What is the difference? ( Archived) (371)

Thinking about some of the things that have been said here, it seems to me that there are two basic approaches to spirituality. One approach, if my understanding is correct, is about the mind. It’s a matter of training the mind to think about things differently, and to see things differently. I’m still not sure what the rewards of that are, but I can accept the principle that the way you view life will influence how happy you are with it.

The other approach seems to have a supernatural flavour to it. There is the ordinary world, where the laws of physics apply, and then there is this other world that operates on a different set of laws. Perhaps I’m wrong about that, maybe there is just one system but there are areas of it that most of us can’t, or don’t know how to access. Either way, this type of spirituality makes claims that are harder to accept, and again, I’m not sure what the ultimate goal of those who enter into is.

Somebody will probably tell me I’ve got all that wrong, but supposing I haven’t, then are they really two branches of the same thing, or are they different things altogether?

You have a pretty good understanding at this point. Surely any change in what the mind does or thinks as a dominant thought pattern would change anyone inside which would reveal a concurrent outer behavior.

A good assessment Circlip. The goal is first personal peace, love and a return to engaging oneness. We haven't really left oneness but our perception, because of body and form, makes it look that way. Spending time spiritually is the path for lack of a better term to rekindle your connection with god/higher self/source,whatever you're inclined to call that higher power. After the personal goal your spiritual attainment emanates outward. This doesn't make one better than others but it does help them to become more of an 'adept' as a teacher I think.

So are you saying that both those approaches I described are just different roads to the same place?

And is my assessment really that good, did I get it right? One way is purely psychological, while the other is mystical, and involves things that earthly logic simply cannot explain.

Well I haven't got that good a grasp on it, because there are things still puzzling me.

When you talk about spiritual awareness, you seem to be saying that what it amounts to is a state of mind, to put it simply. Now others have talked about the spirit or soul operating remotely from the body, and on the death of the body, returning to the earth attached to a new body. That seems to be quite a different kettle of fish to me. Where do you stand on that?

Yes, your assessment is fundamentally correct, It could use some refinement but that sort of thing comes with knowledge or awareness of deeper, more correct perceptions.

Your first paragraph in your previous post is about the mind and a realization of it's basic import in one's behaviors and thought patterns that make how and what we see in our physical world. This part is required as it is a fundamental awareness of how the mind makes form in this physical world.

Your second paragraph form your previous post is another awareness consisting of the seeing a physical (illusion) world with your eyes and senses, and seeing the potential and only true reality of infinite spirit. Yes it's mystical and harder to grasp because the physical illusion is so well built as to hide the reality of spirit. This has purpose but the purpose of the illusion changes for everyone.

Both of these 'realizations' and or awarenesses are required fundamentally in moving toward the 'place' of a spiritual goal which I explained above is love, peace, compassion and connection with holy spirit/god/source. It involves several other things but for simplicity I'm just mentioning basics.

So I would say connected roads to the one place. Both serve one objective- awareness on the path.

Not correcting your 'different roads' statement just stating it in a way that forms their connection.

Just so I'm clear, when you say spirit and god, etc. do you mean it literally or metaphorically?

We have consciousness, and nothing beyond that. I don't think of it as spirit or soul or anything other than consciousness, and I think it is entirely dependant on the living brain for its existence. I can't see any reason to think that consciousness persists after the death of the body, and I don't believe in reincarnation. What we consider to be real or illusion very much depends on definitions. In fact, most of our problems in understanding and communicating come down to definitions. I'm not saying this is how everybody should view things, far from it, we all have to make sense of the world and existence in our own way. That's my way, or part of it. I don't think my opinions and beliefs are particularly radical, and I can't see why anyone would object to them.

I have My father gave me a little veg patch to grow things and to keep the rabbits out I used to set snares. I'd catch, skin, cook and eat the rabbits I caught. And they were delicious too. I've plucked more chickens than I care to remember as well. collected eggs, milked cows and even de-horned cattle.....I always drew the line at shooting though because I always considered it an unfair advantage....and to be honest I was capable of providing a meal without the need of a gun..not that I had to.., but being a country girl and all that..it was a right of passage...

I love this question.

I'm fairly certain that there are no metaphors for god that would satisfy and a literal attempt defies any clear description. That I and you, everyone in fact are son's or children of god baffles me in providing a description so describing god in a satisfactory way .. emmm... . It feels comforting, restful, peaceful though. There's difficulty in using words to describe.

It may seem odd but when I say god, I mean oneness. Everything and everyone that is, is in our mind, your mind, one mind. There's only one. To grasp the creator, god, from experiencing oneness is something I have not had the pleasure of receiving but it is part of my goals. I understand oneness but the complete depth of the wholeness experience eludes me at present.

This began for me from reading 'The Law of One' and following the instructions given which say , "when you see your brother, see you." The idea that we are not separate entities is fundamental in understanding god or at least making our way back to god/source.

Spirit is you, it is me. A shard if you will of the creator in the infinite creation of god. It can be archetypal in infinite ways. I think it loosely refers to a chosen beingness of which there are infinite spirits.

To be honest this god word is rather new to me in use. I used to prefer the word source. I am not sure why but it seemed less inflaming in groups and conversions. I am not christian or any particular religion but I am quite comfortably spirit and know that words and symbols are given meaning from individuated perspectives.

This is perfectly fine. In fact perfect for you. You are exactly where you are supposed to be at any given moment. There is always a reason why we hold the beliefs that we do and it always serves you and your highest good. There's a wise saying that says. "everything is for you, nothing is against you." A slight alteration in perception of the things coming to you in life is helpful.

I have already posted my thoughts on consciousness and you allowed those gracefully. I won't batter the witness in debate because that would feel like trying to convert or change you and that my friend is your choice. I appreciate being given an ear. I think you're a decent bloke even if you're not so spiritual in your beliefs.