Paul Harvey (17)
Paul Harvey is way off base...America was not founded on "Christian" principles. Jesus is not mentioned in the Constitution or the Declaration of Independence. God is mentioned!.
America was founded on the principle of FREEDOM OF RELIGION...not Christianity!!
America was founded on the principle of FREEDOM OF RELIGION...not Christianity!!
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Vey true, There is no mention of Christ in either of those documents. People have been arguing the "America founded on Christian Principles" since the country was created. It's easy to make either arguement and it would be really pointless to beat that dead horse here.
I think the more important message here is that a majority of the American people are losing their Freedom of Religeon rights in the name of political correctness.
Anyway, thanks for posting.
I think the more important message here is that a majority of the American people are losing their Freedom of Religeon rights in the name of political correctness.
Anyway, thanks for posting.
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This is a good post Sparky!
Wouldn't Freedom of Religion include our rights to express our religious beliefs even tho Athiests don't like it???
Just as they believe they have the right to express that they don't like us doing so???
DUH!?!
Wouldn't Freedom of Religion include our rights to express our religious beliefs even tho Athiests don't like it???
Just as they believe they have the right to express that they don't like us doing so???
DUH!?!
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I think you are right. My only disagreement with all that was said...is the fact that America was founded not on Christian ideals, as the fundementalist would say. But rather on the premise of freedom of religion
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Is Jesus not also God? He is called The Son of God. He calls God His Father. Jesus said " I and the Father are one"
As a matter of fact, the God of the old testament was none other than the one who became Jesus.
1 Corinthians 10:1 - 4
1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
As a matter of fact, the God of the old testament was none other than the one who became Jesus.
1 Corinthians 10:1 - 4
1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
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Jefferson read the Koran so he could KNOW THE ENEMY!!!
Read your History.
Read your History.
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I don`t think you can separate Christian principles from belief in God.
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I agree...but you can separate a belief in God from Christian principles. The Jews have been doing it for at least two thousand years
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Thomas Jeffersons copy of the Koran was the second edition of a 1734 translation by George Sale, published in London in 1764. He bought it in 1765 while studying law at the College of William and Mary in Williamsburg. It's most likely that he was studying it as a legal text, but he may also have been interested in it for comparative religion purposes. He sold the Koran to the Library of Congress in 1815, and it was rebound by them in 1918.
from: Wiki
from: Wiki
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And?????
I read the Koran and the Bible almost every day
I read the Koran and the Bible almost every day
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I guess that depends on how one defines belief in God, and what one believes to be Christian principles.
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this is why these threads are useless. people are already dug in and not willing to hear other views.
There is one fact here and no one wants to admit to it! The Constitution is not a Christian Document!! It is a Godly document...and those two terms are not synonomous
continue this among yourselves. Happy Days to All
There is one fact here and no one wants to admit to it! The Constitution is not a Christian Document!! It is a Godly document...and those two terms are not synonomous
continue this among yourselves. Happy Days to All
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The Constitution is neither a Christian nor a Godly Document. I think the discussion was weather it was founded on Christian principles or Godly principles, which I see as one in the same.
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Good observation. Christ is certainly not the founding inspiration of the US and never was. Not only is the term Christ, or Christian totally missing from all the "founding papers/ documents" but never once has a US President ever uttered the name Christ; it has always been this rather vague term "God". The question is or should be, which God? There is the Christian belief that God and Christ are synonymous; that they are same...they most certainly are not.
None of the so called "founding fathers" ever referred to themselves as Christians; their words are and have been very carefully chosen. The majority if not all were Freemasons; Freemasons are anything but Christians.
Compare the Old Testament "God" with Christ; they are incompatible with one another precisely because they are not the same, if they were, then a clear case of split/ dual personality is affirmed; one is as different from the other as day is from night, which leaves us with a problem. How do you reconcile the glaring differences. One if for wars, bloodshed, hate and revenge, while the other if for peace, love of one another, treating everyone as a member of your own family...can't be the same. Start then in tracing back this Old Testament God and see how and from where it evolved in the history of the ancient Middle East and you will end up in ancient Babylon and this "God" was not Marduk, but goes even further back to the origins of all the ancient Gods; to Sumer; the Sumerians whose ancient histories and Gods were taken virtually word for word by those who became Jews; it was they who adopted the ancient Sumerian God of "evil" known by various names; it was to them this ancient God manifested itself as Yaw-we. Start reading about these things before you start debating or arguing about God or any other related topic on religion; there are tons of good, reliable books written by good, reliable, famous historians, experts on all the ancient languages of the Middle East with no agendas to push; just the bare facts and guidance for the novices who have never read any of this wealth of material before, as they have their noses to the everyday grindstone trying to make a living and keep a roof over their heads. Most of you are way out of your depths regarding this and most other topics because you don't read, or can't read well enough to comprehend what you are reading, but that is no excuse not to try.
Search out who was this Yaw-we creature, read some of the apocryphal books on Christ; expand your knowledge, your mind and one day if you ever in the actual chambers of the US Supreme Court and see what is on all the walls, you'll know what you are really seeing, what God surrounds the chamber of those "anti Christian" judges who have outlawed your school prayers, your Manger scenes even from the front of your churches at Christ-mass time etc. etc. Christians are the last people to have any "judicial equality" in any Federal Court, let alone the Supreme Court...find out why, for yourself and who knows, one day you may end up as a qualified teacher at a university!
None of the so called "founding fathers" ever referred to themselves as Christians; their words are and have been very carefully chosen. The majority if not all were Freemasons; Freemasons are anything but Christians.
Compare the Old Testament "God" with Christ; they are incompatible with one another precisely because they are not the same, if they were, then a clear case of split/ dual personality is affirmed; one is as different from the other as day is from night, which leaves us with a problem. How do you reconcile the glaring differences. One if for wars, bloodshed, hate and revenge, while the other if for peace, love of one another, treating everyone as a member of your own family...can't be the same. Start then in tracing back this Old Testament God and see how and from where it evolved in the history of the ancient Middle East and you will end up in ancient Babylon and this "God" was not Marduk, but goes even further back to the origins of all the ancient Gods; to Sumer; the Sumerians whose ancient histories and Gods were taken virtually word for word by those who became Jews; it was they who adopted the ancient Sumerian God of "evil" known by various names; it was to them this ancient God manifested itself as Yaw-we. Start reading about these things before you start debating or arguing about God or any other related topic on religion; there are tons of good, reliable books written by good, reliable, famous historians, experts on all the ancient languages of the Middle East with no agendas to push; just the bare facts and guidance for the novices who have never read any of this wealth of material before, as they have their noses to the everyday grindstone trying to make a living and keep a roof over their heads. Most of you are way out of your depths regarding this and most other topics because you don't read, or can't read well enough to comprehend what you are reading, but that is no excuse not to try.
Search out who was this Yaw-we creature, read some of the apocryphal books on Christ; expand your knowledge, your mind and one day if you ever in the actual chambers of the US Supreme Court and see what is on all the walls, you'll know what you are really seeing, what God surrounds the chamber of those "anti Christian" judges who have outlawed your school prayers, your Manger scenes even from the front of your churches at Christ-mass time etc. etc. Christians are the last people to have any "judicial equality" in any Federal Court, let alone the Supreme Court...find out why, for yourself and who knows, one day you may end up as a qualified teacher at a university!
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Ship, I don't think they're really useless. to me, it's intersting to see how and why people think/believe the way they do. You made some really valid points and I appreciate your contributions to this thread.
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Thanks,
Perhaps Paul's message would have been clearer had he not used the term "Christian Principles". If he had concentrated more on the loss of religeous freedoms it may have been better received.
Anyway, thanks
Perhaps Paul's message would have been clearer had he not used the term "Christian Principles". If he had concentrated more on the loss of religeous freedoms it may have been better received.
Anyway, thanks
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"I don't believe in Santa Claus, but I'm not going to sue somebody for singing a Ho-Ho-Ho song in December. I don't agree with Darwin , but I didn't go out and hire a lawyer when my high school teacher taught his Theory of Evolution
Life, liberty or your pursuit of happiness will not be endangered because someone says a 30-second prayer before a football game.
So what's the big deal? It's not like somebody is up there reading the entire book of Acts. They're just talking to a God they believe in and asking him to grant safety to the players on the field and the fans going home from the game.
But it's a Christian prayer, some will argue.
Yes, and this is the United States of America , a country founded on Christian principles. According to our very own phone book, Christian churches outnumber all others better than 200-to-1. So what would you expect -- somebody chanting Hare Krishna?
If I went to a football game in Jerusalem , I would expect to hear a Jewish prayer.
If I went to a soccer game in Baghdad , I would expect to hear a Muslim prayer.
If I went to a ping pong match in China , I would expect to hear someone pray to Buddha. And I wouldn't be offended.
It wouldn't bother me one bit. When in Rome ...
But what about the atheists? Is another argument.
What about them? Nobody is asking them to be baptized. We're not going to pass the collection plate. Just humor us for 30 seconds. If that's asking too much, bring a Walkman or a pair of ear plugs. Go to the bathr oom. Visit the concession stand. Call your lawyer!
Unfortunately, one or two will make that call. One or two will tell thousands what they can and cannot do. I don't think a short prayer at a football game is going to shake the world's foundations.
Christians are just sick and tired of turning the other cheek while our courts strip us of all our rights. Our parents and grandparents taught us to pray before eating; to pray before we go to sleep.
Our Bible tells us to pray without ceasing. Now a handful of people and their lawyers are telling us to cease praying. God, help us. And if that last sentence offends you, well . .. just sue me.
The silent majority has been silent too long. It's time we let that one or two who scream loud enough to be heard that the vast majority don't care what they want. It is time the majority rules! It's time we tell them, you don't have to pray; you don't have to say the pledge of allegiance; you don't have to believe in God or attend services that honor Him. That is your right, and we will honor your right ... But by golly, you are no longer going to take our rights away. We are fighting back ... and we WILL WIN!
God bless us one and all ... especially those who denounce Him , God bless America, despite all her faults. She is still the greatest nation of all. God bless our service men who are fighting to protect our right to pray and worship God."