Dang Ship....you act like Farracon is modern day version of a choir boy. He leads a group that is the direct off shoot of the Black Panthers. He is about as divisive in our country as David Duke is and Henry Wallace were.
We fully realize that Obama did not request the endorsement. We also say....look where the endorsement is coming from. What is wrong with that?
Let me put into a different setting. You are making a resume' for a job that you want. You need three references to list on it. Ship.....are you saying that one of referrence, you list would be Louis Farracon? If you could? Or list David Duke as one?
I would not list either....if I had contact and the ability to do so which I don't...as references. Why? Because most people....most mid road people....would say.....he knows some pretty radical people....and my chances of getting the job just grew thinner.
I caught it as well.....rolled on the floor when Obama said that the person that gave him the middle name of Hussien.....did not know he was going to run for President.
Aslo when McCain said he was going to fire all his high level staff and replace then with Joe the plummers.
Do you know how Snopes, Fact check and such sites operate?
They have PEOPLE watching the debate or the canidate statements and making a either some net research or opinion on them to make them either ...lies or truths.
PEOPLE with bias, with less than full knoweldge, with different opinions and belief systems. Determining the lies and truths of other PEOPLE?........a modern electronic version of the Spanish Inquisition without the torture.
I would not use my last hours with my son before he went to war for a political stunt. tinymac.
As for being unique....he is the only military father here in the US.....and I know a number of them......that has done this. Biden did not. Nor did Palin. So for in the US, I would say it is unique.
Maybe the young did get the message.....that service to one country...is a noble thing....that sometimes will ask the ultimate sacrifice.
I think for a moment you need to consider the situation he took his son into for a moment, tinymac.
He could of let his 18 year old son have the day off.....instead takes him on what the military calls a condolence assignment. To meet with someone that lost family in military operations.
Condolence assignments are tough enough alone. Much less knowing that soon your son is headed to the same place and danger.
McCain wanted to make a point to his son. This was as much for his son as it was for the woman.
What do you think that the point was, tinymac? I think that I know.
Very few military fathers would think to take thier sons on condolence assigments. Maybe all military fathers should do exactly that.
Ship, I think that Obama is a Christian. I also think that he spent his religous 'decisions years' as a youth in a Muslim country, attending a Muslim school.
More people at those young ages make thier decision of faith than any other age.
Do you think that your faith or mine, could get 'twisted' if during those decision years.....we lived in a Muslim country and attended a Muslim school?
I did not meet my first Muslim untill age 18. Obama grew up in a multi cultured family of Christian and Muslim. He had more contact with Muslims by the age 10, than most have until they get to college.
According to his own admission.....it was not until Rev. Wright 'led him to Christ' in his late 20s when he became a Christian.
You simply don't wish to admit any of that with your statement, Ship.
But it gives you context on how he can say in the OP, what was said. I don't know if such was said by Obama......but can understand if it was said by him.....with that context of his past.
Everyone has a different journey in life to Christ and with God in my opinion. A different path so to speak. I am not saying that Obama's was less or more than someone elses. Because if you really understand the Cross.....it makes everyone just about the same. The Cross is the great equalizer, Ship.
I feel there are plus's and negatives to Obama's past and youth. Plus's certainly are his ethnic and cultural diversity allow him to identify and make contact with a wide range of peoples, cultures and faiths.
Negatives are that most Americans are Christians, wish to be lead by a Christian firmly rooted in the faith. And after seeing some of Rev. Wright's church services and hearing Louis Farracon calling him "the modern Messiah" and knowing this history of Muslim connections......have questions to how rooted in that faith he is.
People (around the globe) have placed this election as watermark test of if the American society is racially biased, or Muslim phobic, or radically challenged. To them if Obama is defeated or challenged on such issues......it means the society or person is biased and to be condemmed. If they wish to make that judgement on 300 million Americans....hey have it. If they wish to make the judgement on me....as I have vetted Obama as any American should.....hey again have at it.
It was the society of those 300 milllion Americans....that let a young man by the name of Barak Obama.....have the education, the opportunities in life to have a shot at its top Government position. It was individuals like myself and others, that have religous tolerance and ethnic tolerance that made that kind of society a reality.
Name another country in the world.....that lets minority personage have such a opportunity? You will think long and hard to find one.
I am researching a pretty important tech project at present. So this is likely one of my last post here. I hope you enjoy it and the debate we have had on the 2008 election.
If I get the research done and submitted.....it might become a political issue yet in the election. Don't worry Dude....it is of a neutral political issue.....and is not a device that can sap DEMs or Obama and send them into being molecules. Though many times here, I have thought of having such a device would be more than pleasant.
If it does become a political issue....my ego is slightly to big to keep me from not coming back to tell all about it.
Joe Biden begins to cultivate the young Barak Obama for bigger and better things........a run for the White House. This to me is the biggest difference between the young Mr. Smith and the young Mr. Obama that there is. That young Mr. Smith went to Washington to do the right thing, to support the country, the constitution and represent the people that elected him.
The young Mr. Obama.....has political aspirations....hardly mentions the constitution, fails to support a war vote on Iraq, and take donations from the likes of Fannie and Freddie. Support the get out the vote programs of ACORN. Think that our young Mr. Smith would support those? Nah......the young Mr. Smith understood that standing for a noble purpose and cause was more important than standing for greed, political influencing, and higher office.
Consider Senator Joe Biden for a moment. If Joe Biden is this expert in Foreign Relations...ask yourself a few questions.....why did not the White House invite him to attend the Camp David Accord meetings? Never invited to any of them. Two of the three were held by DEMs. Surely you would think that the DEMs top man in the Senate would be invited to such a important meeting. Wish another.....:-)....President Clinton is going to China.....he is taking 2000 foreign affairs, trade specialist, Congressional types with him. Ever hear Joe Biden say he made the trip? I am not 100% sure. But I don't think so. Also this was about the time of his wife's death.
If Joe Biden was this expert in foreign affairs, as our Barak Obama thinks....or else he would not have gotten the offer of the VP.....he would have been included in these kinds of past foreign policy events. Kissinger was. He was even invited to them when the REP were not in the Presidency. Joe Biden is not the expert in foriegn policy that many think that he is. The young Barak Obama got handled by a Washington insider.
Anyways......the young Barak Obama....with the DEMs flips begins to get political power and a larger voice. He turns that voice.....to speaking of just and noble causes....like our young Mr. Smith goes to Washington does? Or speaking about the broken Washington, the errors of the GWB administration, his own struggle to achieve office. Ever hear Barak Obama speak on a Constitutional issue other than Roe v Wade, which is more a legal issue that Constitutional. He does not even address the ACORN issue as being a Constitutional issue....there is so much in the Constitution relevance to the ACORN scandle, it blows one over. But name one time, in the Senate our young Barak Obama has done a flibuster? Taken an all or nothing position? Stood for what is right and decent? Coming short of any examples? So am I.
Within two year of his first term in the Senate, our young Mr. Obama is mostly running for the Presidency, writing books and having vacations in the Virgin Islands and Hawii.
That is a very honest assessment of how Barak Obama...got to be making the run for the White House...without mentioning Ayers, Wright, Pfleger, Resko....as intermin associate parties along the path.
I hope this post gets a few :_)s. If there is a title it is
....A Young Mr. Obama Goes to Washington.
Barak Obama has been compared to Abe Lincoln. I would like to compare him for a moment to Mr. Smith of the movie.....Mr. Smith goes to Washington movie. If you know that famous black and white movie of a young man in 1950s that was elected to congress, played so well by Jim Stewart. You know he walked into a Washington that is very similar to the Washington the Barak Obama walked into a few years ago.
There was corruption, greed, back room deal making and key votes and issues that movie depicts. In the end, we have young Mr. Smith standing doing a solo flibuster fighting for a was a just and noble cause. Hour after hour he held the floor of the Senate. Refusing to stand down. Hoping that political pressure amoung the people would ignite and sway the Senate to this noble cause he defended and pleaded. In the end that did not come, but you knew what he stood for was his believe in the American system as much as it was for this cause.
So has Obama stood for a noble cause in the Senate? One come immediate to think of the Iraq war vote. Standing alone...nearly alone....there was another voted against it.....can anyone today mentioned the others name? I cannot. But here is how that vote of Obama came about, I think.
I think that by now in Senator, he had met the Joe Bidens, the John Kerrys, the Harry Reids, the John Murthas of the party. With the Iraq war vote coming, they caucus. To caucus.....meets simply 'to meet'. And they discuss the Iraq war issues.
They realize several things....that one the Iraq war could be a very divisive issue. Secondly it could go badly. Third with a recent 9/11 event, they need to show support of Administration in the GWOT. Lastly they to position the DEM party to take advantage of this no matter how it turns out. Being out of power means they need to position carefully. They need to have a voice that can stand against the war, while most of them support it. All eyes in the caucus turn to a young Barak Obama.
Oh he knows Sadam is doing worse things in Iraq, than Milosovic had done in the Balkans......the ethnic cleansing that Sadam was doing was with chemical weapons on women and children. But he could still be that one voice.
I think at this point the old Washington insider Joe Biden, began to see what the young Barak Obama could be in the future. Hence his inclusion on the Foreign Service committee that Biden heads. But also they realized with the vote done and the war engaged.....this committee needs to take a very low profile on its hearings. Hence almost no hearings on GWOT, Iraq and Afghanistan. Nothing that would bring clarity or compliment to the administration that was now fighting three wars for America.
The lack of clarity allows the DEM to micromanage the war...or attempted to when every anything bad happens.....and in war.....something bad is going to happen. They can cherry pick an issue or situation.....use it as how things should change and why it is wrong. 2003-4. Alot of things are going wrong.....abu grail, gitmo, under manpower in Iraq, vehicle bombs daily, mounting casualities, and influx of foreign fighters into Iraq.
DEM begin to flip to anti war positions, behind that one voice that said the war is immmoral, Barak Obama.
But does Barak ever realize what is also happening in Iraq? That democracy is being made. That a Iraqi government is being made? That the middle east is being literally reshaped? That evenutally it turns......Iraqi IDF begins to function, ANABAR Province is secured, the border turns from swiss cheese to having border control, vehicle bombs decrease, and yes on the battlefield of Iraq.....alQeada is being laid out and decimated. Hey I thought 9/11 was done by alQeada, Barak....is so wrong to get these guys? What in the world is immoral about that? What is so immoral of taking down Sadam?
Maybe Joe the plummer lost his portfolio when the financial crisis hit. Was a wall street type.....and settled to be a plummer.......just was a REP plant to embaress Obama. LOL
LOL....I guess the 1990 black and white pic I saw of him standing at a chalk board......titled "Barak Obama teaches a Class of ACORN Recruits" was just some REP disinformation made in the 1990....because they know one day he would be running for President.......it never fails to amaze me.
Sky do you want us to rally around the flag and sing hail to the chief after Obama wins? Have big happy faces on? He should have thought of that when he placed the no vote on the Iraq war.
A lot of people have been hurt by the DEM flip on Iraq. That is what showed our country to be weak, divided, and divisive. They did it in the eye of world...not in the privacy of the voting booth.
Now you want us to sing here comes the Chief to the leader of them? Sorry Sky, you don't print enough money in Washington for that with me.
A lot of REP are seeing it exactly the same way Indy. He did not support us in the hard years of 2002-4.....why should we support him when he is President.
After the 4th, Sky....what we are going to get is 90 days of unite behind me....from the winner.....then after the Jan 20th oath...... he will get about 100 days of little political opposition.....though this has changed in recent years.......after that we will be back to where we are today.....divisive.
Obama was a attroeny AND Trainer for ACORN. They had voter fruad cases back when he was directly connected to them. As a member of the court (attroney) if you know of a crime or a criminal activities...... you are suppose to declare it.
Aslo in the debate last nite, when he was talking about ACORN....he said in effect.....they have a few parties registering that are just signing up names....as President of the United State...his job is to enforce the laws of the country. He is chief law enforcement officer.
Yet here he has a clear case of laws being broken.....and he lets it pass.
As I was saying today at the coffee shop. It does not matter who wins. With the negative campaign ads running by both sides......the one that get elected will have 1/2 of the country against him AND they will be know his weaknesses and issues. Hard to get any national consesus from that, Sky.
sorry Hugs....the got out of state college students coming into OH and voting.....having it get processed as a vote. That is a process fraudulent vote........also places all the election staff and the student voted......up for felony charges for voter fraud charges.
That oath and signature the election staff make that says....we have conducted this election seeing that fraud did not occur. Places them on the hook when it happens.
You are going to see recount, after recount, after recount, after recount, after recount.....maybe till 2012 on this one. Each recount they will try make a paper trail from the cast vote to the registeration.....that are on the roles that are bad.....then to toss the vote. But is an impossibility to get them all at this point.
Going after a plummer, Sky? Ever hear of a plummer's assistant? Or a trademan in training? Means they are working in the field.....doing the work of the trade.....being PC on attacking the man choosen profession does not show very respect for the man or his industry.
Sounds pretty eliteist to me. Sky.
Not that Obama is a eliteist....he can get jokes today off of Joe, the 'near' plummer.....sound a lot like the comment on western PA voters being bible and gun toading. Yes?
At my coffee shop this morning......a bunch of people that were talking ACORN and Joe the Plummer.
Hugs how much confidence do you have in a state ability to catch 'all' fraudulent registration? In OH alone they found 200,000 of them. How many have they missed?
Just one bad registeration that get voted....and is counted......mean that every legal vote is less than 1.
You want to get it? State of Ohio. Minimum 200,000 bad ACORN Registeration. Is a subversion of the American democracy, Dude. A high precentage of voting bad registration means that DEM, REP, IND vote are are less than one.
I read the Constitution on it earlier today. Each election official (of a prencit, county, state) is to sign that the vote is 'certified'....certified has been intrepretted in court to mean.....1 person 1 vote. NO FRAUD in other words.
Reporter now can write in a article....I heard someone yell at a McCain Rally kill Obama. The accuracy of today's reporting when you are baised for Obama.
If you yelled something like that....100s if not a1000 would hear you. If secret service missed it.....and 100s have been interveiwed and did not hear it.....did not happen.
Obama a couple of days ago........was questioned by a man......Joe.....that is seeking to own his company......a plumbing firm. The firm makes about $250 a year. The break even point for Obama tax increases.....meaning that he make one dollar more....his small business tax rate goes to 39%.
Joe explained this Barak.....Barak says that he want to tax small business over this amount so he could give to indviduals making less. Joe....says.....that sounds like socialism to him.:-) Hey it is, Joe.
Last night at the debate, Joe the plummer was mentioned 15 times between the two. Today, both Barak and Biden mentioned Joe again. Barak got laughs at Joe expense....when he asked how many plummer do you know making $250K. Biden by saying he did not know any in his hometown that made $250K.
Here is a few stats for the Obama/Biden ticket.
If a small business employs only 7 people, it likely makes $250K Make that most of your gas stations, tire stores, family restraunts, florists, general contractors, electrical firms, farms, ranches, FBOs, cab companies, movie theatres, video stores, fast food restraunts, .....a very long list that goes on and on.
Small business employed an additional 1m in the country this last year. The only sector in the country to increase in employments.
It not hard or impossible for people that are indendant like Joe the plummer is....to want to improve...to own a business.....and as Joe has picked up on.....Barak wants to make it harder for them to make a profit by increasing their tax.
Barak says.....it is to end the failed the failed Bush economy policies....that included tax cuts. WOW Barak.....that makes sense.... cut tax cuts and dump some more tax on the only sector in the country that is increasing it employment of people. Give to the poor and become a modern day Robin Hood.
Barak ....Robin Hood could fly an arrow better than any man alive.....but he was alousey economist/bsuinessman.
Why should we believe him, when we get conflicting infomration..... some verifiable to the countary of his statements?
The day the Resko indictment was laid down....Obama was at a press conference in Texas....the reporters bombarded him with questions,Sky.He gave three answers.....all honest. But if saying..."I know Tony RESKO. "We have given his donation money to charity." and "We have a joining properties." All honest statements. But hardly the complete story of RESKO and Obama. If you believe Obama has been honest and complete with his associations.....then I got land east of KSC to sell you.
Sky I know he has made statement on RESKO, AYERS, ACORN.....OK. I also know that they (in Chicago) altered the FED RESKO indictment document after I visited there and read it. Sky, people are covering any tracks to Obama to these parties. With misinformation, dis information and fake information.
This is not first time in my vetting of Obama that I have run into it. The first one that I have proof of. Yes, something will hold up in a court. I have proof that the RESKO indictment was altered.
I don't buy that Obama was just the 'nomial head' of a organziation. I don't buy he only spent a few hours with ACORN. I don't buy that he only knew Ayers as nieghbor. How many neighbors do you have that invite you to sit on a board and will give you grant funding in the $1000s? I don't buy that his only relationship with RESKO was on buying some a joining proterties. When people are altering the RESKO indictment documents to take the connections to IL politicians out of them.
DEMs and left are spinning this out there. Why, I don't know. Like the ACORN scandle, it is a disrespect for the country and its people to do so. Every man and woman has a past of some kind. Why is Obama's being covered? Just maybe DEMs and the left cannot tell the truth anymore (they have been know consider the Daily Kos and Huffington post 'the turth'). Or fear the truth regarding Obama. Or knew that these associations of Obama were going to be the REP attack point. So they come with disinformation and misinformation to cover it.
What ever...it simply means that the country will never know the REAL Barak Obama.....whether he is good or bad. Like McCain....I think that he is a decent man.....but he is a decent man that is having his past covered and misinformed on.
Dude, the REP did not steal the elections of 2000 and 2004. If the DEMs leaders felt that they would have been stoen stolen, don't you think that they would have pressed court cases to Supreme Court?
Sure they would have. But did not even cases any higher the State level.
Where as what ACORN has done is subvert the election with fraudulent registeration since 1977. There is a big difference between the two.
ACORN has caused a lose of confidence in the election process. They deny it.......but that is what has occurred.
So from the DEM and far left side.......what ACORN has done.....it is fair and OK because of REP wins in 2000 and 2004. Those kinds of decision are made in the court, where rule of law gets applied. Not in the public forem where speculation seems to rule. What ACORN has done is to damage our voting registaries for maybe next 20 years with the large number of fraudulent voters that are in it. That is much bigger than anything that the REP did in 2000 and 2004.
ACORN representatives did it for money and they did it because of a lack of respect for the country, the Constitution, and for political gain. Each ACORN rep that get convicted of voter fraud registrations, should serve the maximim sentence with no parol and lose thier citzenship rights.jmo
Not according to Bret.....this was a 3 month falling of all the financial markets of the world.....not just the US market. That the other have fallen further in a the same time. They had bad banks in Europe as well.
Sure our is the largest market....and our bank failures were larger in comparison. But a couple of the other WSJ articles are saying that European banks have been living with near liquidity and solvency issues for a long time as well.
Note how fast the Iceland banks went bad. It was because also they had made some very risky loans in the middle east and elsewhere. So they also have some in the US banks. Our banks fail that they have loans with...and the line of domino falling might begins here...but it is also because they are overextended in middle east with bad paper as well.
Bad paper is not just a Fannie and Freddie issue, Fallingman. Bad paper is all over the world right now.
Fallingman, I have said many times in the past that EU devalaution of the dollar is one of biggest econmic hurts. Saying that the devaluation was done for greed in Europe by your finance minstries. In something that is called war time currency profittering.
That your banks are paying 4 time the actual prices of a dollar tells you what? That it is a currency that should be devalued? No that is not what it tells me. Says that the currency is just fine.
That your banks enjoy speculating and trading it. Else they would not buying at 4 time value. On the other side of the coin....they devalue it to gain benefit in contracts and currency trade.
Not sure you should get it both ways, Fallingman.
Not attacking anyone, though I have been known to. Stating an opinion of the financial situations. Trying to show you some of the unfairness in our doing business with Europe over the devauled Dollar.
Wall Street Journal Oct. 14, 2008 Title: FED opens cash spigot to Overseas Credit Markets.
Looks like that devalued American dollar is getting hard to find in Europe these days.
While in a recent auction for US Dollars 70 European Banks bid $88.6b for a $20b offering. Seems like the European banks like doing business in US Dollars just fine while their finance minsitries and EU devalue it.
But since there is this shortage of US dollars in Europe. Our Fed has agreed to lend till April of next year, dollars in unlimited quanities, to Bank of England, Swiss National Bank, and European Central Bank. Bank of Japan may soon be added to the list.
So what does it mean?
Means that the US Taxpayer is lending unlimited amounts of US Dollars to the commercial bank of Europe. If they fail or have a crisis, means big time problems with billions going into default.
According to one financial analysis:
This is big stuff, as bold a move as I could imagine." Ray Stone of Stone & McCarthy Research Associates.
It is a big move to secure European financial markets from further damage to the financial crisis here and elsewhere. Read the next post to understand that.
But it really bugs me....that the banks of Europe are paying 4 time the value of dollars, when the EU is devaluing them. Paying that shows a strong confidence in the currency. Not a unconfidence.
Source Wall Street Journal Opinion Section Oct.14,2008 Title Obama and ACORN
ACORN has been doing voter registerations in the country since 1977. Is spending $16m this year to register. Most of the $16m comes from in Federal grant funds.
Some of ACORN's registeration efforts this year:
Lake County, IN............2100 bogus registeration of 5000 turned on the last day
Bridgeport, CO..........estimates that 20% of the ACORN registeration were bad
Houston, TX.........40% of the 27,000 ACORN registeration were bad
Obama is now try to distance himself from ACORN. Yet While with the Wood Foundation gave ACORN $200K and more recently from his Presiential campaign chest $832K.
Bad registerations once in the system....accumulate. Meaning that a bad registeration done in 1977, could still be voted today. Assuming that the illegal voter used it frequently enough to not be placed on the inactive file.
We have had 31 year of ACORN placing bad registeration into our system. That is why as this Wall Street Journalist stated it....... "the question is whether ACRORN is systemicaily subverting US election law-on the tax payers dime"
ttom500 Forum Posts (10,523)
RE: John McCain's Sons
Dang Ship....you act like Farracon is modern day version of a choir boy.He leads a group that is the direct off shoot of the Black Panthers. He is about as divisive in our country as David Duke is and Henry Wallace were.
We fully realize that Obama did not request the endorsement. We also say....look where the endorsement is coming from. What is wrong with that?
Let me put into a different setting. You are making a resume' for a job that you want. You need three references to list on it. Ship.....are you saying that one of referrence, you list would be Louis Farracon? If you could? Or list David Duke as one?
I would not list either....if I had contact and the ability to do so which I don't...as references. Why? Because most people....most mid road people....would say.....he knows some pretty radical people....and my chances of getting the job just grew thinner.