God vs. Science (902)
crotalus_p: No they are not , there is no point in you pretending otherwise
actually they are and the people here are proof of that, perhaps what you want to say is that you think they shouldn't co-exist; but they obviously do, because even you have a small if not mini sense of conceptual brain activity struggling in that almost totally linear brain of yours
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Ambrose2007: Exactly, Falling - what self-respecting god would want a bunch of followers who turned off their reasoning powers and worshiped ignorance?
If god gave humans higher analytic powers, wouldn't it desire people to use them??
If god gave humans higher analytic powers, wouldn't it desire people to use them??
A totally right brained god would do exactly that. Of course I am surmissing that gods would be subject to left/right brain phenomina
Its not so odd that predominantly right brained (conceptual, imaginative) folk tend to be believers in faith and alledged beings, while left brain (linear, analytical) folks tend not to beleive in things that defy reason and proof.
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BnaturAl: A totally right brained god would do exactly that. Of course I am surmissing that gods would be subject to left/right brain phenomina
Its not so odd that predominantly right brained (conceptual, imaginative) folk tend to be believers in faith and alledged beings, while left brain (linear, analytical) folks tend not to beleive in things that defy reason and proof.
Its not so odd that predominantly right brained (conceptual, imaginative) folk tend to be believers in faith and alledged beings, while left brain (linear, analytical) folks tend not to beleive in things that defy reason and proof.
I'm probably more imaginative than analytical, but I learned long ago that one shouldn't confuse one's imaginary musings with reality. That can get real embarrassing.
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StressFree: Sorry Sir BNat..I missed those links, I never saw them. Actually, I've been away from these threads for a while and was just trying to innocently begin a new discussion....guess I'm late to the party.
buddy, friend, objectified mancrush yoda you... those links and documents were posted in response to you in other threads. Your reply to them and me was your standard " ok I'll have a look at them, but right now I'm busy doing yada yada, yada yada, yadayada."
In response to:
Anyways, I still love Carl Sagan's quote: "Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."
Anyways, I still love Carl Sagan's quote: "Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."
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Ambrose2007: I'm probably more imaginative than analytical, but I learned long ago that one shouldn't confuse one's imaginary musings with reality. That can get real embarrassing.
agreed ...
like dressing up as a woman 
or maybe that just confuses others Though some folks live and die with those fantastical musings. It's merely a predominance, some people have the where withall to realize the two natures of their brain and are able to sort them out when things get 'iffy' or wishy washy, while others tend to cling to one side or the other in the face of all that life throws at them.
We need both sides of our brain and their qualities; but, we also ought to use them appropriately, in situations that call for their dominant patterns. That may be too linear for imaginative folks though..
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BnaturAl: look up the word extrapolation and then add the disciplines of cosmology (all sciences, biology, archeology, astronomy, all of them) and you will have your answer.
I'm back to where I started from...Still nobody present at the time of the big bang...The data and reasoning that is being used in your school of thought is working from a fixed and flawed point of reference inside an entrapped and limited word of possibility and impossibility where the rules are being constantly constructed to prove a scientist's flawed argument...mostly being purely based on ego if we consider the culture of scientific competition and breakthroughs...
The big bang theory needs more support to clean up it's probability factor. "The theory of hyperspace (or higher dimensional space)--and its newest wrinkle, superstring theory--stand at the center of this revolution with adherents in every major research laboratory in the world, including several Nobel laureates. It's been pointed out that for over half a century, "scientists have puzzled over why the basic forces of the cosmos, gravity, electromagnetism, and the strong and weak nuclear forces require markedly different mathematical descriptions. But if we see these forces as vibrations in a higher dimensional space, their field equations suddenly fit together like pieces in a jigsaw puzzle, perfectly snug, in an elegant, astonishingly simple form. This may thus be our leading candidate for the Theory of Everything. Already, the theory has inspired several thousand research papers, and has been the focus of over 200 international conferences."
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BnaturAl: buddy, friend, objectified mancrush yoda you... those links and documents were posted in response to you in other threads. Your reply to them and me was your standard " ok I'll have a look at them, but right now I'm busy doing yada yada, yada yada, yadayada."
We never discussed the big bang theory before Bnat....You gave me some awesome links that did fascinate me and consider some things pertaining to God concept subjects....
I guess I shall use the search function here in this forum and get a better sense of this....
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BnaturAl: agreed ... like dressing up as a woman or maybe that just confuses others Though some folks live and die with those fantastical musings. It's merely a predominance, some people have the where withall to realize the two natures of their brain and are able to sort them out when things get 'iffy' or wishy washy, while others tend to cling to one side or the other in the face of all that life throws at them.
We need both sides of our brain and their qualities; but, we also ought to use them appropriately, in situations that call for their dominant patterns. That may be too linear for imaginative folks though..
We need both sides of our brain and their qualities; but, we also ought to use them appropriately, in situations that call for their dominant patterns. That may be too linear for imaginative folks though..
I agree, B, with what I think is the obvious truth that our brains were intended to work *as a whole*. Imagination/intuition/reasoning cannot function entirely independently of one another - at least not if sanity is desired...a necessity for grasping what is real.
The inescapable truth is - there are good and bad reasons for believing in something. A bad reason, for example, is that a given belief gives us comfort - that we want to believe in something because it feels good. A good reason ultimately has to be a reason which functions independently of our desires.
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The Holy Spirt offers creation. Cause
Science offers explanation. Attempt to explain effect.
Two distinct things.
I can look to science as long as it serves me.
It's fruitless to argue with belief.
Science offers explanation. Attempt to explain effect.
Two distinct things.
I can look to science as long as it serves me.
It's fruitless to argue with belief.
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Dusty45: Crotalus, You will oppose anything. What can I say.
No how ever i will appose anything that is blatantly wrong
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The conflict between religion and science is inherent and (very nearly) zero-sum. The success of science often comes at the expense of religious dogma; the maintenance of religious dogma always comes at the expense of science. It is time we conceded a basic fact of human discourse: either a person has good reasons for what he believes, or he does not. When a person has good reasons, his beliefs contribute to our growing understanding of the world. We need not distinguish between "hard" and "soft" science here, or between science and other evidence-based disciplines like history. There happen to be very good reasons to believe that the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor on December 7th, 1941. Consequently, the idea that the Egyptians actually did it lacks credibility. Every sane human being recognizes that to rely merely upon "faith" to decide specific questions of historical fact would be both idiotic and grotesque — that is, until the conversation turns to the origin of books like the bible and the Koran, to the resurrection of Jesus, to Muhammad's conversation with the angel Gabriel, or to any of the other hallowed travesties that still crowd the altar of human ignorance.
Sam Harris
Sam Harris
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StressFree: I'm back to where I started from...Still nobody present at the time of the big bang...
The data and reasoning that is being used in your school of thought is working from a fixed and flawed point of reference inside an entrapped and limited word of possibility and impossibility where the rules are being constantly constructed to prove a scientist's flawed argument...mostly being purely based on ego if we consider the culture of scientific competition and breakthroughs...
The big bang theory needs more support to clean up it's probability factor. "The theory of hyperspace (or higher dimensional space)--and its newest wrinkle, superstring theory--stand at the center of this revolution with adherents in every major research laboratory in the world, including several Nobel laureates. It's been pointed out that for over half a century, "scientists have puzzled over why the basic forces of the cosmos, gravity, electromagnetism, and the strong and weak nuclear forces require markedly different mathematical descriptions. But if we see these forces as vibrations in a higher dimensional space, their field equations suddenly fit together like pieces in a jigsaw puzzle, perfectly snug, in an elegant, astonishingly simple form. This may thus be our leading candidate for the Theory of Everything. Already, the theory has inspired several thousand research papers, and has been the focus of over 200 international conferences."
The data and reasoning that is being used in your school of thought is working from a fixed and flawed point of reference inside an entrapped and limited word of possibility and impossibility where the rules are being constantly constructed to prove a scientist's flawed argument...mostly being purely based on ego if we consider the culture of scientific competition and breakthroughs...
The big bang theory needs more support to clean up it's probability factor. "The theory of hyperspace (or higher dimensional space)--and its newest wrinkle, superstring theory--stand at the center of this revolution with adherents in every major research laboratory in the world, including several Nobel laureates. It's been pointed out that for over half a century, "scientists have puzzled over why the basic forces of the cosmos, gravity, electromagnetism, and the strong and weak nuclear forces require markedly different mathematical descriptions. But if we see these forces as vibrations in a higher dimensional space, their field equations suddenly fit together like pieces in a jigsaw puzzle, perfectly snug, in an elegant, astonishingly simple form. This may thus be our leading candidate for the Theory of Everything. Already, the theory has inspired several thousand research papers, and has been the focus of over 200 international conferences."
The quantity of morons singing the same tune does not equal proof. Witness the bible.. and now recent quantum theory
String theory is outdated in cosmolgy, read up.The theory of everything
that's a new one, enlightenment is only a few steps away ...errrm demensions ... errrmm dimensions 
Call me when you get back ok, I'm having probs with my 5 maids and 32 wives and for some reason they only respond to honey covered litany that goes nowhere. 
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crotalus_p: No how ever i will appose anything that is blatantly wrong
Sorry, I upset you and your tender feelings.
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Dusty45: The Holy Spirt offers creation. Cause
Science offers explanation. Attempt to explain effect.
Two distinct things.
I can look to science as long as it serves me.
It's fruitless to argue with belief.
Science offers explanation. Attempt to explain effect.
Two distinct things.
I can look to science as long as it serves me.
It's fruitless to argue with belief.
I'm guessing the highlighted sentence means: "I will believe in reality until it no longer feels good to do so." If not, would mind spelling out what it means?
Countless beliefs have in fact been changed by argumentation, so that statement is simply false.
However, it might be true if qualified as: "It is generally fruitless to argue with people about matters of faith" (since faith is by definition impervious to argument/reason).
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BnaturAl: The quantity of morons singing the same tune does not equal proof. Witness the bible.. and now recent quantum theory String theory is outdated in cosmolgy, read up.
The theory of everything that's a new one, enlightenment is only a few steps away ...errrm demensions ... errrmm dimensions Call me when you get back ok, I'm having probs with my 5 maids and 32 wives and for some reason they only respond to honey covered litany that goes nowhere.
The theory of everything that's a new one, enlightenment is only a few steps away ...errrm demensions ... errrmm dimensions Call me when you get back ok, I'm having probs with my 5 maids and 32 wives and for some reason they only respond to honey covered litany that goes nowhere.
That ego side is surely rearing its ugly head. lol
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Ambrose2007: I agree, B, with what I think is the obvious truth that our brains were intended to work *as a whole*. Imagination/intuition/reasoning cannot function entirely independently of one another - at least not if sanity is desired...a necessity for grasping what is real.
The inescapable truth is - there are good and bad reasons for believing in something. A bad reason, for example, is that a given belief gives us comfort - that we want to believe in something because it feels good. A good reason ultimately has to be a reason which functions independently of our desires.
The inescapable truth is - there are good and bad reasons for believing in something. A bad reason, for example, is that a given belief gives us comfort - that we want to believe in something because it feels good. A good reason ultimately has to be a reason which functions independently of our desires.
I couldn't agree more.In the words of one well known flighty if not alien individual "I am presently mancrushing on you"
(in a conceptual way of course, I have no linear dispostion to that end) 
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BnaturAl: I couldn't agree more.
In the words of one well known flighty if not alien individual "I am presently mancrushing on you" (in a conceptual way of course, I have no linear dispostion to that end)
In the words of one well known flighty if not alien individual "I am presently mancrushing on you" (in a conceptual way of course, I have no linear dispostion to that end)
Same here, B. (Good thing I have one of my macho pictures up!
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Dusty45: Sorry, I upset you and your tender feelings.
My dear you did not upset me , you think far too much of your self
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BnaturAl: The quantity of morons singing the same tune does not equal proof. Witness the bible.. and now recent quantum theory String theory is outdated in cosmolgy, read up.
Well, it's kinda evolving and the tune is changing. It's just so damn complicated....just like the big bang theory or any other sophisticated approach to the explanation of the true and ultimate nature of the universe and creation....
I personally still want a unifying theory that is interconnected in which all principles and concepts compliment each other.
We are all connected right? Tapestry?
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If god gave humans higher analytic powers, wouldn't it desire people to use them??