A sincere question to those who don't believe the Bible is God's Word (303)
Where can I find these? Any examples of titles of such works?
I see that you chose atheism after your study. Interesting.
I see that you chose atheism after your study. Interesting.
Ambrose2007: You might feel differently about those "prophecies" if you read scholarly treatments of that claim as opposed to the self-fulfilling analysis offered by religionists.
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All I know is Scripture states that Sarah and Abraham could not conceive a child and they were in their 70s. Something changed the status quo.
It was a prophecy in that it foretold a future event. I am pretty sure Isaac was a real child born to Sarah and Abraham in their golden years.
As for the six additional children, God did say Abraham would be a Father of a great nation, so I guess that got the ball rolling, lol.
It was a prophecy in that it foretold a future event. I am pretty sure Isaac was a real child born to Sarah and Abraham in their golden years.
As for the six additional children, God did say Abraham would be a Father of a great nation, so I guess that got the ball rolling, lol.
krimsa:
Was that even a prophecy per se? It is strange that the 100 year old Abraham required God's help in fathering Isaac, yet later he marries again and has six more children without any help from God.
Was that even a prophecy per se? It is strange that the 100 year old Abraham required God's help in fathering Isaac, yet later he marries again and has six more children without any help from God.
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Thanks. What a lovely greeting. I enjoy reading your posts because you share so much of yourself. 
Be careful about brain strain. Brain pain is not mentioned much but can be a real *******************.
Can you imagine going to the doctor for this? Doctor, my brain is strained and it is pained. All my life the weather rained. I am broken, limp, and mained. Yet no one believes that it's not feigned.
Tell me doctor, what's the cure? How much more can I endure?
Give me something that brings peace. Before I see my tax increase.
Be careful about brain strain. Brain pain is not mentioned much but can be a real *******************.
Can you imagine going to the doctor for this? Doctor, my brain is strained and it is pained. All my life the weather rained. I am broken, limp, and mained. Yet no one believes that it's not feigned.Tell me doctor, what's the cure? How much more can I endure?
Give me something that brings peace. Before I see my tax increase.
HealthyLiving: This is my first encounter with you in the forums and I wanted to extend my hand in fellowship with you. It is a blessing to meet you Donna!
Good Morning Dru, krimsa and Dusty!!!
Such brain strain so early on a Saturday morning to go along with a hot cup of java!
Hi Tony!
Carry on...
This is a good thread!
Oops, I almost forgot one...
Hello crot!
Good Morning Dru, krimsa and Dusty!!!
Such brain strain so early on a Saturday morning to go along with a hot cup of java!
Hi Tony!
Carry on...
This is a good thread!
Oops, I almost forgot one...
Hello crot!
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This forum debate will be spoken of thousands of years in the future. People will speak from the top of the highest mountain saying: All ye be warned! For god hath provided me with this hard drive with his wisdom! Let anyone who hath doubt hide in the deepest cave in the tallest mountain. And let that man cry to the mountain and say, "Crush me oh mighty mountain! For I hath doubted the wisdom on the Holy Harddrive!" 
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calmheartseeks: All I know is Scripture states that Sarah and Abraham could not conceive a child and they were in their 70s. Something changed the status quo.
It was a prophecy in that it foretold a future event. I am pretty sure Isaac was a real child born to Sarah and Abraham in their golden years.
As for the six additional children, God did say Abraham would be a Father of a great nation, so I guess that got the ball rolling, lol.
It was a prophecy in that it foretold a future event. I am pretty sure Isaac was a real child born to Sarah and Abraham in their golden years.
As for the six additional children, God did say Abraham would be a Father of a great nation, so I guess that got the ball rolling, lol.
I think people used to have LONG life spans (in the bible anyway) not in reality. In biblical times, probably you were lucky to see the ripe old age of 30. Allegedly, god reduced our life span (well that’s another contradiction) to 120 years because "he was tired of arguing with us" This happened in Genesis.
“The scripture states” being key here. We don’t even know if Sarah and Abraham ever existed so it’s hardly conclusive proof of a "fulfilled prophecy." You are using the bible in order to substantiate a story in the bible. In truth their first born was Ishmael.
Remember that the Arabs (Palestinian people) are thought to be direct descendants of Ishmael and the Jews are the offspring of Isaac. This has led to quite a heated animosity in that region of the world. More than likely, a Jewish scribe essentially placed the character of Isaac in the forefront of the story to make it appear as though all the blessings fell on him (even though Ishmael was the elder son). You can bet the Quaran has an entirely different understanding of events.
One would have to wonder why Abraham needed god's help with Isaac but none other when he was already 100? The story is not very convincing on several counts. I guess that’s why the bible is refereed to as the "great book of loopholes."
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In response to: What "fulfilled prophecies"? Name one.
Well it was stated that Sarah having a child in her advanced age was in some respect a "fulfilled prophecy." I would disagree with that. Perhaps another could be listed unless you want to pursue Sarah and Abraham for some reason.
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HealthyLiving: Crot... I will remember this statement you have made here!
Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!
This is your favorite tactic! You WILL eat your own words
Please do back up your statments with quotes Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!
This is your favorite tactic! You WILL eat your own words
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The short answer is publishing.
It's now an industry, but that in now way proves anything.
Hell i should know i worked in the industry.
It's now an industry, but that in now way proves anything.
Hell i should know i worked in the industry.
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Yes, she did. :)
Conrad73: Actually Sarah sent him to the Maid-Servant if memory serves me right.
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So was someone going to list a "fulfilled prophecy?" 
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From what source or type, if you don't want to use Biblical prophecies? I understand you don't trust the Bible, but I am not sure what prophecies you are referring to then.
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You know how it works, generalise enough and use prosaic language and dont be specific and yo can make almost anything fit.
After all look at Edgar Cayce and Nostrodamus......if you post the goaposts wide enough you can prove anything.
To prove my point look at this link, 100 prophecies fulfilled!!!
The main thing to remember of course just because it's on the internet doesnt make it true........obviously.
After all look at Edgar Cayce and Nostrodamus......if you post the goaposts wide enough you can prove anything.
To prove my point look at this link, 100 prophecies fulfilled!!!
The main thing to remember of course just because it's on the internet doesnt make it true........obviously.
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calmheartseeks: From what source or type, if you don't want to use Biblical prophecies? I understand you don't trust the Bible, but I am not sure what prophecies you are referring to then.
Are you talking to me? I would be referring to a prophecy alleged to have taken place in the bible that was actually fulfilled. I gave an example of one that was in the bible that was NOT fulfilled. I figured it would be easier for you to give us one that has been fulfilled and then we can debate it legitimacy.
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calmheartseeks: How do you account for all the fulfilled prophecies regarding Jesus in Scripture? That is one of the strongest evidences of it being divinely inspired, and I am curious as to those who are sure Scripture is not inspired think of these prophecies and how they came to that conclusion.
I have been spending many hours trying to find information on questions that I have, so this is a sincere post.
Happy connecting!
Donna
The God's books are enough evidence of the prophetsI have been spending many hours trying to find information on questions that I have, so this is a sincere post.
Happy connecting!
Donna
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To me a prophecy is something foretold that then was fulfilled. To me Sarah and Abraham would fit this. You did not agree, that is your right. If you are issuing a challenge to me to prove that the Bible is true or God exists, I won't be able to change your mind and I'm not going to try. I believe each one decides for himself what they want to believe and shouldn't be harassed for such belief or nonbelief.
krimsa: Are you talking to me? I would be referring to a prophecy alleged to have taken place in the bible that was actually fulfilled. I gave an example of one that was in the bible that was NOT fulfilled. I figured it would be easier for you to give us one that has been fulfilled and then we can debate it legitimacy.
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calmheartseeks: To me a prophecy is something foretold that then was fulfilled. To me Sarah and Abraham would fit this. You did not agree, that is your right. If you are issuing a challenge to me to prove that the Bible is true or God exists, I won't be able to change your mind and I'm not going to try. I believe each one decides for himself what they want to believe and shouldn't be harassed for such belief or nonbelief.
I never harassed you. I asked you to list a prophecy that had actually been fulfilled. I think about 4 people also asked? Why are you so angry and resentful of this request? Didnt you begin this thread on that very premise? I dont understand. I explained why I did not consider Abraham and Sarah to be any sort of "fulfilled prophecy." I gave supportive evidence for my reasoning.
If you wish to counter those you may. Or you can move onto another which you feel is a fulfilled prophecy. For one thing, there is no reason to believe that Abraham and Sarah was anything more than a story in the bible and not based on actual humans that lived. I also asked why at age 100 did Abraham have no more need of "god's intervention" in order to have children and he went on to produce 6 more. Obviously he had no physical issues that would limit his reproductive capacity.
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mrali: The God's books are enough evidence of the prophets
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Please show me how my post to you was angry and resentful. I don't think there's any doubt many posts here were harrassing, and I was not referring to you - I should have explained I was referring to the whole thread.
I haven't gone through all your past posts, but if you are "the chrstian slayer" :) I am pretty confident that if I went through prophecy by prophecy we would be here a long time and no that wasn't the point of my post. I did get an answer to my question: nonbelievers don't think the prophecies were fulfilled. It's their right and I respect it, just as whatever answers I find in my own journey should be respected. I don't expect anyone to join my club, (although I have none), if they like another. :)
Honestly, I just don't have time for a long long debate and I really doubt anyone is going to change their mind. I think whatever I present to you that I find acceptable you won't believe, and that is okay.
I haven't gone through all your past posts, but if you are "the chrstian slayer" :) I am pretty confident that if I went through prophecy by prophecy we would be here a long time and no that wasn't the point of my post. I did get an answer to my question: nonbelievers don't think the prophecies were fulfilled. It's their right and I respect it, just as whatever answers I find in my own journey should be respected. I don't expect anyone to join my club, (although I have none), if they like another. :)
Honestly, I just don't have time for a long long debate and I really doubt anyone is going to change their mind. I think whatever I present to you that I find acceptable you won't believe, and that is okay.
krimsa: I never harassed you. I asked you to list a prophecy that had actually been fulfilled. I think about 4 people also asked? Why are you so angry and resentful of this request? Didnt you begin this thread on that very premise? I dont understand. I explained why I did not consider Abraham and Sarah to be any sort of "fulfilled prophecy." I gave supportive evidence for my reasoning.
If you wish to counter those you may. Or you can move onto another which you feel is a fulfilled prophecy. For one thing, there is no reason to believe that Abraham and Sarah was anything more than a story in the bible and not based on actual humans that lived. I also asked why at age 100 did Abraham have no more need of "god's intervention" in order to have children and he went on to produce 6 more. Obviously he had no physical issues that would limit his reproductive capacity.
If you wish to counter those you may. Or you can move onto another which you feel is a fulfilled prophecy. For one thing, there is no reason to believe that Abraham and Sarah was anything more than a story in the bible and not based on actual humans that lived. I also asked why at age 100 did Abraham have no more need of "god's intervention" in order to have children and he went on to produce 6 more. Obviously he had no physical issues that would limit his reproductive capacity.
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In response to: Please show me how my post to you was angry and resentful.
Your last sentence. You stated that people should not be harassed. The implication was that I had harassed you in some respect.
In response to: I don't think there's any doubt many posts here were harrassing, and I was not referring to you - I should have explained I was referring to the whole thread.
Yes you should have because you quoted me and then made that remark. What am I supposed to think? I have attempted to be respectful in every thread I have ever posted on in fact.
In response to: I haven't gone through all your past posts, but if you are "the chrstian slayer"
I think that was only a joke because I was dressed like a cat in that photo and it was in reference to lions eating Christians alive. Dont take any of that seriously.
In response to: I am pretty confident that if I went through prophecy by prophecy we would be here a long time and no that wasn't the point of my post.
Well so far the only one that has been dismissed is Sarah and Abraham with good reason. You are welcome to list another if you like.
In response to: I did get an answer to my question: nonbelievers don't think the prophecies were fulfilled.
I listed one that has not been. You never addressed it.
In response to: It's their right and I respect it, just as whatever answers I find in my own journey should be respected. I don't expect anyone to join my club, (although I have none), if they like another.
Im sure many other Christians will agree with you that prophecies from the bible have been fulfilled but they are basing that acceptance on faith.
In response to: Honestly, I just don't have time for a long long debate and I really doubt anyone is going to change their mind. I think whatever I present to you that I find acceptable you won't believe, and that is okay.
Well simply listing something from the bible that was fulfilled and we can agree on the legitimacy of the claim i.e. it occurred or actually took place in a historical context. Is that out of line? Otherwise I could tell you that my parakeet is god and you just dont have enough faith to believe it.
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Prophecies must be stated clear before they're happening, so they aren't just interpreted to be prophecies afterwards.
Self-fulfilling prophecies aren't good either.
Lucky guesses have to be ruled out as well.
All bases covered then!?