Needed or Wanted??? (101)
navygirl1: It sounds like your father went through hell. Good on him though he stuck it out as long as he did.
Thankyou.... my thoughts entirely.
It just goes to show that some men stick it out just the same as the women !
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Englishman55: I think it's an admirable quality/stance for my father to have taken.
My mothers father actually drew my father to one side, before they were married and said to my father.
Do you really know what you are taking on here son.
Are you sure you really want to do this.
You can walk away, if you wish.
My mother suffered serious manic depression all her life and I saw the hell it put my father through.... so yes, admirable in by book.
My mothers father actually drew my father to one side, before they were married and said to my father.
Do you really know what you are taking on here son.
Are you sure you really want to do this.
You can walk away, if you wish.
My mother suffered serious manic depression all her life and I saw the hell it put my father through.... so yes, admirable in by book.
Well with that bit more of info you´ve given I kind of agree. Yes your dad was a good man, but I´m not sure it made him a happy man.
Sometimes people pay a sad price for such goodness.
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navygirl1: Wow, I am sorry to hear that. I was just talking to my ex-boyfriend last night who had gone through a divorce after 15 years of marriage. Although she left him, he said that he was glad as he felt his life had been wasted being tied down to marriage and kids. So, he had thoughts of leaving her anyways. Very sad either way.
what makes me sad, navygirl, is to hear people refer to the role of home maker in the traditional family , or the spouse of a home maker in the traditional family, as being "tied down" like it's a negative thing to have a family life with beautiful children. I think it's just weird to have a problem with that...but that's just me. Maybe his family life was not that happy. Those years don't really last that long, but we don't know that when we're in the midst of it....
It makes me sad to hear that tho' because it makes me feel like most people would consider the bulk of my adult life to be a waste of time. I know, employment-wise, hiring managers give little or no credit to the career of housewife. I am satisfied, however, to have the love & appreciation of my kids. They're awesome!!!
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Englishman55: Thankyou.... my thoughts entirely.
It just goes to show that some men stick it out just the same as the women !
It just goes to show that some men stick it out just the same as the women !
Absolutely.
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JAN_is: Well with that bit more of info you´ve given I kind of agree. Yes your dad was a good man, but I´m not sure it made him a happy man.
Sometimes people pay a sad price for such goodness.
Sometimes people pay a sad price for such goodness.
My father is a very chirpy, always smiling, good humoured man, but you are right... It did not make him happy, especially to see the woman he loved go through such mood swings.
No it is mine and my sisters responsibility to look after my mother, and have now (last April) placed her in a home, better equipped to deal with such illness.
That didn't make either of us happy either, but she is in a much safer environment than when she was living on her own.
My father still asks after her and is even planning to see her this year, although I am not so sure that is such a good idea.
She is still bitter and twisted that he left her after 30 years !
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felixis99: what makes me sad, navygirl, is to hear people refer to the role of home maker in the traditional family , or the spouse of a home maker in the traditional family, as being "tied down" like it's a negative thing to have a family life with beautiful children. I think it's just weird to have a problem with that...but that's just me. Maybe his family life was not that happy. Those years don't really last that long, but we don't know that when we're in the midst of it....
It makes me sad to hear that tho' because it makes me feel like most people would consider the bulk of my adult life to be a waste of time. I know, employment-wise, hiring managers give little or no credit to the career of housewife. I am satisfied, however, to have the love & appreciation of my kids. They're awesome!!!
It makes me sad to hear that tho' because it makes me feel like most people would consider the bulk of my adult life to be a waste of time. I know, employment-wise, hiring managers give little or no credit to the career of housewife. I am satisfied, however, to have the love & appreciation of my kids. They're awesome!!!
I agree with you that it is sad. I think values have changed over the years. My ex was just one of many I have heard say the same thing about marriage and family. I have always thought that people who get married and have children really should need to be sure before they take such a big step. My own mother said she wished she had never married or had kids. I wasn't upset with what she said as she gave up her military career and then saw me living the life she didn't. As for housewifes, I don't think managers have any idea of how much work a housewife has to do to keep the house running, and taking care of kids. I know I could never do it as I had to take care of my nephew for a week and that was hard. You have my admiration.
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bohdiprana: It's a scary topic in a vanilla forum. Primarily dominance/submission, which has no male female preference (though philosophies tend to place men in the dominant roles, it wouldn't be my assessment of proper use) It's a matter of realizing how one best functions.
Energy in all it's forms works from pole to pole, negative to positive, dominance to submission, there is no reason to believe human energy works in any other way, no matter how hard vanilla peeps try to maintain that it can work when two dominant people hook up or two submissives hook up. The 2 Dom's will bash each others heads in, the 2 subs will bore each other to tears or continually victimize each other.
Dom with sub is natural flow, and again I'm not suggesting that men are the only Dominants. Equality happens at a mid point of that natural flow.
Energy in all it's forms works from pole to pole, negative to positive, dominance to submission, there is no reason to believe human energy works in any other way, no matter how hard vanilla peeps try to maintain that it can work when two dominant people hook up or two submissives hook up. The 2 Dom's will bash each others heads in, the 2 subs will bore each other to tears or continually victimize each other.
Dom with sub is natural flow, and again I'm not suggesting that men are the only Dominants. Equality happens at a mid point of that natural flow.
It's all coming back to me now... I believe we had this conversation a couple of years ago...you tried to convince me I was dominant and while i agree i have some very strong dominant traits... when in a relationship love quickly turns to contempt if he allows me to dominate the relationship.
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felixis99: what makes me sad, navygirl, is to hear people refer to the role of home maker in the traditional family , or the spouse of a home maker in the traditional family, as being "tied down" like it's a negative thing to have a family life with beautiful children. I think it's just weird to have a problem with that...but that's just me. Maybe his family life was not that happy. Those years don't really last that long, but we don't know that when we're in the midst of it....
It makes me sad to hear that tho' because it makes me feel like most people would consider the bulk of my adult life to be a waste of time. I know, employment-wise, hiring managers give little or no credit to the career of housewife. I am satisfied, however, to have the love & appreciation of my kids. They're awesome!!!
It makes me sad to hear that tho' because it makes me feel like most people would consider the bulk of my adult life to be a waste of time. I know, employment-wise, hiring managers give little or no credit to the career of housewife. I am satisfied, however, to have the love & appreciation of my kids. They're awesome!!!
Never a waste of time!!!My mom is one of the women I have the most respect for and she's been a stay at home mom her whole life...she had 5 of us and foster babies as well... but she also had has a wonderful marriage with my dad...55 years now.
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navygirl1: I agree with you that it is sad. I think values have changed over the years. My ex was just one of many I have heard say the same thing about marriage and family. I have always thought that people who get married and have children really should need to be sure before they take such a big step. My own mother said she wished she had never married or had kids. I wasn't upset with what she said as she gave up her military career and then saw me living the life she didn't. As for housewifes, I don't think managers have any idea of how much work a housewife has to do to keep the house running, and taking care of kids. I know I could never do it as I had to take care of my nephew for a week and that was hard. You have my admiration.
thank you!
I am glad that women have choices though!! a lot of my friends worked when their kids were young, some of us stayed at home. we have choices. that's the plus.
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jbibiza: Never a waste of time!!!My mom is one of the women I have the most respect for and she's been a stay at home mom her whole life...she had 5 of us and foster babies as well... but she also had has a wonderful marriage with my dad...55 years now.
WOW!! 55 years! AWESOMENESS!
Your mom is the kind of person we should address our relationship success questions to! Can you get her on here?
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jbibiza: A friend and I were talking the other day about how in some ways it's much tougher for men in regards to relationships.
In our parents and grandparents day women didn't really have a choice, especially if they had children. Good paying jobs weren't available and they were expected to stay in a marriage regardless of the situation.
Now women are told to become educated, assertive and capable and in doing so this has raised the bar in their expectations in a partner. If they don't like the situation they're in there's nothing to stop them from leaving.
In many regards I find this to be a positive change not only for women but for men as well.
In the past women stayed because they NEEDED the man. To me it seems more important that we stay because we WANT the man.
But maybe I'm wrong in thinking this... Maybe men feel it's more important to be needed.
What do you think?
Society has made it much easier to walk away from a marriage these day, good or bad thats the facts. We find it far easier to not want the hassle of trying to save the marriage.In our parents and grandparents day women didn't really have a choice, especially if they had children. Good paying jobs weren't available and they were expected to stay in a marriage regardless of the situation.
Now women are told to become educated, assertive and capable and in doing so this has raised the bar in their expectations in a partner. If they don't like the situation they're in there's nothing to stop them from leaving.
In many regards I find this to be a positive change not only for women but for men as well.
In the past women stayed because they NEEDED the man. To me it seems more important that we stay because we WANT the man.
But maybe I'm wrong in thinking this... Maybe men feel it's more important to be needed.
What do you think?
But the fact is that years ago many more marriages would have faltered if it was as easy to leave as it is today.
But this also means the fact that far too many people were stuck in an unhappy situation because of no ability to leave. So it has good and bad points to the ease of breaking up today.
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Englishman55: My father is a very chirpy, always smiling, good humoured man, but you are right... It did not make him happy, especially to see the woman he loved go through such mood swings.
No it is mine and my sisters responsibility to look after my mother, and have now (last April) placed her in a home, better equipped to deal with such illness.
That didn't make either of us happy either, but she is in a much safer environment than when she was living on her own.
My father still asks after her and is even planning to see her this year, although I am not so sure that is such a good idea.
She is still bitter and twisted that he left her after 30 years !
No it is mine and my sisters responsibility to look after my mother, and have now (last April) placed her in a home, better equipped to deal with such illness.
That didn't make either of us happy either, but she is in a much safer environment than when she was living on her own.
My father still asks after her and is even planning to see her this year, although I am not so sure that is such a good idea.
She is still bitter and twisted that he left her after 30 years !
How strange. From your posts I got the impression your mother had died and you were talking about your father in the past tense.
Hey ho, old age and what it does to the mind. It will come to all of us eventually.
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Thanks everyone for the input...so much info and different views... I look forward to reading it all again tomorrow...hopefully with some others points of view as well.
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trurorob: Society has made it much easier to walk away from a marriage these day, good or bad thats the facts. We find it far easier to not want the hassle of trying to save the marriage.
But the fact is that years ago many more marriages would have faltered if it was as easy to leave as it is today.
But this also means the fact that far too many people were stuck in an unhappy situation because of no ability to leave. So it has good and bad points to the ease of breaking up today.
But the fact is that years ago many more marriages would have faltered if it was as easy to leave as it is today.
But this also means the fact that far too many people were stuck in an unhappy situation because of no ability to leave. So it has good and bad points to the ease of breaking up today.
Well, can't say I have any experience in the marriage department, but when I find I am in a difficult relationship I will walk away; so no doubt I would do that in marriage. Life is too short for hassles and being unhappy. Why put yourself through it just because of a contract? I think if you have to work that hard at a marriage or relationship, its just not worth it.
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navygirl1: Well, can't say I have any experience in the marriage department, but when I find I am in a difficult relationship I will walk away; so no doubt I would do that in marriage. Life is too short for hassles and being unhappy. Why put yourself through it just because of a contract? I think if you have to work that hard at a marriage or relationship, its just not worth it.
I have learnt that lesson the hard way... so totally agree !
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It was never meant to be easy. This is why We make such a big deal out of the vows We make to each other. We make these Vows to each other before Our families, our peers and God. This is a ceromony common to all cultures. Although the ceromonies and details differ that fact remains, that We make these promises.
This suggests to Me that a lifelong relationship is against our (animal) instincts. And great effort and sacrifice has to be made.
I think We have all lost loved ones, some people loose arms or legs, and I think We all would like to be able to keep these thing forever.
Of course no one should have to live there life in misery. And nobody deserves to be abused! I guess this is why We must be very carefull about who We choose..
This suggests to Me that a lifelong relationship is against our (animal) instincts. And great effort and sacrifice has to be made.
I think We have all lost loved ones, some people loose arms or legs, and I think We all would like to be able to keep these thing forever.
Of course no one should have to live there life in misery. And nobody deserves to be abused! I guess this is why We must be very carefull about who We choose..
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jbibiza: See that is what I'm talking about...are we still supposed to be playing all these damsel in distress games when everyone goes on and on aout honesty being the most important thing in a relationship??
Don't consider it a game it is just giving your man what he wants with out being so obvious that you are doing it because it makes him feel gooooood and it is not always a game and should not be thought of as being dishonest it is how they are wired and what makes for a great relationship for MOST people------ This thread is Archived ------
lovely4u7da: I think we all want to be needed in a way but men they need their women to need them and we need our men to really really want us men like that damsel in distress kind of macho I am here for you baby and its ok but for some modern day women they dont need no one
even if you dont
at least act like it
sometimes
even if you dont
at least act like it
sometimes
Do you really beleive that? I would rather cut my wrist than to pretend to be a damsel in distress merely to stroke a man's ego.
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rohaan: I very abruptly ended a friendship (it was not romantic, however) with a woman some years back. The reason was her attitude. She was fond of saying "You know, your problem is, "You can't AFFORD me". (agreed. I can't 'afford' ANYONE with that attitude. Do you know that egotistical, sanctomonious people usually find themselves---all alone? (If you settle for money you'll earn every cent of it)!! (those numbnards!)
Couldn't agree more
been there, designed and wore the tshirt
never again
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My mothers father actually drew my father to one side, before they were married and said to my father.
Do you really know what you are taking on here son.
Are you sure you really want to do this.
You can walk away, if you wish.
My mother suffered serious manic depression all her life and I saw the hell it put my father through.... so yes, admirable in by book.
It sounds like your father went through hell. Good on him though he stuck it out as long as he did.