Welfare baby solution: Family Cap. (411)
lilmamma71: No you don't pay taxes on the food purchased on food stamps, it's tax exempt.
No you don't pay for medications and doctors visits or hospital stays on the Medical card.
No you don't pay for medications and doctors visits or hospital stays on the Medical card.
We dont have food stamps
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kissmedeeply: Exactly much different everywhere..
And its not free here...they hardly have anything to live on once everything is payed for
And its not free here...they hardly have anything to live on once everything is payed for
Here it's very different than in Canada, but you all have a nationalized health care system am I not correct? so I'm not sure how your system works, but when you get housing, medical care and food on welfare, it's not taxed, not subjected to co-pays and it increases as there are more people added to the household.
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Birth rate falls in England for first time in almost a decade
The number of babies born in England and Wales has fallen for the first time in almost a decade.
Following several years of strong growth in the number of births, driven mainly by immigrant mothers, it fell in 2009.
Experts believe the drop could be a result of foreign-born families returning to their home countries during the recession, or of professional couples deciding not to have children at a time when money is tight.
At the same time, women are continuing to delay motherhood with the number of over-40s giving birth continuing to rise as teenage pregnancies fall. The proportion of babies born out of wedlock has also continued to rise.
Anastasia de Waal, head of family and education at the leading think-tank Civitas, said: “We know that the big rises that we’ve seen in the last few years in births have been immigrant births, so with a decline in people staying that’s obviously going to have an impact.
“I would say it’s likely that the recession has had some impact on people’s fertility choices. There is so much out there about how expensive it is to have a child – a lot of that is commodities but there’s also the fact that you have to step out of work. When there is job insecurity, people are much less likely to think that now is a good time to take maternity leave.”
Perhaps unemployment benefit is a far bigger drain on the economy.
The number of babies born in England and Wales has fallen for the first time in almost a decade.
Following several years of strong growth in the number of births, driven mainly by immigrant mothers, it fell in 2009.
Experts believe the drop could be a result of foreign-born families returning to their home countries during the recession, or of professional couples deciding not to have children at a time when money is tight.
At the same time, women are continuing to delay motherhood with the number of over-40s giving birth continuing to rise as teenage pregnancies fall. The proportion of babies born out of wedlock has also continued to rise.
Anastasia de Waal, head of family and education at the leading think-tank Civitas, said: “We know that the big rises that we’ve seen in the last few years in births have been immigrant births, so with a decline in people staying that’s obviously going to have an impact.
“I would say it’s likely that the recession has had some impact on people’s fertility choices. There is so much out there about how expensive it is to have a child – a lot of that is commodities but there’s also the fact that you have to step out of work. When there is job insecurity, people are much less likely to think that now is a good time to take maternity leave.”
Perhaps unemployment benefit is a far bigger drain on the economy.
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No, I was not trying to be snide...but I will if you want me to....
Where do you think I learnt my snidery from?
Where do you think I learnt my snidery from?
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Conorco: Or maybe americans should do something to ensure that so many of their people aren't forced to exist in squalor and poverty because the policy of successive government who do the bidding of the well off and wealthy who have hijacked democracy for their own benefit, huh?
Ah but don't you know that they're all "lazy goofoffs", and that it's "fair" to shift more wealth to the top through government policies?
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lilmamma71: Here it's very different than in Canada, but you all have a nationalized health care system am I not correct? so I'm not sure how your system works, but when you get housing, medical care and food on welfare, it's not taxed, not subjected to co-pays and it increases as there are more people added to the household.
Nope far as know you get what you get..no increases
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Dadude62: Ah but don't you know that they're all "lazy goofoffs", and that it's "fair" to shift more wealth to the top through government policies?
True, the more you have the more you deserve
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lilmamma71: Yes, it's there and I don't care about paying taxes for those that use it as a temporary means, but for those using and abusing it in the name of laziness, yeah I got a real problem with that..BIG time.
Well no matter if you have a problem big time or not..
Really it wont make a difference..maybe in having a headache..
I dont like the gas prices..but i cant make a difference..it will go up or down..whether i like it or not..
People get a bad wrap no matter what being on welfare..
Thats is bad enough dont u think...
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I am lucky enough to be working in home care..and have a job..but who is to say one day things could change big time..
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Good job I don't plan on having any kids. Its ok, I will just pine away in my welfare bubble and when the bubble pops, no more burden to society
:)
:)
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StillOfTheNight: Good job I don't plan on having any kids. Its ok, I will just pine away in my welfare bubble and when the bubble pops, no more burden to society
:)
:)
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lilmamma71: Yes, it's there and I don't care about paying taxes for those that use it as a temporary means, but for those using and abusing it in the name of laziness, yeah I got a real problem with that..BIG time.
Did you ever think maybe that these "lazy" people might be depressed, demoralised, demotivated or any number of other de's?
You and most people in the western world are some of the luckiest humans to have ever been born, we're here at a time of plenty (for us) and in the right place and no matter how bad the recession is i'll take it any day over being born to a poor family in Africa or Asia, where the vast majority of people alive today live from hand to mouth.
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Dadude62: Ah but don't you know that they're all "lazy goofoffs", and that it's "fair" to shift more wealth to the top through government policies?
Whatever you believe about government "shifting more wealth to the top", it has nothing whatsoever to do with this topic. It's worth a thread on it's own because I'd just love to understand what evidence you have that the government is trying to "shift wealth to the top". Meanwhile, back to the fact that the government takes money from working people in order to give it to people who don't work. And what to do about it.
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kissmedeeply: Nope far as know you get what you get..no increases
You're right.There are no increases.You get what you get and that's it.
I know some people personally that are on welfare because their children have medical conditions that require very expensive drugs that you would never be able to afford on a minimum wage job.Some of these people had it all at one point and for one reason or another lost it all.
If you figure how much you make minimum wage is about 950 and rent is 650,utilities are around 200 then there is food which you would have to spend around 125 a week,then if your children are small you have day care fees which are around,if your lucky,500 a month.Then you have little things like the phone which is not cheap but necessary,and that's about 85 a month.Well as you can see you ran out of money long ago so for things like clothes,boots and shoes sure you may be able to get clothes at the volunteer center for free,but kids shoes and boots in particular are in shabby unwearable shape once they outgrow them.
Unless you have lived the situation or know people who do then basing your views on the horror stories you hear of is pretty narrow minded.
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Conorco: No, I was not trying to be snide...but I will if you want me to....
Where do you think I learnt my snidery from?
Where do you think I learnt my snidery from?
I think you came by it naturally...an immaculate conception??
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gardenhackle: The problem of babies being tied to welfare money has been large enough that a number of different attempts to break that connection have been made in hopes of reducing the size of the problem.
One legal reform that has been implemented has been "family cap" which makes children conceived while the mother was on welfare ineligible for additional welfare funds. This removes the responsibility from society for any additional children and places the burden squarely on the mother. The caveat is that the other children could and probably will suffer as mother has less income per child and one more child to look after.
Is it fair? That's a tough call because it's not society's responsibility to pay for additional children, but neither is it the other children in the family or even that child's fault. It's a negative financial incentive to the mother that the children will likely bear the brunt of, but that said.... does it work and is it wrong that the mother of this family bears the responsibility when the state cuts off additional financial aid for additional children conceived while financial aid is being drawn?
I hate to see the children do without because of a parent who has made an inconsiderate decision. I think there should be some way to make the parents responsiable for their decisions. I think there should be a contract signed that addresses becoming pregnant while on benefits. Either by jail time or community service. So before you start the "it will cost more in tax payers money" theme. It might at first. But after the law is proved to be enforced then it will pay for its self. Example in my state the death penealty is still alive and doing well. So if I had to take someone to higher ground I would cart their butt over the state line and do it in state more forgiving. One legal reform that has been implemented has been "family cap" which makes children conceived while the mother was on welfare ineligible for additional welfare funds. This removes the responsibility from society for any additional children and places the burden squarely on the mother. The caveat is that the other children could and probably will suffer as mother has less income per child and one more child to look after.
Is it fair? That's a tough call because it's not society's responsibility to pay for additional children, but neither is it the other children in the family or even that child's fault. It's a negative financial incentive to the mother that the children will likely bear the brunt of, but that said.... does it work and is it wrong that the mother of this family bears the responsibility when the state cuts off additional financial aid for additional children conceived while financial aid is being drawn?
I do not mind giving someone a hand up. I even do not mind giving some a hand out. But someone who flaunts their life style of living off the system and does not try to better their situation
But in reality I have never seen these laws change anything. The offenders can find a way to get around it faster than the laws can be made. And sadly those who really need it get less because of the abusers. 
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maryrachelle: You're right.There are no increases.You get what you get and that's it. I know some people personally that are on welfare because their children have medical conditions that require very expensive drugs that you would never be able to afford on a minimum wage job.Some of these people had it all at one point and for one reason or another lost it all. If you figure how much you make minimum wage is about 950 and rent is 650,utilities are around 200 then there is food which you would have to spend around 125 a week,then if your children are small you have day care fees which are around,if your lucky,500 a month.Then you have little things like the phone which is not cheap but necessary,and that's about 85 a month.Well as you can see you ran out of money long ago so for things like clothes,boots and shoes sure you may be able to get clothes at the volunteer center for free,but kids shoes and boots in particular are in shabby unwearable shape once they outgrow them. Unless you have lived the situation or know people who do then basing your views on the horror stories you hear of is pretty narrow minded.
yup i think the ones that are complaining here take a step back and go on welfare and just see really what its like..you dont even get enough to pay for everything..and usually they do without food..i know some that are on it..and cant scrape by..and people look down on them..they are only human like the rest of us and we are fortunate to have work..but dont give us right to demean them in anyway..when i see those people i smile like i smile to the rest of the world..------ This thread is Archived ------
Conorco: Did you ever think maybe that these "lazy" people might be depressed, demoralised, demotivated or any number of other de's?
You and most people in the western world are some of the luckiest humans to have ever been born, we're here at a time of plenty (for us) and in the right place and no matter how bad the recession is i'll take it any day over being born to a poor family in Africa or Asia, where the vast majority of people alive today live from hand to mouth.
You and most people in the western world are some of the luckiest humans to have ever been born, we're here at a time of plenty (for us) and in the right place and no matter how bad the recession is i'll take it any day over being born to a poor family in Africa or Asia, where the vast majority of people alive today live from hand to mouth.
I´m trying to take on board both sides of the debate here, and there are some good posts, but Conorco, don´t you know how many employed people are depressed, demoralised, and demotivated?
A hell of a lot. That´s just a red herring.
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Happygolucky4u: I hate to see the children do without because of a parent who has made an inconsiderate decision. I think there should be some way to make the parents responsiable for their decisions. I think there should be a contract signed that addresses becoming pregnant while on benefits. Either by jail time or community service. So before you start the "it will cost more in tax payers money" theme. It might at first. But after the law is proved to be enforced then it will pay for its self. Example in my state the death penealty is still alive and doing well. So if I had to take someone to higher ground I would cart their butt over the state line and do it in state more forgiving. I do not mind giving someone a hand up. I even do not mind giving some a hand out. But someone who flaunts their life style of living off the system and does not try to better their situation But in reality I have never seen these laws change anything. The offenders can find a way to get around it faster than the laws can be made. And sadly those who really need it get less because of the abusers.
I think it's a shame we don't require community service for people on welfare, anyway. It might cost more, but at least the community would get SOMETHING from them and maybe if they had to report to work every day, anyway, they might consider getting a job that would get them off welfare and on their feet again. I like your idea of a contract, too.
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we also have Food stamps, Medicade,free childcare, which are given to people as well.
The working class pays income taxes and state taxes for these programs, which is where the "percentage" you speak of is coming from.
I don't know what you're talking about (not meant in a smart way either, because each state is different), but in Illinois/Missouri this is part and parcel of the welfare system.
Exactly much different everywhere..
And its not free here...they hardly have anything to live on once everything is payed for