERATING IN THE DEEP DEFICITS, BUT NOT CAUSED BY ANY DECISION WE MADE ON HEALTH CARE SO FAR. THIS IS THE CONSEQUENCE OF THE CRISIS WE HAVE SEEN, AND IN FACT OUR FAILURE TO MAKE GOOD DECISION ON HEALTH CARE ON HEALTH CARE OVER THE PAST SEVERAL DECADES."
DUH.....................I guess the $1.5 trillion in failouts had nothing to do with it........
Article has a graph showing where the deficits go in the near future......more red than than a filled ink cartridge syrienge for the Cyan color.......
A recent quote from President Obama regarding Iran and its nuclear programs at the US Naval Academy Graduation Services. "There is a limit to negotiations."
Now let us put some dots together.
North Korea just detonated a 10-20 Kilo ton nuclear device. North Korea supplied the P-2 and P-3 centrifuges to Iran. Iran just tested a missile with a 1200 mile range.
Those are the simple hard facts. Now some dots connecting.
North Korea proved to Iran that any nuclear device design it has also provided, it is a functioning system with the nuclear test. Iran now does not need to conduct its own test to gain confidence in the design.
Iran has a delivery system...to Europe, to Israel, to American bases in the region. Iran also has a strong ties to terrorist groups in the region another delivery means to Isreal, the west and America.
Iran has plenty of oil money. North Korea is nearly broke. North Korea is not part of the atomic commission....so none knows how many nucs it really has. So if they traded in illegal nuclear system in the past, then why not again? Only this time a nuclear device?
Iran does not need to make a nuclear device, all it needs to do is buy a couple.
So?
President Obama, when is the negotiation limit reached?
Iran's President A wants to debate President Obama in the UN in Sept after a election win next month.
Hmmmmmmm...not sure if this is the kind of face to face talks that President Obama had in mind. If he wins the debate, Iran gets the status of being on the floor with a super power. If he does mea culpas for past American mistakes in the UN, the US loses status. If he loses the debate, his prestige around the world suffers.
------------------------------^------------------------------ If those Cuban DR and Nurses were sent to New Orleans....with out any kind of medical mal practice insurance.....and screwed up a operations or procedure....who was the American patient going to sue? The Cuban Gov't? The Cuban government medical insurance carrier? The DR and his non existing medical carrier?
Dude, it is easy to offer assistance, when you know it legally cannot be accepted.
The US is the most litigated country in the world. Surely having foreign DRs and Nurse working in the country was going to cause law suits. They don't have AMA board qualifications. Nor would I trust Fidel Castro to send people with any kind of medical background....
And what are the standard of your $85,000 medical center in Cuba? Dude....the reason we has such things as the AMA (American Medical Association) is set high standards to the level of medical care in the country. We are not the frigin Cubans.....
We had this debate on Obama's funding of abortions in 3rd world and carribean islands. Sure it is cheap. Because the facilities are less than clean and hygienic, the DRs have dirt under their finger nails, there is one bottle of pain killer on the shelf, and the instrument sterilezer has not worked for a week.
But you did not answer me....did you have a surgery there? Or would you advice a relative to?
President Obama did not try to correct his supporters prior to the election on thier GWB or McCain attacks and they were pretty vile attacks. I remember the Jenna Bush marriage photos in Huffington Post.
When he did not condemn them, most here figured he was either giving some approval or even promoting such. What went around, comes around sad to say.
I never said my country men were perfect or even always right....they were and are simply....my countrymen. One need to have tolerance and patient, the best one can in these trying times of economic crisis and a leadership less Washington.
-----------------------------^--------------------------------- What is this attack 'us all' bit? If Europeans felt that way after 9/11, they would have been in Afghanistan from day one.
Rather European leaders decided to see which way the winds were blowing before any commitments to be there or any were else.
Now that Iraq is settling down....I just wish the Iraqi people and Malki gov't think thru who they are selling their oil to....e.g. Europe. Then would double or triple their sales to Japan and South America. Let that petro price in Europe....go to EU8+ per gallon...let you send more EUs to Russia...to buy your oil.
That is really want Europeans want to do. Like you, they see coming closer to Russia as a means to assure peace. There is a way to do it.
Personally? I think that is a wrong conclusion/decision to make.
But hey if you wish to have Russians running around in your countries again....no big deal to me or most Americans. When they suppress your votes, and play games with your financial records, and drive thier T-82 tanks around.....you can stand in front of them like that single Chinese did in Tiannemen Square.
Are you telling me that the socialist Chinese police and military were not brutal in the recent Tibetian affair? Or in the past Tieannean Square affair?
Dude.....Nancy Polosi is presently in China...in the past she has hung a flag supporting the Tiennean Square posters and has pics of walking with the Daili Lama in her website. NOW, when it politically expedious, she agreed not to discuss human right violation of the Chinese gov't...to have this meeting on the environment and global warning with them.
Nice mix of capitolism and socialism, my rubie red behind.
How do you think that those socialist leaders in Russia got their summer homes in Odessa and on the Black Sea? While of a family of 5 is Moscow was getting an 3-4 room apartment, the leaders of Russia had multiple houses around the country?
By living to the socilist rules that they drafted?
Everywhere socialism has gone it acquires wealth for the few in power. They mazke the laws, feel empowered to use the laws to their personal benefit. At least when that greedy CEO of a US firm give millions in bonus to their staff....they will then go and spend the millions for their summer homes and someone else benefits. With socialism they simply write a law...and no one benefits but the leaders.
One of the suggestions for the GITMO prisoners, is to reopen the Alcatrass Prison for them. Alcatrass is a island prison in San Franisco bay...only 3 have ever escaped from it.
Nancy Polosi....whose district it is in......reported to have said no to the proposal.
Guess she does not want the millions in FED spending for upgrading and staffing a high security prison for GITMO detainees in her district of the US. During a time of recession.
I wonder why?
Maybe because over the course of time since GITMO has opened, there has been intelligence of possible AlQeada attacks on the base to set the prisoners free?
Maybe Polosi is saying....I don't want bunch of my voters being in some AlQeada plot to release the GITMO prisoners.
But if this is her position, why should any other Congressman or Senator position be any different? The countries only FED maximum high security prison is also in CA. According to Senator Boxer it is already overcrowded and has a waiting list.
The Senate vote not to close GITMO until President Obama came up with a plan was 94-6. One would have thought that since President Obama suggested to use the countries only maximum high security prison....every Senator would have known it was in CA.....not their state. Yet, they still voted it down nearly by 100% vote.
Just maybe President Obama has a real credibility problem with the Senate.....
Jenea....yes some units did leave the US without armored HumVees or without body armor. One of the main routes into Iraq takes the units thru Kuwiat. As they go thru Kuwait, several things happen.
1) They are several stocking bases in Kuwait to bring the unit's equipment to its authorized and is issued to them.
2) Out going units, turn in their HumVees and other equipment in Kuwait, so that incoming units could use them.
National Guard units would sometime get caught in the middle of this. National Guards units have their own equipment here in the US, sometime it was shipped to middle east following their deployment. So they might be in country while it caught up with them.
There was a shortage of armored HumVee at the beginning. But new armoring contracts changed that over time.
So we are to feel sorry for Castro? This liberatro of the Cuban people.....this man that uses his security forces to oppress them for years. Feel sorry for him, because he is a leader in a small country?
I picked this up in the book....The Last Days of Fidel. Castro and security forces would arrest 100s, if not 1000s after the Bay of Pigs affair....each time in Miami there was some rumor of an invasion attempt. Of course after the Bay of Pigs....rumor to another were very common.
Each time....the Cuban people not on the list of Castro were arrested...then interrogated. Not in such a kind manner as normal GITMO interrogations either. They were usually beaten.
Socialism does not scare me or anyone that love freedom and democracy.
As for the $53m in med and food. I would not extort the food and med. Only a few month later, Russia was shipping missiles to Cuba and the Cuban missile crisis began. I would have gone to Russia...ask that had food and med be shipped....instead of missiles...that likely cost more than the $53m.
No, I would not kill men (prisoners) so that a extortion payment of med and food would occur.
ttom500 Forum Posts (10,523)
in it.
list of Castro were arrested...then interrogated. Not in such a kind manner as normal GITMO interrogations either. They were usually beaten.
RE: Obama Rocks! Today! the most serious attempt against more wars!
Stress, know the second reason the cold war was called cold? Sure most think that it was because it never went hot. But they were calling cold before it ended....and none know it would not go hot?:-)Here is the second reason it got the name. Because both side were coldly analytical to assessing the abilities of each other. Each time one got the least advantage....the other quickly adjusted and caught up.
As the nuclear club grows in number, and new technology of delivery, of stealth, of partnering occur (like NKorea selling a nuc to Iran)....the cold analytical assessments of the cold war cannot be done. It is simply to complex to assess.
Guarrantteed someone will miscalculate, under estimate, fudge a arms agreement, develop that technology they think is unstoppable.
It was hard when one only had the WARSAW Pact and NATO...China and SEATO. But this growing club of nuclear countries? With vastly different ideologies...well you have played poker in the club house.....the odds of drawing simple high pair and odds of keeping the world from doing a nuclear tango...the odds on the dance seem better to me.