roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
She can kill with a smile She can wound with her eyes She can ruin your faith with her casual lies And she only reveals what she wants you to see She hides like a child But she's always a woman to me
She can lead you to live She can take you or leave you She can ask for the truth But she'll never believe you And she'll take what you give her as long as it's free She steals like a thief But she's always a woman to me
Oh, she takes care of herself She can wait if she wants She's ahead of her time Oh, and she never gives out And she never gives in She just changes her mind
She will promise you more Than the Garden of Eden Then she'll carelessly cut you And laugh while you're bleedin' But she'll bring out the best And the worst you can be Blame it all on yourself Cause she's always a woman to me
She is frequently kind And she's suddenly cruel She can do as she pleases She's nobody's fool But she can't be convicted She's earned her degree And the most she will do Is throw shadows at you But she's always a woman to me
These are the lyrics to Billy Joel's "She's Always a Woman to Me"
I have just seen a documentary (Melvin Bragg, for those who know him) on the songwriter/singer. Apparently, he had accusations thrown at him that the song was "mysoginistic".....
Personally, I feel its something of an accolade to women.... describing all facets that encompass a woman.... but then its all down to interpretation, yeah?
Wadda you think? Is ther something I've missed per chance?
roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
gingerb: I think he described many of the whimsies and facets of womanhood that most women would recognise in themselves. It's a great song.
Indeed!!! He probably describes a woman that a less than "enlightened" man wouldn't recognise.... or would misinterpret?? Though, Conrad has a point.... perhaps enlightened AND bitter??
roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
What about "Just the Way You Are"?? Again.... it has been proported that this was about a man wanting a "bimbo" type, that didn't think for herself and that he didn't want to change (possibly because it served his purpose??)..... yet, some romantic types may suggest that its because he adored her so much that he didn't want her to change...??
I'd like to go with the latter... but perhaps that's the soppy in me??
roseofsharon: Indeed!!! He probably describes a woman that a less than "enlightened" man wouldn't recognise.... or would misinterpret?? Though, Conrad has a point.... perhaps enlightened AND bitter??
I think to the less enlightened it might seem bitter from the descriptive lines, but you know he isn't being bitter at the end of every verse when he says, "but she's always a woman to me". It's like saying that no matter how she appears, that might not seem good sometimes, the essence or warmth of womanhood is always reserved for him. Well to my interpretation anyway. They are the words of a man in love.
ClaayerWild Wild South West, Cornwall, England UK15,888 posts
roseofsharon: What about "Just the Way You Are"?? Again.... it has been proported that this was about a man wanting a "bimbo" type, that didn't think for herself and that he didn't want to change (possibly because it served his purpose??)..... yet, some romantic types may suggest that its because he adored her so much that he didn't want her to change...?? I'd like to go with the latter... but perhaps that's the soppy in me??
Any thoughts?
Me too.. I'm certain that's how it is meant. It's a lovely song.
What I get out of it is she uses her womanly charm over men to manipulate them into getting what she wants.. lots of women do that, especialy the one that are very good looking and they know they are.. no offense ment, but I believe it's true.. imo
roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
gingerb: I think to the less enlightened it might seem bitter from the descriptive lines, but you know he isn't being bitter at the end of every verse when he says, "but she's always a woman to me". It's like saying that no matter how she appears, that might not seem good sometimes, the essence or warmth of womanhood is always reserved for him. Well to my interpretation anyway. They are the words of a man in love.
roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
Daniel4021: What I get out of it is she uses her womanly charm over men to manipulate them into getting what she wants.. lots of women do that, especialy the one that are very good looking and they know they are.. no offense ment, but I believe it's true.. imo
Thank goodness I have a face like a robber's dog then, eh?? Means I'm a nice person...??
Claayer: Me too.. I'm certain that's how it is meant. It's a lovely song.
I don't think it's either ...
I think he can't be bothered to get re-acquainted with "her" has her mind expends and she matures and is interested in new things ... that might include changing the way she looks etc ...
He wants her to stay like she was they met!!!! The good news is that 20 years laters when all the new fangled ideas have been thrown out, and everyone "goes back to basics" and the same era fashion has been revived SHE will be the most avant-garde girl in town!!!!!!! Turn round look at him and say "you old fashioned miserable old sod" I'm off!!!!
roseofsharonOPmanchester, Hampshire, England UK8,699 posts
FlowerOfTheSun: I don't think it's either ...
I think he can't be bothered to get re-acquainted with "her" has her mind expends and she matures and is interested in new things ... that might include changing the way she looks etc ...
He wants her to stay like she was they met!!!! The good news is that 20 years laters when all the new fangled ideas have been thrown out, and everyone "goes back to basics" and the same era fashion has been revived SHE will be the most avant-garde girl in town!!!!!!! Turn round look at him and say "you old fashioned miserable old sod" I'm off!!!!
Good point!! Especially as women evolve at a much faster rate than men...!! A completely different take on it.... I like it!!
alabamabebeBanks of the Warrior River, Alabama USA4,404 posts
roseofsharon: What about "Just the Way You Are"?? Again.... it has been proported that this was about a man wanting a "bimbo" type, that didn't think for herself and that he didn't want to change (possibly because it served his purpose??)..... yet, some romantic types may suggest that its because he adored her so much that he didn't want her to change...??
I'd like to go with the latter... but perhaps that's the soppy in me??
Any thoughts?
Just the Way You Are just means what it says. He doesn't want her to change to try and please him, he loves her the way she is.
I think in She's Always a Woman to Me he's describing one woman, the way her perceives her, accepting her as she is, good and bad.
I feel like some people try to analyze songs like this too much, taking into account the entire history of the song-writer and all his relationships. Songs are usually just about a point in time, the feelings of the moment. I just enjoy the moment, especially if it's a place I'm in at the time, or can relate to being in.
alabamabebe: Just the Way You Are just means what it says. He doesn't want her to change to try and please him, he loves her the way she is.
I think in She's Always a Woman to Me he's describing one woman, the way her perceives her, accepting her as she is, good and bad.
I feel like some people try to analyze songs like this too much, taking into account the entire history of the song-writer and all his relationships. Songs are usually just about a point in time, the feelings of the moment. I just enjoy the moment, especially if it's a place I'm in at the time, or can relate to being in.
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She can wound with her eyes
She can ruin your faith with her casual lies
And she only reveals what she wants you to see
She hides like a child
But she's always a woman to me
She can lead you to live
She can take you or leave you
She can ask for the truth
But she'll never believe you
And she'll take what you give her as long as it's free
She steals like a thief
But she's always a woman to me
Oh, she takes care of herself
She can wait if she wants
She's ahead of her time
Oh, and she never gives out
And she never gives in
She just changes her mind
She will promise you more
Than the Garden of Eden
Then she'll carelessly cut you
And laugh while you're bleedin'
But she'll bring out the best
And the worst you can be
Blame it all on yourself
Cause she's always a woman to me
She is frequently kind
And she's suddenly cruel
She can do as she pleases
She's nobody's fool
But she can't be convicted
She's earned her degree
And the most she will do
Is throw shadows at you
But she's always a woman to me
These are the lyrics to Billy Joel's "She's Always a Woman to Me"
I have just seen a documentary (Melvin Bragg, for those who know him) on the songwriter/singer. Apparently, he had accusations thrown at him that the song was "mysoginistic".....
Personally, I feel its something of an accolade to women.... describing all facets that encompass a woman.... but then its all down to interpretation, yeah?
Wadda you think? Is ther something I've missed per chance?
An enlightened man..... or a bitter man??