Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated. ( Archived) (73)

Jun 30, 2012 1:09 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan came back from his NATO meeting and all he got was a condemnation of Syria. So, to show he’s doing something about the problem Turkey deployed anti-aircraft guns June 27 along the border with Syria.

I believe it is intended to simply compensate for what is perceived as a non-response but makes the Syrian regime appear strong.

What is interesting is that those who support the insurgency such as the US, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar didn’t jump on board to take action but seem intent on placing the rebels asses on the line with just enough support to keep them fighting. Turkey in turn also seems to be pushing for the MB to take part while SA is thought to be inserting Salafist fighters into Syria hoping to cut the MB off. To make it even more confusing the US wary of holy fighters is trying to stop this process and wanting no part seems to be happy providing minimal support for the rebels and Saudi fighters and keeps the main focus on negotiations with Russia and Iran (hence why they didn't jump aboard Erdogan's train at the NATO meeting.)

So we know now that Syria has a fairly good air defense network and that Russia and Iran will do whatever it takes to see the regime through.
The defections that some are placing weight on are from lower ranking Sunnis rather than the Alawite who control the military as well as the entire intelligence and secret police and much of the Sunni numbers in the army are still loyal to the regime. Of particular interest is the Air Force pilots are mostly Sunni while those in the army who pilot the attack helicopters are Alawites hence, those who are taking direct part in putting down the rebellion are part and parcel to the regime itself.
From Stratfor;

“”But if other defections among minorities occurred in addition to large-scale Sunni defections, the military's core could also be threatened. At that point, key figures within the regime, especially senior Sunni figures and Alawites outside the al Assad clan, would need to be monitored for signs that they were ready to turn on the al Assad family. “”

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Jul 22, 2012 2:59 PM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
'Syrian opposition ready to secure chemical weapons'

""FSA general tells 'Daily Telegraph' rebels are forming a team to take hold of Assad's chemical weapons sites; senior Syrian military defector tells Reuters Assad's forces moving chemical stockpile across country.

"We have a group just to deal with chemical weapons," General Adnan Silou told the Telegraph.

He went on to describe two chemical weapons sites, one in east Damascus and another near Homs, according to the report.

Defense Minister Ehud Barak revealed Friday that Israel is preparing for a possible military intervention in Syria in case Damascus hands its missiles or chemical weapons to Hezbollah in Lebanon.""

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Jul 26, 2012 3:32 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
To further complicate matters "Syrian rebels will attack the Russian naval base at Tartus if Moscow continues to send weapons to President Bashar al Assad's regime, rebel sources said, the Daily Telegraph reported July 26. Sources inside the regime have alerted rebels to the arrival of another weapons shipment within two weeks and if the shipment arrives, rebels will attack, a source within the Free Syrian Army said. Many rebels worked in the port of Tartus and know it well, another Free Syrian Army source said."

Stratfor
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Jul 26, 2012 3:53 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
German intelligence: al-Qaeda all over Syria

John Rosenthal

July 24, 2012

German intelligence estimates that “around 90? terror attacks that “can be attributed to organizations that are close to al-Qaeda or jihadist groups” were carried out in Syria between the end of December and the beginning of July, as reported by the German daily Die Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung (FAZ). This was revealed by the German government in a response to a parliamentary question.

In response to the same question, the German government admitted that it had received several reports from the German foreign intelligence service, the BND, on the May 25 massacre in the Syrian town of Houla. But it noted that the content of these reports was to remain classified “by reason of national interest”, Like many other Western governments, Germany expelled Syria’s ambassador in the immediate aftermath of the massacre, holding the Syrian government responsible for the violence.

Meanwhile, at least three major German newspapers – Die Welt, the FAZ, and the mass-market tabloid Bild – have published reports attributing responsibility for the massacre to anti-government rebel forces or treating this as the most probable scenario.



=======================================




Any Germans among us want to confirm this?
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Jul 26, 2012 5:10 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
KNenagh
KNenaghKNenaghAachen, Kilkenny Ireland12 Threads 11,160 Posts
I just found 2 articles in the FAZ and translated them. They actually have conflicting reports. See below:

13th July 2012: Das Massaker von Hula ist ein Wendepunkt im syrischen Konflikt. Die westliche Öffentlichkeit beschuldigt, gestützt auf die UN-Beobachter, die syrische Armee. Diese Version kann auf Grundlage von Augenzeugenberichten bezweifelt werden. Demnach wurden die Zivilisten von sunnitischen Aufständischen getötet.
The massacre of Hula is a turning point in the Syrian conflict. The western public accused, supported by UN-observer, the Syrian army. This version can be questioned because of eye witness reports. From that the civilians were killed by Sunnites revolters.


16th July 2012: Die Informationspolitik der Bundesregierung, welche Kenntnisse sie über das Massaker im syrischen Hula vom 25. Mai sie habe, ist aus den Reihen der Linksfraktion heftig kritisiert worden. Die Abgeordnete Sevim Dagdelen bemängelte, einerseits wiederhole die Bundesregierung die Auffassung einer internationalen Untersuchungskommission, „regimenahe Kräfte“ - also dem syrischen Präsidenten Assad nahestehende Milizen - seien für ein Großteil der Opfer „verantwortlich“. Andererseits äußere sie auf Fragen nach Details der Umstände des Massakers, sie verfüge nicht über „belastbare Informationen“.
TD Sevim Dagdelen critised that the German Government repeats on the one hand the view of an international investigate commission that militia close to the Syrian president are responsible for the biggest part of the victims. On the other hand when ask after details about the circumstances of the massacre they said they don’t have resilient information.

Die Abgeordnete bezog sich auf Antworten des Auswärtigen Amtes auf eine parlamentarische Anfrage. In der Antwort der Bundesregierung heißt es: „Nach Auffassung der Bundesregierung geht die primäre Bedrohung der Zivilbevölkerung durch die fortgesetzte militärische Gewalt des syrischen Regimes aus.“ Über das Massaker in Hula sei sie vom Bundesnachrichtendienst im Zeitraum vom 5. bis 15. Juni mehrfach unterrichtet worden.
In the view of the German Government the primary thread to the civil population is through the continued military violence of the Syrian regime. The BND got notice about the massacre of Hula several times between 5th to 15th June.
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Jul 26, 2012 5:42 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
No-one is going to get involved in Syria because there in no oil or heroine there.
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Jul 26, 2012 7:47 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
MADDOG69: German intelligence: al-Qaeda all over Syria

John Rosenthal

July 24, 2012

German intelligence estimates that “around 90? terror attacks that “can be attributed to organizations that are close to al-Qaeda or jihadist groups” were carried out in Syria between the end of December and the beginning of July, as reported by the German daily Die Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung (FAZ). This was revealed by the German government in a response to a parliamentary question.

In response to the same question, the German government admitted that it had received several reports from the German foreign intelligence service, the BND, on the May 25 massacre in the Syrian town of Houla. But it noted that the content of these reports was to remain classified “by reason of national interest”, Like many other Western governments, Germany expelled Syria’s ambassador in the immediate aftermath of the massacre, holding the Syrian government responsible for the violence.

Meanwhile, at least three major German newspapers – Die Welt, the FAZ, and the mass-market tabloid Bild – have published reports attributing responsibility for the massacre to anti-government rebel forces or treating this as the most probable scenario.
=======================================http://www.infowars.com/german-intelligence-al-qaeda-all-over-syria/

Any Germans among us want to confirm this?


You know what is interesting. That alQeada before the SFA rebellion never made a major attack in Syria. You have alQeada doing the bombing of the Turkish bank. The Jordian wedding party. And so many inside Iraq, that everyone lost count. All around Syria from 2002 to 2011.

But in Syria proper, alQeada did very little.

The SFA rebells and suddenly alQeada is around every street corner in Syria.

Well there that one alQeada attack in Syria.....on the US Embassy in Sept 17, 2006 that the Syrian Security forces stopped by killing the four attackers.

So either Assad had alQeada so well inflitrated that alQeada could not strike in Syria. Or Assad was so close to alQeada that they did not attack in Syria.
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Jul 26, 2012 7:59 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
Presidential Polling became a issue last night on Fox's O'Reilly show.

As Bill pointed to one poll that gave President Obama a 6 point lead and then to a another poll that gave Governor Romney a 3 point lead. Bill ask how two polls can have 9 point difference? With two different leaders?

Bill went on to answer his own question.

One poll was done a DEM area with unflitered responses from 'voting age Americans'

The other polls was done from across the country among 'American register and most likely vote' being polled.

Now one poll was sited by a liberal new agency.....and the other poll was sited by FOX. I will let you guess which. But the liberal news agency failed to mention the criteria from which the poll was done.

But anyways, with the London Olympic games beginning. Seems almost right to say the American Presidential Polling Games have begun as well.
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Jul 26, 2012 8:00 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
ttom500: Presidential Polling became a issue last night on Fox's O'Reilly show.

As Bill pointed to one poll that gave President Obama a 6 point lead and then to a another poll that gave Governor Romney a 3 point lead. Bill ask how two polls can have 9 point difference? With two different leaders?

Bill went on to answer his own question.

One poll was done a DEM area with unflitered responses from 'voting age Americans'

The other polls was done from across the country among 'American register and most likely vote' being polled.

Now one poll was sited by a liberal new agency.....and the other poll was sited by FOX. I will let you guess which. But the liberal news agency failed to mention the criteria from which the poll was done.

But anyways, with the London Olympic games beginning. Seems almost right to say the American Presidential Polling Games have begun as well.


*****Disregard wrong thread post*****
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Jul 26, 2012 8:32 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
Albertaghost
AlbertaghostAlbertaghostCultural Wasteland, Alberta Canada76 Threads 5 Polls 5,914 Posts
TonyIsAChampion: No-one is going to get involved in Syria because there in no oil or heroine there.


Actually there is, about a half million barrels a day. I believe the prime reason that would preclude action is the lack of broken ceasefire conditions.
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Jul 26, 2012 8:42 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
Pretty sure that when Assad moved his WMDs near the border with Israel.

Israel went on 'high alert'

Meaning Israel's IDF was ready for anything. Speaking of in one small Israeli border town in the north, the Syrian conflict is spilling over.
Seem fleeing Sunni are trying to use it to leave Syria. They don't want to go Lebanon or Turkey.....so are fleeing into Israel.

Funny how Israel knew Assad was moving his WMDs. Almost like they had someone sitting next to him in his war room......
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Jul 26, 2012 8:27 PM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500:
So either Assad had alQeada so well inflitrated that alQeada could not strike in Syria. Or Assad was so close to alQeada that they did not attack in Syria.

Doubt the latter. Assad and his crowd are considered heretics by the Al-Q hierarchy. It would be a bridge too far I reckon.
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Jul 27, 2012 2:07 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
MADDOG69: Doubt the latter. Assad and his crowd are considered heretics by the Al-Q hierarchy. It would be a bridge too far I reckon.


Assad never tried to shut the Syria/Iraq border down following the US invasion of Iraq. 100s of alQeada bomb vehicles made the trip to Iraq from Syria. He never shut the manufacturing sites were the bomb vehicles were made. He let foreign fighter from Lebanon across the northern part of the country to Iraq.

But suddenly he is the enemy of alQeada? When alQeada did not have any major strike in his country from 2002 to the SFA rebellion?

Personally, I see a whole lot of quid pro quo here. Assad lets alQeada operate freely inside Syria from 2002 to 2010. In exchange alQeada did not do any attacks in Syria.....well again except for that one failed strike on the US Embassy.

The old (bin Laden) Al-Q considered Iran heretics as well. That does not stop bin Laden's four sons from taking safe house in Tehran.
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Jul 27, 2012 2:26 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
Good analysis, Tom. Might be correct. thumbs up
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Jul 27, 2012 3:09 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
lavienrose
lavienroselavienroseBordeaux, Nouvelle-Aquitaine France2 Threads 1 Polls 32 Posts
sure things will get more complicated there, exactly like in Irak, Egypt and Tunisia.. these regions welcoming new radical islam .. perfect targets for al-qaida that is spreading its power everywhere little by little. and it looks like US and Europe didn't see that coming that fast .. how about Iran just waiting for the right moment to get involved and show their nuclear to the face of Israel ? hmmmm, things not on a good way for sure !!! ... just my opinion.
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Jul 30, 2012 6:40 PM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
SFA is still holding on to sections of Apello as the Syrian military uses heavy weapons to dis lodge them from houses and building. Some 200,000 of the 3m citizens have fled the city. Meaning 2.8m are trapped in the fighting.

In Damascus, the Syrian Army is claiming victory over the SFA rebells.
Fighting seem to have subsided there.

In London, the ranking Syrian just defected in protest to Assad actions.

Russia will not let the EU to search Russian flagged ships headed to Syria for weapons.

In Iran, the Syrian Foreign minister attempted to make Israel the master mind for the Syrian civil war with Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey its proxies.

France with the fighting in Apello has called a emergency meeting of the UN Security Council. Expect both Russia and China to block any resolution.

The leader of the SFA called for heavy weapon to take on the Syrian tanks and helos.
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Jul 31, 2012 5:38 PM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
Syrian rebells just recieved two dozen man pads from Turkey for the battle of Apello. They are hoping for more.
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Aug 3, 2012 9:36 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
Kofi Annan just resigned from the UN team trying to resolve the Syrian crisis. Stating the UN Security council is was unable to act in the
situation and that the Russian and United States had to opposing views to the situation.

Media wonders if the UN Observers with remain in the trouble and warred country.

1000 Syrian moved across the border near Apello to Turkey. Including one Syrian Brig General. Apello has become the hot point to the civil war that is being fought.
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Aug 4, 2012 9:30 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500
ttom500ttom500St. Cloud, Florida USA30 Threads 5 Polls 10,523 Posts
Turkey just retired 55 General and Admirals that had been earlier arrested in a coup plot to remove Erdogan.

Maybe Assad and Syria had a bit in the coup attempt? This happened last year, while the Syrian rebellion was going on. If Assad felt Erdogan
would support the SFA, removing him from power was one to help his regime to stay in power.

Having a Turkey on his northern border that was controlled by Alawite
friendly Generals and Admirals would be a big plus to what is happening
today in Syria. No home across the border for the SFA.

Just speculating here. The articles does not mention a Assad connection to the Turkish officers.....

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Aug 5, 2012 1:51 AM CST Syria. Things are, and, will get more compicated.
ttom500: Turkey just retired 55 General and Admirals that had been earlier arrested in a coup plot to remove Erdogan.

Maybe Assad and Syria had a bit in the coup attempt? This happened last year, while the Syrian rebellion was going on. If Assad felt Erdogan
would support the SFA, removing him from power was one to help his regime to stay in power.

Having a Turkey on his northern border that was controlled by Alawite
friendly Generals and Admirals would be a big plus to what is happening
today in Syria. No home across the border for the SFA.

Just speculating here. The articles does not mention a Assad connection to the Turkish officers.....


Unrelated Tom, I think. It's not the 1st time Erdogan got rid of Generals. Remember, Turkey's military is profoundly Ataturk Ideologists. Erdogan himself borders more towards Islamic policies. Turkey has a history of it's military enacting coups, (3 or 4 IIRC).
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