Leahman Brothers Bankrupcty and AIG Bailout........ (155)
ttom500: Nice to meet a DEM that wants to step across the aisle.......
Now did I mention to you that McCain is mid road and
moderate.........:-)
Now did I mention to you that McCain is mid road and
moderate.........:-)
And I'm a DEM only because a vote for the Libertarian party is too obscure or unpopular to have any national effect. I vote libertarian locally.
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Indyfella: Unfortunately, if that happens, Obama won't have anyone to put in his cabinet. Dems have their fingers in the till. Read up on it. (as do Repubicans...it cuts both ways. )
Indy
Surely the govt of the day (dem or rep) has to accept responsiblity for regulation of the financial sector. To say that everyone is accountable is bascically saying no one is accountable.
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mikeeemike: Indy
Surely the govt of the day (dem or rep) has to accept responsiblity for regulation of the financial sector. To say that everyone is accountable is bascically saying no one is accountable.
Surely the govt of the day (dem or rep) has to accept responsiblity for regulation of the financial sector. To say that everyone is accountable is bascically saying no one is accountable.
It is both side (both the Adminstration and the Congress) of Gov't that dropped the ball on this.
The GWB administration from the adminstrating the SEC, and Federal
banking system, and some regualtion agencies on insurance.
The DEM that control the banking and ways committees in House and Senate.
GWB's administration has to take the major blame here. Under his watch.....and the buck stops here......theories.
but also
Without the Congress doing due diligence and passing the regulatory laws on the industries....a pretty good share falls here as well.
Congess is the voice of the people......had whistle blowers came forward from inside AIG or Lehman Bro....like they did with Enron.....it would not have gotten this bad.
Sometimes you need to find those people inside a major organization.....and ask the questions......and here Congress
dropped the ball.
How many Congressmen are tied up in the Countrywide mortage scandle at present? 4-5? Obama and McCain are taking donations from
the Fannies......there is why the regs was not been written and the
questions were not being asked....by both parties.
But McCain is on the right path here. Do you let a President that is
on his last few months...with close ties to business.....do a economic
redo progam without first an investigation? No...you say do the investigation first....then the redo economy.
Even Obama should see that.
By the time they get the bad mortage paper done, the economic redo program done, the funding of the airlines and autos....GWB is going to be on the last days of his final term and ready to hop out of town. Now you do an investigation? Should be just the other way around.....
The investigation first....for both the legislation and to give the economic redo some goals and objectives.
This chain of the process right now.....concerns me.
I am coming to the conclusion that Congress does not want to tackle an investigation for a economic redo.This is a lot of votes and support inside the country for and against incumbants. You have a major firm in your district get investigated and its donation leave and its votes leave.
Doing an investigation of AIG......would hit every major city in the country that had a AIG branch office. Do a study or investigation for a
economic redo.....even more than that.
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ttom500: It is both side (both the Adminstration and the Congress) of Gov't that dropped the ball on this.
The GWB administration from the adminstrating the SEC, and Federal
banking system, and some regualtion agencies on insurance.
The DEM that control the banking and ways committees in House and Senate.
GWB's administration has to take the major blame here. Under his watch.....and the buck stops here......theories.
but also
Without the Congress doing due diligence and passing the regulatory laws on the industries....a pretty good share falls here as well.
Congess is the voice of the people......had whistle blowers came forward from inside AIG or Lehman Bro....like they did with Enron.....it would not have gotten this bad.
Sometimes you need to find those people inside a major organization.....and ask the questions......and here Congress
dropped the ball.
How many Congressmen are tied up in the Countrywide mortage scandle at present? 4-5? Obama and McCain are taking donations from
the Fannies......there is why the regs was not been written and the
questions were not being asked....by both parties.
But McCain is on the right path here. Do you let a President that is
on his last few months...with close ties to business.....do a economic
redo progam without first an investigation? No...you say do the investigation first....then the redo economy.
Even Obama should see that.
By the time they get the bad mortage paper done, the economic redo program done, the funding of the airlines and autos....GWB is going to be on the last days of his final term and ready to hop out of town. Now you do an investigation? Should be just the other way around.....
The investigation first....for both the legislation and to give the economic redo some goals and objectives.
This chain of the process right now.....concerns me.
I am coming to the conclusion that Congress does not want to tackle an investigation for a economic redo.This is a lot of votes and support inside the country for and against incumbants. You have a major firm in your district get investigated and its donation leave and its votes leave.
Doing an investigation of AIG......would hit every major city in the country that had a AIG branch office. Do a study or investigation for a
economic redo.....even more than that.
The GWB administration from the adminstrating the SEC, and Federal
banking system, and some regualtion agencies on insurance.
The DEM that control the banking and ways committees in House and Senate.
GWB's administration has to take the major blame here. Under his watch.....and the buck stops here......theories.
but also
Without the Congress doing due diligence and passing the regulatory laws on the industries....a pretty good share falls here as well.
Congess is the voice of the people......had whistle blowers came forward from inside AIG or Lehman Bro....like they did with Enron.....it would not have gotten this bad.
Sometimes you need to find those people inside a major organization.....and ask the questions......and here Congress
dropped the ball.
How many Congressmen are tied up in the Countrywide mortage scandle at present? 4-5? Obama and McCain are taking donations from
the Fannies......there is why the regs was not been written and the
questions were not being asked....by both parties.
But McCain is on the right path here. Do you let a President that is
on his last few months...with close ties to business.....do a economic
redo progam without first an investigation? No...you say do the investigation first....then the redo economy.
Even Obama should see that.
By the time they get the bad mortage paper done, the economic redo program done, the funding of the airlines and autos....GWB is going to be on the last days of his final term and ready to hop out of town. Now you do an investigation? Should be just the other way around.....
The investigation first....for both the legislation and to give the economic redo some goals and objectives.
This chain of the process right now.....concerns me.
I am coming to the conclusion that Congress does not want to tackle an investigation for a economic redo.This is a lot of votes and support inside the country for and against incumbants. You have a major firm in your district get investigated and its donation leave and its votes leave.
Doing an investigation of AIG......would hit every major city in the country that had a AIG branch office. Do a study or investigation for a
economic redo.....even more than that.
I don't think that it should be upto whistle blowers within organisations to be the ones who should be accountable to declare that there is inappropriate corporate behaviour. If that is the only source of protection that the average tax payer has, then god help us all. Buck must stop with the government(s) and the appointed regulator.
It is a real concern that the various members of congress have such conflicts of interest that they woud rather protect their votes, political aspirations and sources of donations than be accountable to the US tax payer.
I agree with the MCain views on the doing the investigation up front, however the financial consequences of delaying the financial assistance package would probably be to great.
Other real concern is how deep is this financial crisis. Have we bottomed out, is the govt intervention resolving the issue, or contributing to a bigger fall in the future.
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It's funny Pelosi's not on the attack though. She's keeping a low profile on this issue. I even saw her mingling w/Republicans on this. I still think the fix is in since both Dems and Republicans want this behind them.
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
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Indyfella: It's funny Pelosi's not on the attack though. She's keeping a low profile on this issue. I even saw her mingling w/Republicans on this. I still think the fix is in since both Dems and Republicans want this behind them.
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Very quite indeed. I'd be pretty pissed if this is just swept under the carpet by both sides.
It will be interesting if the financial rescue has any conditions attached to it for each rescued Company, particularly around retention of incumbent management, renumeration/bonuses and means of operation/investment.
You would think that their must be govt/regulatory appointed management representation within these Company's, review of renumeration and abolishment/reclaim of bonuses (would think these executives would have some form of bonus payment regardless of company performance), and some imposed regulatory framework to operate under.
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Indyfella: It's funny Pelosi's not on the attack though. She's keeping a low profile on this issue. I even saw her mingling w/Republicans on this. I still think the fix is in since both Dems and Republicans want this behind them.
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Of course this is a mess both parties want behind them. These subprime securitization practices became common practice back in the 90's (under Clinton, I freely admit. This is a bi-partisan corruption), when I was in credit. I had lenders blatantly trying to get me to commit fraud on credit verification just to push the loan through underwriting and close so they could get their commission. It's systemic to the industry. All I can say is, get ready for more.
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Indyfella: It's funny Pelosi's not on the attack though. She's keeping a low profile on this issue. I even saw her mingling w/Republicans on this. I still think the fix is in since both Dems and Republicans want this behind them.
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
Some people made from 20 to 90 million over the years in bonuses. I'd like to see some payback...
We are starting to think way to much alike Indy. The DEM have gone from wanting coup to wanting scalp in the last couple of years. Now they have a chance to draw blood....they are in a tight Presidential race....and they are all smiles and buddies with hands across the beltway on this?
Either what they heard in those committee hearings scared them so bad...and they realized... that they needed to be part of the country for a while OR all of our worse thoughts here are on target.
The one DEM Senator....name forgotten now....said the hearing was the most 'grim assessment' he ever heard. But Senator Bunning is a pretty shrewd man...I have watched him play baseball many times.....he is not buying it either. I don't think that McCain is either. Why hold it up with a investigation call if so?
Can you imagine what it would take to get Reid, Polosi, Obama and GWB on the same side? We are talking the Miracle at Lourdes here, Indy.
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mikeeemike: Very quite indeed. I'd be pretty pissed if this is just swept under the carpet by both sides.
It will be interesting if the financial rescue has any conditions attached to it for each rescued Company, particularly around retention of incumbent management, renumeration/bonuses and means of operation/investment.
You would think that their must be govt/regulatory appointed management representation within these Company's, review of renumeration and abolishment/reclaim of bonuses (would think these executives would have some form of bonus payment regardless of company performance), and some imposed regulatory framework to operate under.
It will be interesting if the financial rescue has any conditions attached to it for each rescued Company, particularly around retention of incumbent management, renumeration/bonuses and means of operation/investment.
You would think that their must be govt/regulatory appointed management representation within these Company's, review of renumeration and abolishment/reclaim of bonuses (would think these executives would have some form of bonus payment regardless of company performance), and some imposed regulatory framework to operate under.
This is how a late investigation sets up.
New Administration comes in to office in January, 2009. Also a new Congress......think that they are going to want to go back and revisit this?
Some first year Congress man or Senator might have his staff assigned to do an investigation. But they are new in town.....
to get the facts on this....for newbies.....impossible. But some investigation will be made. It will exonrate both political parties,
GWB, Obama, McCain.....and Dothy, Toto and the Wicked Witch
of the West.
Left holding the bag....the senior execs at the firms and the government regulatory agencies. On the later, you have a new
Administration in town. They are already making new Senior level SES appointments under new Cabinet to replace the gov't regulatory exec involved. The company execs are already history.
Charge ahead America...you can make the same mistakes again, again, and again.
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A judge has approved Barclays to buy certain units of Lehman Brothers......so maybe that situation will begin to square away.
Also
US Economists are saying the $700b economic redo is a good plan.
I am just hoing that these are not the same economists that were confused on the OPEC cut back on oil production by saying it would have little effect on price.
Keep thinking the Sarah Palin does not have an idea what she is in for
as she tries to reform Washington. When this kind of stuff can be done.....think that she is going to need a broom the size of Texas to do the job.
It could be worse.........we could have a Chinese bank buying Lehman
Brothers and OPEC saying that they will loan us the $700b for the economic redo.........or vice verse......in this global economy we have.:-)
Thanks to all have posted here on this issue.......
Have a good week......likely my last post on it.
Also
US Economists are saying the $700b economic redo is a good plan.
I am just hoing that these are not the same economists that were confused on the OPEC cut back on oil production by saying it would have little effect on price.
Keep thinking the Sarah Palin does not have an idea what she is in for
as she tries to reform Washington. When this kind of stuff can be done.....think that she is going to need a broom the size of Texas to do the job.
It could be worse.........we could have a Chinese bank buying Lehman
Brothers and OPEC saying that they will loan us the $700b for the economic redo.........or vice verse......in this global economy we have.:-)
Thanks to all have posted here on this issue.......
Have a good week......likely my last post on it.
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Indyfella: Works for me.
I think that Ras forgets it was a barren waste of sand before we got there in the first place.
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ttom500: A judge has approved Barclays to buy certain units of Lehman Brothers......so maybe that situation will begin to square away.
Also
US Economists are saying the $700b economic redo is a good plan.
I am just hoing that these are not the same economists that were confused on the OPEC cut back on oil production by saying it would have little effect on price.
Keep thinking the Sarah Palin does not have an idea what she is in for
as she tries to reform Washington. When this kind of stuff can be done.....think that she is going to need a broom the size of Texas to do the job.
It could be worse.........we could have a Chinese bank buying Lehman
Brothers and OPEC saying that they will loan us the $700b for the economic redo.........or vice verse......in this global economy we have.:-)
Thanks to all have posted here on this issue.......
Have a good week......likely my last post on it.
Also
US Economists are saying the $700b economic redo is a good plan.
I am just hoing that these are not the same economists that were confused on the OPEC cut back on oil production by saying it would have little effect on price.
Keep thinking the Sarah Palin does not have an idea what she is in for
as she tries to reform Washington. When this kind of stuff can be done.....think that she is going to need a broom the size of Texas to do the job.
It could be worse.........we could have a Chinese bank buying Lehman
Brothers and OPEC saying that they will loan us the $700b for the economic redo.........or vice verse......in this global economy we have.:-)
Thanks to all have posted here on this issue.......
Have a good week......likely my last post on it.
Agreed, it appears the government wants to sell out america to
foreign entities. In stead of lowering prices of homes to bring
in the buyers, they want to keep prices high with tax payers
money. What happened to the free world market?
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Why does it cost 700 billion when the assests are worthless. Should
not it cost nothing to take over bad loans.
not it cost nothing to take over bad loans.
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Who determines the value of a house. A banker? What other
houses of like construction sell for in the area? What the buyer is
willing to pay? Maybe the builder who calculate cost plus 15%
profit?
houses of like construction sell for in the area? What the buyer is
willing to pay? Maybe the builder who calculate cost plus 15%
profit?
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Why are companies so willing to loan me money? Credit card
applications in mail all the time and small business loans.
applications in mail all the time and small business loans.
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agman: Who determines the value of a house. A banker? What other
houses of like construction sell for in the area? What the buyer is
willing to pay? Maybe the builder who calculate cost plus 15%
profit?
houses of like construction sell for in the area? What the buyer is
willing to pay? Maybe the builder who calculate cost plus 15%
profit?
There is no "real" value on real estate anymore. The debt has been amortized, securitized, and conglomerated in such a "voodoo economic" way, that its all phantom value right now, with all the real money sitting in the offshore accounts of the richest 1% in the world, siphoned away on commissions and the naked short sale of debt (where the debt is sold to collectors for a percentage loss, and then reacquired at an even smaller percentage for a net gain). The only true losers are the stock-holders of the banks left holding the tab, and the American Taxpayers. And of course, your average middle-class home-owner. Everythings peachy-keen (as usual) for the top 1%.
It's a said indictment of the sociopathic nature of
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I hope they don't do another stimulust package. The rich and
better off people still got more than the poor working people.
For me the stimulust package only paid for a month of gas.
I guess the gas companies like to hear this.
better off people still got more than the poor working people.
For me the stimulust package only paid for a month of gas.
I guess the gas companies like to hear this.
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God, I have such lag right now. It's makin my posts funny 
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Galactic_bodhi: There is no "real" value on real estate anymore. The debt has been amortized, securitized, and conglomerated in such a "voodoo economic" way, that its all phantom value right now, with all the real money sitting in the offshore accounts of the richest 1% in the world, siphoned away on commissions and the naked short sale of debt (where the debt is sold to collectors for a percentage loss, and then reacquired at an even smaller percentage for a net gain). The only true losers are the stock-holders of the banks left holding the tab, and the American Taxpayers. And of course, your average middle-class home-owner. Everythings peachy-keen (as usual) for the top 1%.
It's a said indictment of the sociopathic nature of
It's a said indictment of the sociopathic nature of
I agree with some of what you have said. As a farmer who going
to work the ground, the value is what he can produce and sell,
should be an indication of the value of the land. A resident who
buys the house and land in which his production is really his
job for some company would maybe indicate the value of his
property. So if the job disappears or he gets a cut in pay his
land and property should drop in value also.
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Now did I mention to you that McCain is mid road and
moderate.........:-)
I would vote for McCain, except for his affiliation with Barry Goldwater. Not going to happen. The concept of bi-partisanship may be a good talking point, but with a history of affiliation with Mr. Goldwater, that's all it is, talk.