Should women have to pay Alimony ( Archived) (19)

Mar 28, 2013 3:57 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
tomcatwarne
tomcatwarnetomcatwarneOcean City, Plumouth, Devon, England UK289 Threads 7 Polls 17,106 Posts
By Patricia Reaney

NEW YORK, May 10 (Reuters) - Tables have turned in U.S. divorce courts with more women paying their former husbands alimony and child support than ever before, according to U.S. lawyers.

As women climb higher up the career ladder and outpace their exes in salary, when love goes wrong and marriages break up they are being compelled to contribute to the livelihood of their former spouses.

And some are not happy about it.

More than half, 56 percent, of divorce lawyers across the United States have seen an increase in mothers paying child support in the last three years and 47 percent have noted a hike in the number of women paying alimony, according to the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers.

"It shows that women have really moved up financially and that in many instances they are the major bread winners in a lot of families," said Alton Abramowitz, the president-elect of the academy.

"The glass ceiling has been pierced and more and more women have taken over the financial responsibilities and have been saddled with them as well. It is a fact of the way our society has evolved over the last number of years."

Abramowitz, who has been practicing law for 39 years, described the findings of the survey and the changed role of women in the workforce as a sea change.

In his graduating law school class of 135, there were just six women. Data from the Digest of Education Statistics show that the number of men and women receiving medical degrees in the U.S. is almost equal, unlike 1980 when only about a third of medical degrees were awarded to women.

The number of women getting law degrees has nearly doubled.

"You are seeing the results of that, the impact, now in terms of the professions," Abramowitz said.

Although women have made strides professionally, the divorce rate in the United States has remained fairly constant. About half of marriages in the United States end in divorce. The rate has hovered between 46 and 53 percent for decades, he added.

Just as many men grumbled about paying alimony to their former wives, women are not pleased with the turnaround.

"We see women who are every bit as angry as their male counterparts, maybe more so, when they are confronted with the concept of paying spousal support to a man," said Abramowitz.

The gender switch in alimony payments is just one of many changes he has seen during his four decades as a lawyer.

"When I started practicing in 1973 there was no equitable distribution of property," he said.

The 1,600 members of the Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers handle separations, prenuptial agreements, custody battles, property evaluation and division, the rights of unmarried couples, as well as divorce and child support.
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Mar 28, 2013 4:35 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
tomcatwarne
tomcatwarnetomcatwarneOcean City, Plumouth, Devon, England UK289 Threads 7 Polls 17,106 Posts
Why not????
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Mar 28, 2013 5:29 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
justjim63
justjim63justjim63port macquarie, New South Wales Australia14 Threads 2,592 Posts
In response to: By Patricia Reaney

NEW YORK, May 10 (Reuters) - Tables have turned in U.S. divorce courts with more women paying their former husbands alimony and child support than ever before, according to U.S. lawyers.

As women climb higher up the career ladder and outpace their exes in salary, when love goes wrong and marriages break up they are being compelled to contribute to the livelihood of their former spouses.

And some are not happy about it.

More than half, 56 percent, of divorce lawyers across the United States have seen an increase in mothers paying child support in the last three years and 47 percent have noted a hike in the number of women paying alimony, according to the American Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers.

"It shows that women have really moved up financially and that in many instances they are the major bread winners in a lot of families," said Alton Abramowitz, the president-elect of the academy.

"The glass ceiling has been pierced and more and more women have taken over the financial responsibilities and have been saddled with them as well. It is a fact of the way our society has evolved over the last number of years."

Abramowitz, who has been practicing law for 39 years, described the findings of the survey and the changed role of women in the workforce as a sea change.

In his graduating law school class of 135, there were just six women. Data from the Digest of Education Statistics show that the number of men and women receiving medical degrees in the U.S. is almost equal, unlike 1980 when only about a third of medical degrees were awarded to women.

The number of women getting law degrees has nearly doubled.

"You are seeing the results of that, the impact, now in terms of the professions," Abramowitz said.

Although women have made strides professionally, the divorce rate in the United States has remained fairly constant. About half of marriages in the United States end in divorce. The rate has hovered between 46 and 53 percent for decades, he added.

Just as many men grumbled about paying alimony to their former wives, women are not pleased with the turnaround.

"We see women who are every bit as angry as their male counterparts, maybe more so, when they are confronted with the concept of paying spousal support to a man," said Abramowitz.

The gender switch in alimony payments is just one of many changes he has seen during his four decades as a lawyer.

"When I started practicing in 1973 there was no equitable distribution of property," he said.

The 1,600 members of the Academy of Matrimonial Lawyers handle separations, prenuptial agreements, custody battles, property evaluation and division, the rights of unmarried couples, as well as divorce and child support.
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Mar 28, 2013 5:33 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
tomcatwarne
tomcatwarnetomcatwarneOcean City, Plumouth, Devon, England UK289 Threads 7 Polls 17,106 Posts
That looks remarkably similar to what I postedgrin grin grin
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Mar 28, 2013 5:38 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
justjim63
justjim63justjim63port macquarie, New South Wales Australia14 Threads 2,592 Posts
Woman already do in Australia, well sort of, we don't have alimony here, but we do have child support and we have superannuation splitting, if the father has custody of the children then as long as the mother is earning more than the father then she is legally obligedto pay child support to the father.It is worked out using a formula that takes into account the day to day expenses incurred in raising a child, taking into account such things as age, schooling, non financial partner support etc, it's not a bad system but of course there are those that whinge about it but you get that every where. Superannuation splitting is just that, superannuation is seen as just another asset of the marriage, and when that fails partners are able to file claim on superannution just as they could for any other assets related to the marriage. so ends the lesson.thumbs up professor
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Mar 28, 2013 5:47 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
jac379
jac379jac379pontyclun, South Glamorgan, Wales UK25 Threads 3 Polls 12,293 Posts
It strikes me, if people are angry about financially supporting their own children (and that may include paying the person who's job it is to care for them), then its largely a problem within their own psyche.

In the UK its kind of expected that you may be a full-time parent up until nursery/school age, have part-time employment up until they're 11-maybe 14 years old, but as they become more independent to look towards full-time employment (if the work is available). I can see how an ex-spouse might resent a primary carer making no financial input at appropriate times if payments are a struggle, however.

Its something which really needs negotiating and working towards as a family, even when those families no longer live together. There are so many variables (my daughter became highly dependant again at the age of 15 through illness), but really, bitterness and resentment needs to be expressed elsewhere when kids are involved.
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Mar 28, 2013 5:48 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
justjim63
justjim63justjim63port macquarie, New South Wales Australia14 Threads 2,592 Posts
tomcatwarne: That looks remarkably similar to what I posted


I flinched!doh
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Mar 28, 2013 5:49 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
Tomcats2
Tomcats2Tomcats2Norwich, Norfolk, England UK81 Threads 9 Polls 2,249 Posts
I bought my boys up whilst my ex worked she has a very good job when we split i was entitled to nothing from her even though i have the boys regulary however on the other hand we sat down and chatted and she decided she would give me some cash each month to cover when the boys stay i also have a credit card that i use to take them on trips as i have a low income . you dont have to go through the court system sometimes burying the hatchet is the best thing to do and do what is right for the children involved
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Mar 28, 2013 5:52 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
tomcatwarne
tomcatwarnetomcatwarneOcean City, Plumouth, Devon, England UK289 Threads 7 Polls 17,106 Posts
justjim63: I flinched!


rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing
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Mar 28, 2013 5:55 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
Merriweather
MerriweatherMerriweatherAdelaide, South Australia Australia51 Threads 11,403 Posts
Yes, that is nothing new for us here in Aus..

My girlfriend payed because she worked and her ex didn't...

and another lady I worked with, she had 4 boys, and she worked and payed her ex..

If as woman chooses to leave the marriage and the kids...

she pays... and usually doesn't complain

If its the other way round... blokes tend to cry a bit.. sigh
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Mar 28, 2013 5:57 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
justjim63
justjim63justjim63port macquarie, New South Wales Australia14 Threads 2,592 Posts
jac379: It strikes me, if people are angry about financially supporting their own children (and that may include paying the person who's job it is to care for them), then its largely a problem within their own psyche.

In the UK its kind of expected that you may be a full-time parent up until nursery/school age, have part-time employment up until they're 11-maybe 14 years old, but as they become more independent to look towards full-time employment (if the work is available). I can see how an ex-spouse might resent a primary carer making no financial input at appropriate times if payments are a struggle, however.

Its something which really needs negotiating and working towards as a family, even when those families no longer live together. There are so many variables (my daughter became highly dependant again at the age of 15 through illness), but really, bitterness and resentment needs to be expressed elsewhere when kids are involved.


I agree Jac, I have no qualms whatsoever in paying child support to my ex and can proudly say that I have not once ever missed a payment nor will I. Children don't have a say in being born, nor generally do they have much say if their parents divorce or seperate. As you quite rightly said Jac bitterness and resentment need to be left at the door as far as the childs welfare is concerned. Every child deserves a fair go.
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Mar 28, 2013 6:00 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
justjim63
justjim63justjim63port macquarie, New South Wales Australia14 Threads 2,592 Posts
Tomcats2: I bought my boys up whilst my ex worked she has a very good job when we split i was entitled to nothing from her even though i have the boys regulary however on the other hand we sat down and chatted and she decided she would give me some cash each month to cover when the boys stay i also have a credit card that i use to take them on trips as i have a low income . you dont have to go through the court system sometimes burying the hatchet is the best thing to do and do what is right for the children involved


Well done Tomcats, i wish there were more parents like You and Your ex.cheers
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Mar 28, 2013 6:00 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
tomcatwarne
tomcatwarnetomcatwarneOcean City, Plumouth, Devon, England UK289 Threads 7 Polls 17,106 Posts
Merriweather: Yes, that is nothing new for us here in Aus..

My girlfriend payed because she worked and her ex didn't...

and another lady I worked with, she had 4 boys, and she worked and payed her ex..

If as woman chooses to leave the marriage and the kids...

she pays... and usually doesn't complain

If its the other way round... blokes tend to cry a bit..



This is ok, it's good to see equality in action. both parents are responsible for the upbringing of the children, and their needs should have priority. The parent most able should pay. The kids shouldn't suffer
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Mar 28, 2013 6:05 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
Tomcats2
Tomcats2Tomcats2Norwich, Norfolk, England UK81 Threads 9 Polls 2,249 Posts
justjim63: Well done Tomcats, i wish there were more parents like You and Your ex.
yeah Jim we still dont like each other much thoughlaugh but we said we would put the kids first sometimes its hard but you have to its not there fault their parents dont want to be together anymore and their happiness is the upmost importance to me and my expeace
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Mar 28, 2013 6:08 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
single_martha
single_marthasingle_marthaTangerang, Banten Indonesia8 Threads 101 Posts
tomcatwarne: This is ok, it's good to see equality in action. both parents are responsible for the upbringing of the children, and their needs should have priority. The parent most able should pay. The kids shouldn't suffer

thumbs up thumbs up kiss
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Mar 28, 2013 7:02 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
jac379
jac379jac379pontyclun, South Glamorgan, Wales UK25 Threads 3 Polls 12,293 Posts
Something I've heard on more than one occasion and have been subject to myself, is the resentment about how the money is spent.

I did once get a child maintenance payment from my daughter's father and the first thing I did was go out and buy myself a pair of shoes. I'd already made sure my daughter wanted for nothing and the soles were hanging off the bottom of my boots because I always prioritised her.

I remember a friend complaining that his ex went out for a drink once a fortnight paid for with his money. I asked him what his daughter was going without and he said, "Nothing, her mother cares for her really well". I said, "Then its not your tenner she's clutching when she goes out, its hers. The money you give her is obviously being spent on your daughter. Don't you think its good for your daughter that her mum gets to recharge her batteries once a fortnight?"

I think the resentment comes in when a paying parent believes that either they shouldn't have to support their own child(ren), they resent any possible benefit to the primary caring parent, or they believe the money remains theirs and their partner is somehow unable to budget the money how they see fit for the benefit of the family.

I appreciate that maybe some of those feelings are natural after a break up, but people really need to get their head around the issue.
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Mar 28, 2013 7:32 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
Merriweather
MerriweatherMerriweatherAdelaide, South Australia Australia51 Threads 11,403 Posts
I always wonder at these types of conversations..

I mean, they are valid... but say..

In my case, my hubby died ( at 33 ) so I simply went ahead and brought up the boys myself..

I never had these maintence payment troubles...

and yes it was not always a picnic... but my priority was to make sure the boys got a good education and went down the path of their intended vocations... so that now.. I dont have to worry about them at all..grin

They are fine... and they dont have to worry about me... coz I still work, and I am fine..

all good - without the hassle. cartwheel
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Mar 28, 2013 7:38 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
bubbles2012
bubbles2012bubbles2012Southern Brisbane, Queensland Australia22 Threads 1 Polls 784 Posts
An acquaintance of mine, told me today that her ex husband wants her to pay him alimony, however, I told her I don't think that applies in Australia.. Just because she has a business - a one man business (hairdressing) that her business should pay for his lifestyle...

Yet he works, they have no children, his income is greater, but he wants her to pay him... Too me that sounds so wrong...confused
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Mar 28, 2013 8:54 AM CST Should women have to pay Alimony
Maus19
Maus19Maus19Kilkenny, Ireland3 Threads 397 Posts
Should women have to pay Alimony ?

As a general rule, for me, the answer would be No.
and that would not be gender specific.

'Alimony has nothing to do with child support, meaning the divorced couple doesn't have to have children in order for an ex spouse to receive alimony. Alimony is to help (or completely) support the ex spouse, while child support is to help support the children. '

While I do see reasons and circumstance where it could be appropriate. Being that one of the parties reaps the fruits of the others previous labour; in business or other.
But that would be a case to case minefield.
I also don't see the need for equality in standard of living. Not suggesting one part should live in poverty.
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