All Vegan Not The BEST Choice ( Archived) (16)

Aug 26, 2008 1:03 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
(NaturalNews) This interview is an excerpt from Kevin Gianni's Renegade Roundtable, which can be found at (http://www.RenegadeRoundtable.com) . In this excerpt, Jonny Bowden shares on plant-based proteins and omega-3s.

Kevin: We're talking about protein and amino acids right now. So I had one question about a plant-based source of protein. A lot of people who are on this call may or may not be vegan and a lot of them don't necessarily want to eat meat or have that sort of protein. What are your thoughts on plant-based proteins? What do you think are some of the better ones?

Jonny: Well, let me give full disclosure. I'm not a vegan or vegetarian. I find that a very difficult way to live and I am not convinced that that is necessarily the best way for our species to exist. I have all the concerns that many of the people on the call have about the quality of the protein that we eat and about factory farming for animals and the cruelty and not to mention the steroids and antibiotics and growth hormones and all of that other stuff in the milk that I'm eating. I certainly don't recommend that to anyone, but I do think that in the long run, the human species does do well with some animal products in our diet. Maybe it's once a week. Maybe for some metabolic types or some genetic types it's three times a day. The human species has adapted to many different types of diets, but one diet it has not adapted to is the high processed food, high sugar diet.

That's across the board, so you'll see the Bantu of South Africa, who do very well on an 80% carbohydrate diet and you'll see the Inuit, that used to be called the Eskimo in Greenland and in Alaska who eat virtually nothing but whale blubber and seal meat, because vegetables don't even grow up there and they do very, very well. None of them eat sugar and none of them eat stuff with a bar code, so I think that there is a wide range of diets that we can adapt to, but I do think that even the longest lived people in the world may eat very little meat, but they eat a little bit of it. It's certainly not the supermarket meat we're talking about. It's usually grass fed or free range or pasture fed and healthy cows and happy cows that live on pasture.

So I'm not someone who has a lot of personal experience with a vegan diet. My metabolic type is not suited for that. I do think we'd all benefit by having more raw foods in our diet. 20% or 50% the exact number, I don't know. It's going to vary for different people, but we all want some raw fruits and vegetables in our diet. No question about it, these kinds of things. I think that even people who are on a high-protein diet, even people who are following Atkins should eat more vegetables. I think across the board we all would benefit from more vegetables in our diet. This is not contradictory to a higher protein, higher fat diet. We need more vegetables in our diet across the board. I would say that that's true.

Continued...
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Aug 26, 2008 1:04 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
Now that said, how do we get the best quality protein if we don't want to eat any animal or fish-based food and the answer is, I don't know. The inconvenient truth, if you will, is that vegetable protein and plant-based protein is not the same quality. It just isn't. You can't get your B12 from plant-based diets. I understand that the vegan and the raw food people believe differently, but that's not just my opinion. It's pretty much been documented. It's in the Encyclopedia of Dietary Supplementation that's put out by a blue ribbon committee. B12 is just not there. It's not absorbable. It's not available, but the iron that's in plant food is not the same quality as in animal foods. Can we manage with a plant-based diet or with an exclusively plant-based diet? We can and sometimes it's a very healthy thing to do as a detox or as a temporary strategy to balance the acid diet that many of us have been on to help cure some diseases. I think it can be very valuable, but in the long range, year in and year out without any fish in the diet, without any eggs, without any whey protein I think it's very, very tough. Beans have protein in them. Many of the vegetable sources are just lacking in an amino acid or two. Their amino acid profile is just not quite as good. Can we manage? Sure we can.

My recommendation to people who want to follow that kind of diet is you maybe should just bend the rules a little bit and have some fish. You're just not going to get omega-threes from plant foods and that includes flaxseed and I'm a big supporter of flaxseed. It's not the same. There are two omega threes that are found in fish. The body doesn't convert them very well. You need that EPA and DHA. They're essential for health. They're essential for the brain, for the cardiovascular system. So I think that if there was a way that you could live with some small amount of fish in the diet or some amount of eggs from happy chickens, free range chickens or a little bit of whey protein I think that that would be a very good balance to a vegan diet or to a diet that is largely vegan, if not 100% vegan.
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Aug 26, 2008 1:11 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
I agree with Kevin here.

I am a juicer of veggies and a smoothie lover!
I eat very little red meat, but sometimes once a week.
I eat lots of fish, mostly Salmon, ummmmmmmm!
I steam veggies, make homemade whole grain breads for fiber.
Drink lots of spring water and try to include regular detoxification to keep my body in balance.
I will occasionally use an egg (free range) in a recipe, but I do avoid store bought milk. I use soy milk or raw milk. I am not a milk drinker, but I use it for mashed potatoes or cakes, etc, in recipes.

Many may try to dispute my diet, but look at me. I am soon to be 54 and I weigh 100 lbs, am full of energy and of sound mind. I am Healthy and it comes thru living a Healthy Lifestyle. I try to keep balance in Mind, Body and Soul. It all works together. I speak from my own experience.

Please share your experience with us!
What works for YOU?
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Aug 26, 2008 1:44 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving: I agree with Kevin here.

I am a juicer of veggies and a smoothie lover!
I eat very little red meat, but sometimes once a week.
I eat lots of fish, mostly Salmon, ummmmmmmm!
I steam veggies, make homemade whole grain breads for fiber.
Drink lots of spring water and try to include regular detoxification to keep my body in balance.
I will occasionally use an egg (free range) in a recipe, but I do avoid store bought milk. I use soy milk or raw milk. I am not a milk drinker, but I use it for mashed potatoes or cakes, etc, in recipes.

Many may try to dispute my diet, but look at me. I am soon to be 54 and I weigh 100 lbs, am full of energy and of sound mind. I am Healthy and it comes thru living a Healthy Lifestyle. I try to keep balance in Mind, Body and Soul. It all works together. I speak from my own experience.

Please share your experience with us!
What works for YOU?

100 lbs.?re you under 5'4 small frame?
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Aug 26, 2008 1:46 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
? to Healthy Living or anyone who knows answer.What is a vegan.Awae vegatarians,onlyeat veggies,then there is a group that doesn't eat meat but everything else,been years forgot the name.Now Vegans.Please educated me on this.
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Aug 26, 2008 1:48 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
nomindgames: 100 lbs.?re you under 5'4 small frame?



Yes, I am small frame and 5'2" tall. Same size as when I was in my early teens until I was 21. I stayed about 110 for many years, but have recently returned to the 100lb mark since changing my dietary habits and removing sugars and soda pops completely, 2 years ago.
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Aug 26, 2008 1:51 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
nomindgames: ? to Healthy Living or anyone who knows answer.What is a vegan.Awae vegatarians,onlyeat veggies,then there is a group that doesn't eat meat but everything else,been years forgot the name.Now Vegans.Please educated me on this.



Vegans eat no meats, fish, poultry, or dairy products.
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Aug 26, 2008 1:52 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving: Vegans eat no meats, fish, poultry, or dairy products.


Thank you for answerhug
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Aug 26, 2008 1:53 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
nomindgames: ? to Healthy Living or anyone who knows answer.What is a vegan.Awae vegatarians,onlyeat veggies,then there is a group that doesn't eat meat but everything else,been years forgot the name.Now Vegans.Please educated me on this.



Vegetarians eat whatever their preference... it varies.
Mainly fruits, veggies and nuts and grains, but may include fish or chicken, etc. Also, they may or may not include dairy products.
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Aug 26, 2008 3:09 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
Jan1305
Jan1305Jan1305Sunshine and vino, Murcia Spain170 Threads 5,319 Posts
It seems to me we go around in circles trying to make sense of the wildly differing and ever changing 'professional' opinions on healthy eating.

I'm not a vegetarian, but limit my intake of red meat to once a week and I do eat fish. However I avoid salmon for the following reasons.

Much of the salmon eaten and sold in supermarkets is farmed and raised in floating net pens or factory farms. Using this method results in a huge amount of waste and parasites which inevitably spoils the marine environment and spreads disease. Farmed salmon are given antibiotics and other drugs which experts believe can put you at greater risk of cancer. Salmon flesh also contains high amounts of cholestorol and fat.

Artificial colourants are also fed to farmed salmon to make the flesh pink. Worse, farmed salmon are cooped up like battery hens and if they escape they spread disease among the wild salmon and other fish which could mean extinction in the future.

Give me a plate of fresh grilled sardines any day.
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Aug 26, 2008 3:12 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
StressFree
StressFreeStressFreesmall city, Kalmar Sweden176 Threads 16 Polls 8,986 Posts
Diamond123: Just curious. I am religious, I eat meat,


Man, sounds like a cool t-shirt for some San Franciscans....rolling on the floor laughing



Thanks for the info HLwave bouquet
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Aug 26, 2008 3:25 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
Jan1305: It seems to me we go around in circles trying to make sense of the wildly differing and ever changing 'professional' opinions on healthy eating.

I'm not a vegetarian, but limit my intake of red meat to once a week and I do eat fish. However I avoid salmon for the following reasons.

Much of the salmon eaten and sold in supermarkets is farmed and raised in floating net pens or factory farms. Using this method results in a huge amount of waste and parasites which inevitably spoils the marine environment and spreads disease. Farmed salmon are given antibiotics and other drugs which experts believe can put you at greater risk of cancer. Salmon flesh also contains high amounts of cholestorol and fat.

Artificial colourants are also fed to farmed salmon to make the flesh pink. Worse, farmed salmon are cooped up like battery hens and if they escape they spread disease among the wild salmon and other fish which could mean extinction in the future.

Give me a plate of fresh grilled sardines any day.



Ok Jan, now you have me currious...
How can I tell if my Salmon is fresh out of the streams or ocean and not farm raised? Should it be labeled as such? I usually buy the ones labeled "Pacific Salmon", however I have also seen in the stores, "Atlantic Salmon", but never bought. I have seen "farm raised catfish", but not Salmon. I did not know they raised them on farms. They have to meddle with everything!!! I also eat Mahi-Mahi, whiting and Talipia. Should I watchout for them also being farmraised?

I haven't developed the taste for Sardines, but I so love Kippered Smoked Hering!!! uuuuuummmmmmmmm! A great source of Omega 3's!!!
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Aug 26, 2008 3:57 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
Jan1305
Jan1305Jan1305Sunshine and vino, Murcia Spain170 Threads 5,319 Posts
HealthyLiving: Ok Jan, now you have me currious...
How can I tell if my Salmon is fresh out of the streams or ocean and not farm raised? Should it be labeled as such? I usually buy the ones labeled "Pacific Salmon", however I have also seen in the stores, "Atlantic Salmon", but never bought. I have seen "farm raised catfish", but not Salmon. I did not know they raised them on farms. They have to meddle with everything!!! I also eat Mahi-Mahi, whiting and Talipia. Should I watchout for them also being farmraised?

I haven't developed the taste for Sardines, but I so love Kippered Smoked Hering!!! uuuuuummmmmmmmm! A great source of Omega 3's!!!


When I decided to cut down on on red meat around 10 years ago it was also the time when salmon was getting a bad press.

Since around 2003/4 EU regulations state that salmon on sale should be clearly labelled wild or farmed, (though this has been abused by supermarkets and fishmongers in isolated cases) not just for health reasons, but also to protect the natural environment. As for the USA, I guess the same regulations have been put into place, but I don't know for sure.

Atlantic salmon have more fat, obviously since they live in colder waters, but this also means they have a higher omega value. However, most of Atlantic salmon is farmed and full of additives, disease etc, so I would always opt for Pacific wild salmon if I were to buy it.

You should try sardines, they are delicious and rich in omega 3 fatty acids. They are also very low in mercury and other contaminates apparently. I don't know about the USA but in Spain (and Portugal where they are an integral part of the diet) they are also very cheap.

Yummy!

wave
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Aug 26, 2008 4:27 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
Jan1305: When I decided to cut down on on red meat around 10 years ago it was also the time when salmon was getting a bad press.

Since around 2003/4 EU regulations state that salmon on sale should be clearly labelled wild or farmed, (though this has been abused by supermarkets and fishmongers in isolated cases) not just for health reasons, but also to protect the natural environment. As for the USA, I guess the same regulations have been put into place, but I don't know for sure.

Atlantic salmon have more fat, obviously since they live in colder waters, but this also means they have a higher omega value. However, most of Atlantic salmon is farmed and full of additives, disease etc, so I would always opt for Pacific wild salmon if I were to buy it.

You should try sardines, they are delicious and rich in omega 3 fatty acids. They are also very low in mercury and other contaminates apparently. I don't know about the USA but in Spain (and Portugal where they are an integral part of the diet) they are also very cheap.

Yummy!



I did remember after I posted that I have bought "Wild Salmon" too and figured it would probably be the best one.

I may try the Sardines one day. I have recently noticed some very good sounding recipes in my Mediterranean Cook Book, for Sardines. Yes, they are very cheap here also.

Actually, the Atlantic is much warmer waters than the Pacific, due to the Gulf-Stream.

Thanks for your help, it is much appreciated! I will watch labels closely when choosing my Salmon, or move to Alaska where fresh Salmon is plentiful and catch my own!laugh I really really love the taste of it... I practically drool for Salmon! I love it Grilled with Terrakki Glaze!!!
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Aug 26, 2008 4:36 PM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
crotalus_p
crotalus_pcrotalus_pRush, Dublin Ireland43 Threads 6 Polls 2,789 Posts
HealthyLiving: Ok Jan, now you have me currious...
How can I tell if my Salmon is fresh out of the streams or ocean and not farm raised?


Wild salmon meat is a much darker red and has tons more flavour due to their diet , unless you have experience of both you will have to rely on you fishmongers worduh oh
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Aug 28, 2008 6:33 AM CST All Vegan Not The BEST Choice
HealthyLiving
HealthyLivingHealthyLivingSomewhere In, Tennessee USA527 Threads 2 Polls 4,775 Posts
crotalus_p: Wild salmon meat is a much darker red and has tons more flavour due to their diet , unless you have experience of both you will have to rely on you fishmongers word


Yes, I have figured out that Wild Salmon is the way to go. It is much tastier. I got confused when she spoke of "adding color", then I almost freaked, but you are correct, in what you have stated. Thanks!
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