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RE: Dazed.....

Yep, its almost like the witch-hunts isnt it, 'defend the faith or die' - neo-fascist christianity sigh

RE: Dazed.....

You made me laugh there Gozo, its only been like this the last week or so, not for the entire time youve been away laugh


I agree with all you say thumbs up

When people ask why cant we just all live together I only have to think of people like the ones you mention and have my answer right in front of me sadly..... sigh

RE: for they who love more music

He was only 17/18 when he wrote this one and I think the final two lines are simply magnificent.........


THESE DAYS

Well I've been out walking
I don't do that much talking these days
These days--
These days I seem to think a lot
About the things that I forgot to do
For you
And all the times I had the chance to

And I had a lover
It's so hard to risk another these days
These days--
Now if I seem to be afraid
To live the life I have made in song
Well it's just that I've been losing so long

I'll keep on moving
Things are bound to be improving these days
These days--
These days I sit on corner stones
And count the time in quarter tones to ten, my friend
Don't confront me with my failures
I had not forgotten them

RE: for they who love more music

Ive been to see Jackson Browne a few times - hes one of my all time favourites...........

COLORS OF THE SUN

Colors of the sun
Flashing on the water top
Echo on the land

Picking for a coin
Many other tiny worlds
Singing past my hand

Awake to understand you are not dreaming
It is not seeming just to be this way
Dying men draw numbers in the air
Dream to conquer little bits of time
Scuffle with the crowd to get their share
And fall behind their little bits of time

Voices in the air
Sympathetic harmony
Coming from the trees

Hanging at my door
Many shiny surfaces
Clinging in the breeze

Oh, leave me where I am I am not losing
If I am choosing not to plan my life
Disillusioned saviors search the sky
Wanting to just to show someone the way
Asking all the people passing by
Doesn't anybody want the way

I say goodbye to Joseph and Maria
They think I see another sky
And from my fallen window I still see them
I'll never free them from the sky

RE: Hanta Yo

I read that years ago too and remember it as one of those very rare books that actually changed me - I got another copy about a year ago too - brilliant book thumbs up

RE: Lets all post 350 blogs in a row ! lol

I still hold by what I said - manners maketh the man - but whatever.................. dunno

RE: Lets all post 350 blogs in a row ! lol

Its about respect Swift - some folk put lots of work into doing their blogs - theres nothing to stop you doing 8 pages on one blog and showing a bit of concern for others dunno

As promised - The Best Insult Letter Ever

Thanks Dawn n Gordy - its some collection isnt it laugh wave

As promised - The Best Insult Letter Ever

I didnt write it Hun, its anonymous as far as I can find - shame cos whoever did write it could make a fortune - gives lots of ammo for doing your own version though - it was thinking of the guy you had probs with that made me remember it though laugh grin wave

As promised - The Best Insult Letter Ever

I cannot believe how incredibly stupid you are. I mean rock-hard stupid. Dehydrated-rock-hard stupid. Stupid so stupid that it goes way beyond the stupid we know into a whole different dimension of stupid. You are trans-stupid stupid. Meta-stupid. Stupid collapsed on itself so far that even the neutrons have collapsed. Stupid gotten so dense that no intellect can escape. Singularity stupid. Blazing hot mid-day sun on Mercury stupid.

You emit more stupid in one second than our entire galaxy emits in a year. Quasar stupid. Nothing in our universe can really be this stupid. Perhaps this is some primordial fragment from the original big bang of stupid. Some pure essence of a stupid so uncontaminated by anything else as to be beyond the laws of physics that we know. I'm sorry. I can't go on. This is an epiphany of stupid for me.

Maybe later in life, after you have learned to read, write, spell, and count, you will have more success at posting in our forum. True, these are rudimentary skills that many of us "normal" people take for granted that everyone has an easy time of mastering. But we sometimes forget that there are "challenged" persons in this world who find these things more difficult. If I had known, that this was your case then I would have never read any of your posts. It just wouldn't have been "right". Sort of like parking in a handicap space.......


This was a reply in a religious thread on another site so I guess the religious threads on CS arent really all that bad after all

grin laugh rolling on the floor laughing

RE: Bunny Boilers (and other freakshows)

Ive got a great insult letter somewhere on my comp - will find and post it as a seperate blog, you may be able to use it sometime laugh wave

RE: Bunny Boilers (and other freakshows)

rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing rolling on the floor laughing Funny and so true !!! rolling on the floor laughing

RE: when did it stop being fun?

and dont forget, not too much sugar OK thumbs up

I would love to be there to see you give that doctor the finger - when you do, give him the one from the other hand for me will you laugh

Great to hear from you Dorielle....... hug

RE: Beautiful ! Amazing ! Wonderful !

That was so beautiful it brought tears to my eyes - we can learn so much from nature - thanks for posting this thumbs up

RE: Update on Chloe #2 - Sad News

Ive had to do it a couple of times too and the only thing about it that can possibly lighten your feeling is that your much loved friend will be out of their pain............ hug

RE: forgetting how to multi task

I hope all the pain and discomfort subsides soon for you Dorielle........

What a great achievement for you to have got the show together with all this going on - and keeping a sense of humour too thumbs up

Im off to have a look at Firefox laugh

wave hug

RE: O'Bama.... The Presidency.... The World

Since the explosion of the civil rights movement in the 60's and the growth of increased availability of education throughout last century, there have been all round improvements in the lot of the 'common man', better diet and sanitation not least amongst these.

These things spell progress but meanwhile, in the distance, Sauron (elitism) stirs the rancid pot of greed and evil......... but the people now, rather than the controllers, are learning the strategies of the game and if we keep on electing the right people for the jobs then the moves we direct them to make in the collective name of US ALL will help to turn the bloodied battlefield into a thing of history.

Im more than incredibly heartened at the collective effort shown in America this week and sincerely hope that people all over the world, wherever possible, will follow your wonderful example. Whats more, in areas of the world where it isnt possible for the people to effectively speak out against the many forms of oppression, that we can put our thinking hats on and help them out too.

The wave of optimism which Americas achievement has made this week is rippling all round the world, young people everywhere are saying "hey, it 'is' possible!" and this is just the beginning. I anticipate demands for much greater accountability from politicians in the future along with a growing pride in community feeding through and from the younger people - with a bit of luck and fingers kept on the pulse Michael, I think America has this time proved itself a world leader without even dropping one bomb - progress indeed........

Yes, there may very well be a death knell being sounded but like the death card in the tarot, it is totally suggestive of new beginnings - not by random xenophobia but by building on the strengths and achievements of each other, by learning from mistakes, by intolerance of injustices, we have hopefully begun the building of a society where people are more important than profits and where every last one of us actually 'matters'.

Thanks Michael handshake

and THANK YOU AMERICA !!! kiss

RE: O'Bama.... The Presidency.... The World

Interesting points you make Michael! I think the initial reality of this situation at the moment is the elation of a tangible end to a prejudice which had terrible beginnings, this has been a battle of epic proportions which, in this era, manifested with the slave trade, continued with the efforts of many to end that situation and even involved people laying down their lives for the thruths which their hearts held.

The main of these truths is that we are all human beings and as such, no one person deserves greater privilidge than any other. This whole ethic of superiority goes back as far as we can know and is based on the abuse of power which, in a primitive sense, involes the exploitation of labour. This exploitation began, I think, as a means of community survival and cohesion but soon began to be utilised in an altogether more corrupt manner.

From its early beginnings in primitive societies this abuse rapidly spread and was increasingly justified by those who profited from these abuses of power, people were manipulated into the belief of accepting subservience and this situation continued for centuries before the issue of the colour of a persons skin was ever raised.

Feudalism in England being a case in point, where the lord was entitled to the labour of the serf and is indeed referred to as medieval slavery - this led to what we call 'cap doffing' whereby the social demand that a poor person show respect to their 'betters' (richer folk) demanded a raising of the hat to the 'gentry' if simply passing on the street and poor people found it impossible to rise above their station in life.

I find it more than curious that a lot of the people who escaped such inhuman conditions in Europe then turned to equally inhuman treatment of others, namely those with different coloured skin, in their new lives - I dont know if this was because they were so traumatised from their own histories or if lack of education (in many cases) or simply greed, example and ignorance or arrogance allowed these conditions of perceived superiority to proliferate - I will have to research this further but proliferate it did and I see a wonderful end to this inhumanity in the election of Obama to President of America.

contd;

RE: defining normal

I dont know for sure but it may just be 'normal' at this stage of what you have been through to be a little impatient for results - heck knows you have earned the right to them thumbs up

I wish I could magic up somebody to give you the physical comforts you mention.......... moping

Divine Blackmail - another quite long one......

Sorry but this 'is' a short one in comparison to the one which is now on page 2 laugh

Mind, Brain, Soul and Atheism.

Maybe you should follow thelink and read the entire essay - the point you raise is mentined there - thanks for your comment..............

RE: Hello!

Hello and Welcome wave

You would be much better putting this in the main forum as thats where Hello threads usually go thumbs up

RE: having some quiet time

She is probably tut tutting and thinking that you are both just being wilfull laugh wave

RE: having some quiet time

How did your Mum fare in the accident Dorielle? and how long is the cycle of chemo going to last?

Fingers crossed for Tuesday

thumbs up hug wave

Divine Blackmail - another quite long one......

Of course, atheism brings a ray of light and hope to this gloomy picture. If there is no god, a view fortunately well supported by both evidence and logic, then there is no Hell to fear, and the coercion comes not from some divine blackmailer, but from a very human and entirely earthly religious organization that wishes to increase its own secular power by attempting to coerce people into joining. We can and should say no to this; it is long past time that the proselytizers of this world stopped gaining wealth and influence through imaginary threats.

In closing, I note that the issue of "divine blackmail" is yet another example of religious compartmentalization at work. If a parent demanded that their child love them or be savagely beaten, he or she would be hauled before a court on charges of child abuse. The mugger and the Mafia members would be jailed for extortion. Stalin would (at least in an ideal world) have been put on trial for war crimes and genocide. Yet when God does the exact same thing, only on a much greater scale, why is there no outrage? Why does no one seem to have a problem with this? The answer, of course, is that too many people have been indoctrinated since birth into believing that when it comes to God, all bets are off and an entirely new set of standards applies. "After all," they reason, "God moves in mysterious ways, and we have no right to judge him" - which is, of course, a fallback position in a vain attempt to defend the truly indefensible.


copied from Ebon Musings.

Divine Blackmail - another quite long one......

Or 2 Thessalonians 1:7-8:


"...the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ...." (KJV)
Neither of these descriptions sound much like conscious acts of choice on the part of the people being damned. The angels will "weed out" people that offend and "throw them into" a fiery furnace. Jesus will "in flaming fire vengeance...." Both of these sound very much like it is a conscious, deliberate choice on God's part to send people to eternal torment in Hell, which ties back to the original point: by mandating laws and threatening those who stray with torture, God has shown he does not value our free will, only our coerced obedience. Our decisions cannot be said to be free in any meaningful sense if an eternity of grief and agony awaits for making any choice but the "correct" one.

Similarly, the argument that God wants to "rescue" us from Hell, that his laws were enacted not to satisfy his arbitrary demands but for our own protection, is untenable. The first and most obvious point against this is that God himself created Hell. It is not a danger beyond his control nor one he was unable to keep us from, but a hazard he deliberately created and set in our way. Furthermore, since God is all-powerful, there can be no doubt that he can prevent anyone from going there if he wishes to. No one can go to Hell if it is not God's will that they do so. Finally, it is God himself who decrees exactly what actions will result in condemnation to Hell, and he is capable of changing his mind on the matter, as anecdotes from all three Western traditions show. In Judaism, God initially commanded the Israelites to perform animal sacrifices in his honor, but later revoked this law and stated that faith and obedience were all he truly required (Jeremiah 7:22). According to Christianity, God enacted the entire Mosaic law code only to later sweep it aside and institute faith in Jesus as the sole requirement for salvation. And in Islam, Muhammad bargained God down from fifty mandatory prayers daily to five, according to the collected sayings called the hadith. Therefore, we see that it is God's decision, and more so God's arbitrary decision, that determines what acts will earn a soul entry into the afterlife of torment and despair that he created for that specific purpose. We are not faced with a free choice, but with coercion - a demand that we do what pleases God, or else we will be infinitely punished.

What would be a genuinely free choice, and much fairer as well, would be if there were two afterlives, both equally pleasant, but one with God's presence and one without. If this was the case, people could freely choose to follow God or not without fear of retribution. Why is it not otherwise? Why is Hell a place of suffering and torment? Why does God need to torture the people who'd rather not worship him - why not just let them go their own way? No truly loving person compels others to return his love. By mandating the "right" option, God has shown that he really doesn't value our free choice at all. We are like the angels - mindless creatures created only to worship God, unable to turn away from him - but we have it even worse. We are every bit as enslaved, but we labor under a misleading pretense of freedom while they get no such deceptive illusions.

contd;

Divine Blackmail - another quite long one......

An even more apt analogy might be a Mafia protection racket. Humanity is the shopkeeper, the helpless elderly man cowering behind the cash register, while God is the trench-coated mob enforcer making the proverbial offer we can't refuse. "This sure is a nice soul you've got here," the mobster sneers. "It would be a terrible shame if it were to meet with some unfortunate accident."

Exactly like the gangster demanding protection money, the God of these religions offers us a forced option which his proselytizing followers deceptively present as a free choice. This isn't love - this is extortion. If God cares so much about us, then why does he need to coerce our devotion with the threat of torture?

Some Christians argue that this is not coercion; that God does not send anyone to Hell, but actually wants to save us from that fate, and that people who live their lives in defiance of him and his laws are in effect choosing to send themselves there.

But such an argument contradicts everything Christianity has ever taught about the process of judgment. When you die and stand at the judgment seat, are you confronted with one door filled with glorious white and golden light, clouds floating serenely by in the background, the harmonious sounds of an angelic chorus drifting out, and with a sign reading "HEAVEN" over it in pure white light, and another door filled with flames and the screams of the damned and a sign reading "HELL" over it in flickering red neon, and God invites you to pick one? If this is not the case, then the situation is no different than the Mafia enforcer claiming that, by not paying protection, the old man is "choosing" to have his shop burned down. Or, as one wag put it on Usenet:


The doubter says:
"I could never follow Stalin. He puts people in the Gulag."

That is what doubters tell themselves to rationalize their rejection of Stalin. But the truth is that Stalin does not send anyone to the Gulag. It is those who have hardened their hearts against him who send themselves to the Gulag through their bourgoise attitudes and counterrevolutionary actions. This was not Stalin's plan at all. He truly wants everyone to go to the Worker's Paradise. And it grieves him that so many harden their hearts against him. But he will not force anyone into the Worker's Paradise against their wishes, he respects their free will.

So if you don't want to go to the Gulag, just open your heart to the love of Stalin. And stop resisting him.

The situation with Christianity is exactly analogous. If God creates a hellish realm of torment, decrees a set of arbitrary laws, and ordains that those who violate those laws will be sent to that realm, then he is coercing behavior. Tortured rationalizations such as "Well, they did it to themselves" do not change this plain fact.

In addition, the Bible itself states that people do not "choose" to go to Hell - they are sent there by God. For example, Matthew 13:41-42, spoken by Jesus:


"The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (NIV)


contd;

Mind, Brain, Soul and Atheism.

"Will be honest! haven't read the whole essay, just the intro. But it reminds me of the enlightened period essays where they discussed the existance of a soul, which is pretty cool. It is more understandable as well considering you're not using a ton of large words that really mean nothing or just cancel one another out. Any who, interesting thoughts - will make a point to read the rest, promise.

Tip "

Hi Tip,

it really is an excellent essay but the post here was quite long enough and I just couldnt post the whole lot - it covers much more of the mind/brain process so yes, if you do get time give it a read - it would be food for thought if nothing else.......... it also gives some examples of behaviour in people who have had brain damage in various areas and the relative loss of function - I found it a brill read........

wave

Mind, Brain, Soul and Atheism.

The highest in the pyramid in the questions of man (imo) is self actualisation (Abraham Maslows Heirarchy of Need).

The sciences involving 'mind' are relatively recent to those involving religion. One of the major achievements of the various scientists is the lengths they go to to substantiate their theories and also to ensure replicability, an achievement which is singularly lacking in religious claims.

We can see advancements all the time in brain physiology research, we now know which events trigger which synaptic responses and much more of the 'science' of matters which confounded primitive people and for which, a primitive church gave its own answers (and doggedly sticks to them too).

The churches have had to apologise for their involvement in slavery (which they justified for many years with biblical quotes) they have had to apologise posthumously to Galileo and Darwin - and I suspect they will have to eat quite a lot more humble pie before the free thinkers of the world rid their fellow man of the shackles of hocus pokus trickery which did work on a more primitive people but which is wearing thin in the light of the masses winning the rights to education for all instead of just the clerics which was the case during the biggest part of the spread of this mass brainwash exercise.

Mind, Brain, Soul and Atheism.

If anybody actually reads this far then thank you very much and I hope you enjoyed it handshake wave wine

This is a list of blog comments created by trish123.

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