This is just a horrible and sick thing this guy did. He should rot in jail. (Disturbing,warning!!) (236)
Fallingman:
I am sure there is truth in what you say.....but it's better than the alternative...mob rule or state opression. Hearsay leads to lynchings....at least with tested evidence you can get near the truth...what the outcome should be is a different matter.
I am sure there is truth in what you say.....but it's better than the alternative...mob rule or state opression. Hearsay leads to lynchings....at least with tested evidence you can get near the truth...what the outcome should be is a different matter.
I agree with you Sir.
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I don't think it was on this thread but on another...she passed away yesterday or the day before....
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Hugz_n_Kissez: I don't think it was on this thread but on another...she passed away yesterday or the day before....
That sucks...I don't care about his "bipolar"...it wasn't a defense 30 years ago...shouldn't be one now. He knew what he was doing, and that it was wrong. Either way: you can't trust the guy in society ever again. Hang him high....
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HondoLaneNJ: That sucks...I don't care about his "bipolar"...it wasn't a defense 30 years ago...shouldn't be one now. He knew what he was doing, and that it was wrong. Either way: you can't trust the guy in society ever again. Hang him high....
Sure he did..I think it's domestic violence at it's finest regardless of the bi-polar....it fits the pattern more!!!!!
Bi-polar doesn't mean insane....which doesn't mean he doesn't know the difference between right and wrong!!!!!!!!
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mynameisvivi: I know they do exist. But I don't agree with them. All these blah-blah about sanity and so on, just creates more criminals, as nowadays we have a "genetic" or "medical" excuse for all wrongdoings.
That is far from the truth ,
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crotalus_p: If the guy was not responsible for his actions threw mental illness he was not responsible full stop
He was bi-polar....lots and lots of people who are bi-polar and they don't go around doing things like that.... I would say something if he has a sever form of paranoid schizophrenia or indeed if he has a psychotic episode.. he did have a degree of responsibility... maybe diminished due to his heightened emotional state.. but he did have a degree of responsibility
...I am guessing from the fact that she was contemplating leaving him... that there was alot of stuff going on prior to the main event...
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Aries01: He was bi-polar....lots and lots of people who are bi-polar and they don't go around doing things like that.... I would say something if he has a sever form of paranoid schizophrenia or indeed if he has a psychotic episode.. he did have a degree of responsibility... maybe diminished due to his heightened emotional state.. but he did have a degree of responsibility ...
I am guessing from the fact that she was contemplating leaving him... that there was alot of stuff going on prior to the main event...
I am guessing from the fact that she was contemplating leaving him... that there was alot of stuff going on prior to the main event...
If he knew enough to get himself out of that house or he would burn to death...then he knew had his wits about him enough to know what he did was wrong as far as I'm concerned and yes...domestic violence is the issue here not bi-polar...the fact that he was abusive is what made him dangerous!!!!!!!!
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mynameisvivi: "Right". Tell me one criminal who is "sane"? Maybe we should close down all the prison and just treat all the nutty in hospitals?
This whole categorization of sanity is a big bs. If you open the psychiatric diagnostic book you will find that per that, nobody is sane. Including you and me. And irresponsible people use that as a justification. All this does it takes away responsibility.
Everybody IS responsible for his actions. Even a mice knows if it hears my steps, he better runs, a simplifed version of "action-consequences". If one can't accept that he is causing things, why bother at all with life?
I didn't get right the quoting things, so here is the thing that I was replying to:
"If the guy was not responsible for his actions threw mental illness he was not responsible full stop"
This whole categorization of sanity is a big bs. If you open the psychiatric diagnostic book you will find that per that, nobody is sane. Including you and me. And irresponsible people use that as a justification. All this does it takes away responsibility.
Everybody IS responsible for his actions. Even a mice knows if it hears my steps, he better runs, a simplifed version of "action-consequences". If one can't accept that he is causing things, why bother at all with life?
I didn't get right the quoting things, so here is the thing that I was replying to:
"If the guy was not responsible for his actions threw mental illness he was not responsible full stop"
This is true... most violent criminals have SOME reason.. be it emotional, psycholical.. drugs... etc.. as a criminal lawyer I have a certain amount of understanding, and accept that these things need to be taken into account... having said that though.. it is totally erroneous (of crotalus) to say that this man had NO responsibility.... rubbish... people suffering from bi-polar suffer enough stigma... justifying this mans actions under the heading of bi-polar, is not doing any of these people any favours... his bi-polar condition... I am betting is only one aspect of what was going on.... I would put money on the fact that he was a controlling abusive partner to boot... JMV
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Hugz_n_Kissez: If he knew enough to get himself out of that house or he would burn to death...then he knew had his wits about him enough to know what he did was wrong as far as I'm concerned and yes...domestic violence is the issue here not bi-polar...the fact that he was abusive is what made him dangerous!!!!!!!!
absolutely... it would be like letting a child killer off cause he didn't get enough hugs as a child.... sorry... if someone severly hurts a person... there are consequences... the only time I would let the insanity defence stick is where the person literally were not of their mind.. like when they have schizophrenia or something.. or severe psychosis.. and then, they would need to be locked in an institution for their own safety (and of others) and treatment...until such time that they are in good mental health...
My parents are seperated.. and I occasionally get bad PMT... would I be justified setting someone alight because I forgot to take my primrose oil capsules and a paracetemol...
... what is this world coming to... u set someone alight.. u do the time.. simple as..------ This thread is Archived ------
when I was a RN and worked in Psych triage in the ER one of the questions I asked the patient was are you having any suicidal or Homicdal thoughts? People with BiPolar can have homicial ideations. They do have the ability to want to hurt other people.
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Aries01: absolutely... it would be like letting a child killer off cause he didn't get enough hugs as a child.... sorry... if someone severly hurts a person... there are consequences... the only time I would let the insanity defence stick is where the person literally were not of their mind.. like when they have schizophrenia or something.. or severe psychosis.. and then, they would need to be locked in an institution for their own safety (and of others) and treatment...until such time that they are in good mental health...
My parents are seperated.. and I occasionally get bad PMT... would I be justified setting someone alight because I forgot to take my primrose oil capsules and a paracetemol... ... what is this world coming to... u set someone alight.. u do the time.. simple as..
My parents are seperated.. and I occasionally get bad PMT... would I be justified setting someone alight because I forgot to take my primrose oil capsules and a paracetemol... ... what is this world coming to... u set someone alight.. u do the time.. simple as..
Yes I agree...I hope now they upgrade the charges to murder as she passed away yesterday or the day before...that was another contentious issue that he was only charged with assault causing bodily harm I believe and not attempted murder...most likely because of the perspective he didn't know what he was doing...yet he was also charged with arson...which is a crime that says he did know what he was doing because for arson he would have had to form intent so it's pretty contradictory all around!!!!!!!!!
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Aries01: it is totally erroneous (of crotalus) to say that this man had NO responsibility.... rubbish... people suffering from bi-polar suffer enough stigma...
Aries it is totally erroneous / ignorant of you to comment on my post with out being aware of the full context in which it was said
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Aries01:
My parents are seperated.. and I occasionally get bad PMT... would I be justified setting someone alight because I forgot to take my primrose oil capsules and a paracetemol... ... what is this world coming to... u set someone alight.. u do the time.. simple as..
My parents are seperated.. and I occasionally get bad PMT... would I be justified setting someone alight because I forgot to take my primrose oil capsules and a paracetemol... ... what is this world coming to... u set someone alight.. u do the time.. simple as..
And people rely on you to defend them
Ps
90% of pmt is caused by low zinc leviels
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crotalus_p: And people rely on you to defend them
Ps
90% of pmt is caused by low zinc leviels
Ps
90% of pmt is caused by low zinc leviels
extenuating circumstances certainly should be taken into account, but to say that someone has no responsibility AT ALL because they suffer from Bi-Polar is taking it a step too far..... sure I defend people, but if someone is caught red handed and all the evidence points to there having committed the offence, then apart from admitting evidence as to circumstances which serve to mitigate... and possibly reduce a potential sentence... I am not a miracle worker... no criminal defence lawyer is....despite what you see on tv...
I'll bet you know all about PMT... like you know it all about everything else
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Aries01: extenuating circumstances certainly should be taken into account, but to say that someone has no responsibility AT ALL because they suffer from Bi-Polar is taking it a step too far.....
I did not say that you are taking my post out of context
Aries01: ... I am not a miracle worker... no criminal defence lawyer is....despite what you see on tv...
Next you will be telling me that Iron side and Perry Mason where not reality tv shows
Aries01: I'll bet you know all about PMT... like you know it all about everything else
No I just happen to know that 90% of it is caused by low zinc leviels , I was just trying to help , if you dont want my help thats fine by me
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Hugz_n_Kissez: Yes I agree...I hope now they upgrade the charges to murder as she passed away yesterday or the day before...that was another contentious issue that he was only charged with assault causing bodily harm I believe and not attempted murder...most likely because of the perspective he didn't know what he was doing...yet he was also charged with arson...which is a crime that says he did know what he was doing because for arson he would have had to form intent so it's pretty contradictory all around!!!!!!!!!
They will never bring home a murder charge because of the very high level of proof required... actual intent to kill had to be proved.. the existence of an underlying psychological condition would make it difficult to establish.... however a manslaughter charge should be able to stick... particularly if there was a pattern of domestic violence... dunno... I perhaps more than many appreciate the role of mental illness in crime due to my line of work.. but even so... mental illness cannot and should not be a full defence unless.. that person has lost all mental faculty.. as in the case of psychosis or schizophrenia...
Anyway.... how are u hun??
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sjwor: Thanks for all the comments, there are lots of issues but it is no more complicated than a grown man choosing to not take medication when it was available, choosing to drink when not supposed to due to medication and being a recovering alcholic and endangering others knowing that they were present. Krista and a co-worker went to the house to collect clothes to stay away for a few days and begin the process of moving out. They made multiple trips between rooms after entering and Larry was present. He locked the doors and doused the rear of house (primarily kitchen) with gasoline while they were in master bedroom. Krista's co-worker grabbed gas can and got through front door and allegedly Larry dropped match or lit cigarette and pushed Krista into the kitchen. She observed Larry with lower pants on fire walk to front of house where he stripped of clothes, busted out bedroom window and exited, naked, leaving Krista screaming inside. Krista did not make it out and neighbors tried to reach her after spraying water from a garden hose through front door. Policed arrived soon and 2 officers broke through back door to kitchen area and pulled her out - she actually walk down back steps and collapsed in back yard. Krista was a strong healthy woman that many would not think to mess with physically. Those that knew her were stunned to hear that she was trapped and burned since that does not sound like something that would happen to her easily unless something unusual or deliberate occured.
Krista was my ex-wife and mother for my children and we are guardians for her nephew. Krista succomed to her severe wounds and passed on Monday August 18th at 2am. After 10 surgeries her organs began to fail which was the fear within first 8 weeks due to extent of her injuries. Her immediate family was all present to say goodbye including her son from Montana that I got there shortly after 12am.
Her boyfriend Larry was arraigned on murder and aggravated murder (due to death occuring in act of felony arson). The DA has not decided yet to seek death penalty which is an option for these charges. The DA presents the case / evidence they have and the jury decides. He has the right to a vigorous defense and we are fairly certain the bi-polar card will be played - that would be his right. A local state representative is introducing legislation to limit circumstances that these kinds of defense strategies can be used which is based on similiar laws in some other states already.
I have extreme bias in this matter but feel that it would be a tragedy if he had a mental issue and harmed himself without getting help he needed. To choose a course of actions that harms others should only result in action against him giving him no chance to repeat that choice ever again.
Krista was my ex-wife and mother for my children and we are guardians for her nephew. Krista succomed to her severe wounds and passed on Monday August 18th at 2am. After 10 surgeries her organs began to fail which was the fear within first 8 weeks due to extent of her injuries. Her immediate family was all present to say goodbye including her son from Montana that I got there shortly after 12am.
Her boyfriend Larry was arraigned on murder and aggravated murder (due to death occuring in act of felony arson). The DA has not decided yet to seek death penalty which is an option for these charges. The DA presents the case / evidence they have and the jury decides. He has the right to a vigorous defense and we are fairly certain the bi-polar card will be played - that would be his right. A local state representative is introducing legislation to limit circumstances that these kinds of defense strategies can be used which is based on similiar laws in some other states already.
I have extreme bias in this matter but feel that it would be a tragedy if he had a mental issue and harmed himself without getting help he needed. To choose a course of actions that harms others should only result in action against him giving him no chance to repeat that choice ever again.
My prayers are with you and all your family, you are a just and kind man, you could have littered your post with hate feeled words but you have risen above that.
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Almost 300 people from the community squeezed into small chapel at funeral home in McMinnville for Krista's memorial service - a testament to how far her life actually touched with all the volunteering, sports and school involvement. Her kids placed her urn in a niche Friday afternoon.
Our youngest daughter, 10 years old, is most concerned that Larry will get out and she will have to see him. Donna Nelson who is the state representative for our district did announced "Krista's Law" being introduced at the next session to limit the use of mental defenses for certain actions / crimes even though this has not yet gone to trial or legal positions been asserted. The media play up of bi-polar and drinking has frightened many that he will not be held accountable for what he should. I am pretty sure this is not irrational fear but disbelief that someone could get off lighter than Krista did and no trial has even started yet. Emotions run high on this one, especially for a close community. I just hope the DA puts solid thourough case together to make jury's job easy to clearly decide what is right justice. This could be easily blown as either an easy slam dunk or ripe with appeal material to drag out forever. Depends on what kind of defense he can afford to muster since he is using court appointed and family is not supporting him in any way so far.
The debate that has occured here will certainly be played out to a large extent on this before this is concluded.
Our youngest daughter, 10 years old, is most concerned that Larry will get out and she will have to see him. Donna Nelson who is the state representative for our district did announced "Krista's Law" being introduced at the next session to limit the use of mental defenses for certain actions / crimes even though this has not yet gone to trial or legal positions been asserted. The media play up of bi-polar and drinking has frightened many that he will not be held accountable for what he should. I am pretty sure this is not irrational fear but disbelief that someone could get off lighter than Krista did and no trial has even started yet. Emotions run high on this one, especially for a close community. I just hope the DA puts solid thourough case together to make jury's job easy to clearly decide what is right justice. This could be easily blown as either an easy slam dunk or ripe with appeal material to drag out forever. Depends on what kind of defense he can afford to muster since he is using court appointed and family is not supporting him in any way so far.
The debate that has occured here will certainly be played out to a large extent on this before this is concluded.
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crotalus_p: Aries it is totally erroneous / ignorant of you to comment on my post with out being aware of the full context in which it was said
canteen boy strikes again
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I don't know about that FM...I see the court system as having to de-evolved into more of a theatre, where the lawyers use theatrics, props, even bullying and lying to put on the best show for the jury. The law isn't always justice and justice, often times, has nothing to do with law...Whoever puts on the best show gets the verdict....a' la O.J.Simpson.....
I am sure there is truth in what you say.....but it's better than the alternative...mob rule or state opression. Hearsay leads to lynchings....at least with tested evidence you can get near the truth...what the outcome should be is a different matter.