Authentic Self (132)
Circlip: I don't get it, bod. The very fact that you depend on pronouns like, "I" and "we", to explain why there is no such thing as self, sort of undermines the idea, doesn't it?
They are words, and what they are relating to is a concept but only in the mind. Buddhist teachings say, outside the mind none of these concepts exist. The mind is made up of the 5 precepts, all of which are empty of individual existance. What you are then left with is the body, but even that doesn't exist independently from it's own side.------ This thread is Archived ------
bodleing2: They are words, and what they are relating to is a concept but only in the mind. Buddhist teachings say, outside the mind none of these concepts exist. The mind is made up of the 5 precepts, all of which are empty of individual existance. What you are then left with is the body, but even that doesn't exist independently from it's own side.
But it is only a matter of how you look at it. I mean if you play around with words a bit you can claim just about anything to be the case. Unless we are told any different, and believe it, we take it for granted that there is self. Why would we want to talk ourselves out of that belief? If I am not a self, I still must be something, and no matter how I look at it, that something has to be my self.
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bodleing2: They are words, and what they are relating to is a concept but only in the mind. Buddhist teachings say, outside the mind none of these concepts exist. The mind is made up of the 5 precepts, all of which are empty of individual existence. What you are then left with is the body, but even that doesn't exist independently from it's own side.
That it is one mind is what confounds me because of how well structured and magnificent it is I guess. I think a grasp of infinity is easier.oh wait, that's the same thing.
I don't quite get the precept labels.
but what are labels anyway.------ This thread is Archived ------
Circlip: But it is only a matter of how you look at it. I mean if you play around with words a bit you can claim just about anything to be the case. Unless we are told any different, and believe it, we take it for granted that there is self. Why would we want to talk ourselves out of that belief?
If I am not a self, I still must be something, and no matter how I look at it, that something has to be my self.
That could just be perception conceptualising.If I am not a self, I still must be something, and no matter how I look at it, that something has to be my self.
Sometimes it could be useful to go beyond the confines of words and observe.
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BB_snickers: That it is one mind is what confounds me because of how well structured and magnificent it is I guess. I think a grasp of infinity is easier.
oh wait, that's the same thing.
I don't quite get the precept labels. but what are labels anyway.
My mind can't quite grasp infinity, even if I thought about it forever.oh wait, that's the same thing.
I don't quite get the precept labels. but what are labels anyway.
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bodleing2: That could just be perception conceptualising.
Sometimes it could be useful to go beyond the confines of words and observe.
Okay, well it's time my perception was in bed, bod, goodnight. Sometimes it could be useful to go beyond the confines of words and observe.
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bodleing2: My mind can't quite grasp infinity, even if I thought about it forever.
I have to reread your first post about the precepts and the definitions. I am multi-tasking here so missing some cognition, plus whenever buddhist terms are thrown in my mind goes ... wtf ... like throwing a bunch of stones into the calm pond of my mind.
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Circlip: Okay, well it's time my perception was in bed, bod, goodnight.
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BB_snickers: I have to reread your first post about the precepts and the definitions. I am multi-tasking here so missing some cognition, plus whenever buddhist terms are thrown in my mind goes ... wtf ... like throwing a bunch of stones into the calm pond of my mind.
Just trying to keep the thread going Al...
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bodleing2: Just trying to keep the thread going Al...
you guys are the cones to my ice cream.
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bodleing2:
"Very basically, the Buddha taught that "you" are not an integral, autonomous entity. The individual self, or what we might call the ego, is more correctly thought of as a by-product of the skandhas.
On the surface, this appears to be nihilistic teaching. But the Buddha taught that if we can see through the delusion of the small, individual self, we experience that which is not subject to birth and death."
Okay, I've been through it again, and I get the principle. It still seems possible to consider this conglomeration of elements as constituting the self though, which does have implications, but doesn't really make any difference to the actual experience of being aware of the self. "Very basically, the Buddha taught that "you" are not an integral, autonomous entity. The individual self, or what we might call the ego, is more correctly thought of as a by-product of the skandhas.
On the surface, this appears to be nihilistic teaching. But the Buddha taught that if we can see through the delusion of the small, individual self, we experience that which is not subject to birth and death."
So, in your understanding, when we refer to the self, do we usually just mean our consciousness?
Anyway, if I accept that "an individual is a combination of five aggregates of existence", which I don't actually disagree with, what implications does it have for the way I should live my life?
I also agree with you that it is a fascinating subject to explore. When I do start to think about it, though, one of the first questions that arises for me is, where does spirituality come into it? To me, it just seems like a matter of metaphysics.
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But... as far as I'm aware there are more than 5 senses because it's possible to sense/grasp 'information' that is not being seen or touched or heard or tasted or smelt. It is being sensed intuitively or energetically/vibrationally...
'Emptiness' is really quantum science being taught 2500 years before it was even considered in the west.