Only real losers support Obama ( Archived) (54)

Feb 2, 2011 12:52 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
FreddyFudpucker
FreddyFudpuckerFreddyFudpuckerObamaville, Indiana USA10,179 Posts
omgamike: http://www.cepr.net/documents/publications/Economists_letter_2008_11_19.pdf

The above link will get you a letter, signed by many, many economists, who went on record supporting the need for a massive stimulus. These economists are from almost every state in the union -- and their position was supported by the Center for Economic Policy and Research.
These are my facts, where are yours?


open your sun roof and look up. cool
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Feb 2, 2011 1:04 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
JeanMarlow
JeanMarlowJeanMarlowMiddle of Nowhere, California USA17 Threads 815 Posts
omgamike: http://www.cepr.net/documents/publications/Economists_letter_2008_11_19.pdf

The above link will get you a letter, signed by many, many economists, who went on record supporting the need for a massive stimulus. These economists are from almost every state in the union -- and their position was supported by the Center for Economic Policy and Research.
These are my facts, where are yours?
Yes, good point.
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Feb 2, 2011 1:07 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike
omgamikeomgamikeElkins, West Virginia USA1 Threads 122 Posts
(A letter in support of the stimulus from the CBO)

April 17, 2008

Honorable John D. Rockefeller IV
Chairman
Subcommittee on Health Care
Committee on Finance
United States Senate
Washington, DC 20510

Dear Mr. Chairman:

This letter responds to your request for an assessment of the economic stimulus that would result from providing fiscal relief to states through either an increase in federal Medicaid assistance and general grants to states, or through an increase in funding for infrastructure projects. (CBO discussed a variety of options aimed at economic stimulus in its recent paper, Options for Responding to Short-Term Economic Weakness.)

Fiscal Relief to States During economic downturns, state and local governments experience a reduction in revenues resulting from the effect of lower economic activity on sales, income, and other tax bases. Unlike the federal government, which faces no statutory or constitutional requirement to balance its annual budget, almost all states have some version of a balanced budget requirement, although the stringency varies. As a result, when state revenues decline sufficiently to create a budget deficit, most states reduce spending or increase taxes (or do some combination of both) to address the resulting fiscal problem.

Such reductions in spending or increases in taxes constrain aggregate demand in the economy, which tends to worsen the decline in economic activity.

Some proposals would provide financial assistance to certain states through higher federal Medicaid matching rates and through general grants outside of the Medicaid program. Under current law, Medicaid matching rates vary across states, but range from 50 percent to 76 percent, and average about 57 percent. You asked about the effect of a proposal that would target the financial assistance to states in greater economic stress—as determined by Honorable John D. Rockefeller IV

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formula that ranks states by recent increases in participation in the Food Stamp program, unemployment, and housing foreclosures.

In general, the extent to which additional federal aid to state and local governments would help stimulate demand depends on the degree to which those governments would alter their behavior.

If they were to cut spending less or raise taxes less as a result of federal aid, the federal assistance would help keep aggregate demand from falling as much. Targeting federal aid to
states that are experiencing economic difficulties would increase the cost-effectiveness of that assistance because the states receiving the funds would be the ones most likely to be experiencing fiscal difficulties and thus the most likely to change their spending or tax policies as a result.

(see next post)
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Feb 2, 2011 1:07 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike
omgamikeomgamikeElkins, West Virginia USA1 Threads 122 Posts
Infrastructure Spending

You also asked about the stimulative impact of spending on infrastructure projects. Although some increase in spending for infrastructure may be justified in terms of improved efficiency and productivity for the U.S. economy, a substantial portion of such spending generally occurs well after funding is provided for such projects. In the case of highways, for example,
most federally funded highway infrastructure projects take years to plan and construct. Most projects require state governments to match a share of federal construction funds. Although the Congress can require states to obligate funds quickly, it cannot mandate the pace of construction or the rate at which the states spend federal funds.

A variety of factors outside of governmental control, such as the weather, environmental concerns, and the availability of construction supplies and personnel, influence the pace of project expenditures. Even the reconstruction of the I-35W bridge in Minnesota—on which crews are working around the clock—is estimated to take a year and a half to complete.

Currently, planning for the summer construction season— including road resurfacing—is already underway. Some smaller, routine road projects such as resurfacing might be able to proceed in the next few months, but on net it is unlikely that providing more highway funds in fiscal year 2008 would have a significant stimulative effect over the next 12 months.

Honorable John D. Rockefeller IV

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I hope this information is useful to you. If you have further questions, do not hesitate to call me.

Sincerely,

Peter R. Orszag
Director

cc: Honorable Max Baucus, Chairman Committee on Finance
Honorable Charles E. Grassley, Ranking Member
Honorable Orrin G. Hatch, Ranking Member
Subcommittee on Health Care
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Feb 2, 2011 1:13 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike
omgamikeomgamikeElkins, West Virginia USA1 Threads 122 Posts
It's funny, though, how Keynesian economics has bailed out our economy more than once -- and will again if the GOP and blue dog dems would get out of the way and let the economics work as they were envisaged.
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Feb 2, 2011 1:14 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike: It's funny, though, how Keynesian economics has bailed out our economy more than once -- and will again if the GOP and blue dog dems would get out of the way and let the economics work as they were envisaged.
......or pushed it a notch deeper in the Hole!
Kicking the Can a bit further down the Road!laugh
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Feb 2, 2011 1:23 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike
omgamikeomgamikeElkins, West Virginia USA1 Threads 122 Posts
Only time and politics will tell!
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Feb 2, 2011 1:28 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
FreddyFudpucker
FreddyFudpuckerFreddyFudpuckerObamaville, Indiana USA10,179 Posts
omgamike: It's funny, though, how Keynesian economics has bailed out our economy more than once -- and will again if the GOP and blue dog dems would get out of the way and let the economics work as they were envisaged.


When was the last time Keynsian economics worked? It sure didn't do anything in the 30's.

If Keynsian economics worked, we would never have a recession. The government has been wasting money for 30 years...both Democrat and Repubicans.
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Feb 2, 2011 8:29 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike
omgamikeomgamikeElkins, West Virginia USA1 Threads 122 Posts
We will always have recessions. Keynsian economics will not prevent a recession. What it does is tell you what to do to get out of a recession quicker than what those trickle down type of people believe in.
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Feb 4, 2011 11:19 PM CST Only real losers support Obama
RayfromUSA
RayfromUSARayfromUSAvienne, Rhone-Alpes France86 Threads 29 Polls 6,611 Posts
omgamike: We will always have recessions. Keynsian economics will not prevent a recession. What it does is tell you what to do to get out of a recession quicker than what those trickle down type of people believe in.


This is no "recession".
It's a total economic collapse on a global scale.

And the dollar will fall a thousand times more than other currencies because of the massive US debt.

This is the death of the US economy and nation.
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Feb 5, 2011 2:38 AM CST Only real losers support Obama
omgamike: We will always have recessions. Keynsian economics will not prevent a recession. What it does is tell you what to do to get out of a recession quicker than what those trickle down type of people believe in.
actually it precipitates them!
On a Global scale as we see now!
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Feb 5, 2011 2:41 AM CST Only real losers support Obama
RayfromUSA: Anybody with a brain knows that Obama represents only the Wall Street crooks and international financiers who bankrolled his campaign.

He didn't keep a single one of his campaign promises.

And he has run up the debt to the tune of 4 or 5 more trillion (2 trillion for the bailout and stimulus alone, another 2 trillion for the continued wars and occupations plus untold billions of waste resulting from his healthcare scam).

He inherited a failing economy and promptly did all he could to finished it off as fast as possible.

History will blame him for the coming depression.


Wow, he sounds like 90% of the presidents we ever had

Voting for republican or Democrat is an illusion of choice. If we want control of our country we should vote on issues, not representatives that do anything but represent the people.
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Feb 5, 2011 2:41 AM CST Only real losers support Obama
Conrad73: actually it precipitates them!
On a Global scale as we see now!
Because it centralizes the Economy in the Hands of a few Decision-Makers!
When they screw up,it is a Screwup of immense proportions,affecting the whole economy,instead just a part of it!
Keynes ought to have stuck to whatever ha was doing in his Sparetime!doh
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Feb 5, 2011 3:00 AM CST Only real losers support Obama
dave471963
dave471963dave471963terre haute, Indiana USA20 Posts
ooby_dooby: What do you call people who support Bush or Palin, winners?
BTW Obama averted a depression with his stimulus programs and the stock market has been on a tear for a year, all economic indicators are pointing up, granted some take longer to correct like jobs but as the economy continues to improve companies will be hiring in fact they already are. There will be no depression. You're a loser, a sore loser.
How come you never talk about Nicolas Sarkozy? Oh I know why, he's irrelevant just like France.


1. The inventory cycle is going the wrong way in the first part of 2011; moving to net-neutrality towards impact on GDP growth. As a side note, Orszag noted that the sequential improvement in GDP in the third quarter was unintentional as some firms were caught out by the slump in demand during the summer and unintentionally built up inventories. That trend, Orszag expects, will reverse itself in the fourth quarter and the early part of 2011.
2. The Recovery Act, despite the controversy, added 2% or more to GDP in the first half of 2010. By design, the act called for all the money to be "out the door" by the end of September. Going forward, the cost of the Recovery Act will be net neutral and eventually – in terms of cash flow – will be net negative to GDP growth.
3. The final factor is state and local deficits, which are projected to be $100 to $150 billion a year for the next two years. Going forward, a much smaller share of them will be offset by federal subsidies, therefore a much larger share of the deficits will need to be reduced through tax increases and spending cuts at the state and local level.

Taking points two and three together added a net 2% to GDP in first half of 2010 and will be a negative 2% to growth in the first half of 2011. If you then add the positive inventory cycle of 3.4% in the first half of 2010, you get the total contribution to GDP growth from the three factors of 5.4% during the first half of the year.

Depending on your view of the inventory cycle, we are looking at a potential year-over-year swing in GDP in the first half of 2011 of around 5.4%, which becomes a headwind in the next 12 to 24 months. At best, we are looking at 0%-2% GDP growth for the next 12-24 months.

What does all this mean for the consumer and the unemployment rate? Under a good scenario, it's going to be a hard slog of 1-2% GDP growth, which will prove to be inadequate to reduce the unemployment rate. Here's the rule of thumb on this: Take whatever the GDP growth rate is, subtract 2.5%, and divide by two to get to the percentage change in unemployment. So, to get a 1% reduction in the unemployment rate you need GDP growth of 4.5% for one year (4.5 minus 2.5 divided by 2).

Given the GDP headwinds outlined on the call, it seems unlikely that the unemployment rate will improve meaningfully any time soon. This is particularly problematic for U.S. corporations levered to domestic demand.
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