It`s every Americans right to bear arms. Do you think this law should be repealed or not?. (311)
serena123durban, KwaZulu-Natal South Africa44 Threads 2 Polls 2,821 PostsA lot of people here have guns, but you have to know how to use it and you have to have a license to own it
My argument is fine, it just hypotecally extends the principle of bearing arms to highlight a flaw in your argument.
Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
Forcedhand: I could make a few points about your response here. I understand every part of "shall not be infringed". Are you presenting that to me as some sort of commandment handed down from the Gods? What part of "free speech" do you not understand?
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Interesting point that, however I believe our Founders did address that in an earlier document. 'We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men...' So yeah, before they got around to winning the war and then setting forth the rules the new government would operate under, they first determined that everything else was self evident and a non-declared Commandment. One of the interesting spin offs of that is an implied impact in the 'all men' category. I.e., that they felt the basic Declaration (and subsequent growths from it) should apply everywhere, not just in the new country they hoped to start.
These are some I no longer use because I have newer ones. Several are over 100 years old, but I have ammo for all of them and they all work just fine (they all get periodic cleaning and test firing for fun). At one time or circumstance or another I have carried (as bear arms) all of them. One or six have even been used from time to time.
There are others of course, but there is no more room on top of the freezers. Here in my part of the USA, if you see one that strikes your fancy that week, if you can afford it you can buy it. When you see a prettier one you buy that one and throw the old one in a drawer or something. I have neighbors with way more of course.
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Forcedhand: My argument is fine, it just hypotecally extends the principle of bearing arms to highlight a flaw in your argument.
Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
I suggest you look at the US-Firearmscode before you make those sweeping "FREELY AVAILABLE" Statements!
Forcedhand: My argument is fine, it just hypotecally extends the principle of bearing arms to highlight a flaw in your argument.
Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
and I suggest it is none of the other Countries Beeswax,especially not of Europe's!Your reports are about declining rates of gun related violence in a jurisdiction that permits people to bear arms. If looked at in this insular context there might appear to be some merit to that argument. The fact is that the gun related violence in the US should be compared to gun related violence in other countries where people do not have the right to bear arms. Then ask if the significantly higher rate of deaths in the US has anything to do with the fact that guns are freely available. I suggest to you that it is.
KNenagh: It works without guns in other countries.
Looking at this gun debate just made me realise - I would never want to live in a country where people think it is necessary to bear arms - let it be Afghanistan, Mali or USA.
Looking at this gun debate just made me realise - I would never want to live in a country where people think it is necessary to bear arms - let it be Afghanistan, Mali or USA.
A lot of people draw a strong line here and friendships wash away from these strong feelings. I accept peoples right to choose. I also expect people to be responsible. Just because something worked in a different place does not mean it will work here. And the reasons are many. One is because people don' want the change. But back to what I said earlier. If someone is going to say that they will remove all guns from legal and illegal ownership I say they can not so it unless they were to totally render each person at the mercy of the government and I do not see how a government that can not even keep control over other things could ever be expected to stop criminals from access to weapons. If the USA was the size of the UK then maybe they would have a chance of using strict rules. But we are not like that. And lets look at China. I is very large. But I do not want to live in China. I do not at all. SO then there is Australia. But the population is close to 20 million in Australia and 300 million in the USA. These are like night and day. I would love to hear a way that everyone could be happy but I don't see it. I think the one thing is that people get very upset and defensive, once someone gets angry or defensive the whole idea of working together is severely diminished. I hope that some of this makes sense to many that compare one country to the next. I believe you need to live where you feel safe. I feel safe where i am. If it changes than so will I. And Canada is again about 10 percent the population of the USA. Same Scenario.... and that is just a few.
I'm glad to see you're taking the debate to a higher plane now! It's interesting that you're shown here as being from Switzerland. Did it not occur to you that if you can lie about your location maybe others can too?
Forcedhand: I'm glad to see you're taking the debate to a higher plane now! It's interesting that you're shown here as being from Switzerland. Did it not occur to you that if you can lie about your location maybe others can too?
spell it out,Sunshine!
Forcedhand: I'm glad to see you're taking the debate to a higher plane now! It's interesting that you're shown here as being from Switzerland. Did it not occur to you that if you can lie about your location maybe others can too?
well,Son,you might as well report me for spoofing my IP! Try sign up through a Proxy so you can use a spoofed IP!
Wish you good luck!
Conrad73: spell it out,Sunshine!
I'm Irish and living in Ireland "sunshine". I don't feel the need to give a false location. However, I would of thought that those of you that do feel that need would not necessarily accept that everyone else is telling the truth.
Forcedhand: I'm Irish and living in Ireland "sunshine". I don't feel the need to give a false location. However, I would of thought that those of you that do feel that need would not necessarily accept that everyone else is telling the truth.
False location? why would you even suggest such a thing? I think it is simply a ploy to try and discredit someone that has been here for many many years. No reason for "him" to risk being removed from the site for putting a false locale. I still am waiting for a reply to my post to you btw.
Forcedhand: Please accept my apologies on not replying to this. I didn't see it. Now, one thing at a time. Conrad himself made some statements that suggested his real location is the US not Switzerland. Read back on his posts.
Regarding your original post, you're describing a very particular scenario at a micro level and then attempting to use that to support national policy. The facts are that if there are gun controls in society then less people get killed through gun related violence. I can't really understand the siege mentality adopted by so many advocates of the "right to bear arms". It's quite simple, if there were less guns there would be less killings.
Regarding your original post, you're describing a very particular scenario at a micro level and then attempting to use that to support national policy. The facts are that if there are gun controls in society then less people get killed through gun related violence. I can't really understand the siege mentality adopted by so many advocates of the "right to bear arms". It's quite simple, if there were less guns there would be less killings.
again, and it is far from micro. less guns right? ok, less guns`from criminals might show merit. but how could anyone regulate what is already illegal?
Forcedhand: I'm Irish and living in Ireland "sunshine". I don't feel the need to give a false location. However, I would of thought that those of you that do feel that need would not necessarily accept that everyone else is telling the truth.
and FYI,I am Swiss and live in Zurich,Switzerland,regardless how much that might bug you!Why do you suggest we give up our guns? That's a very funny notion. You have some very silly thoughts about reality. Maybe if you studied world history you could have a better understanding why the most powerful country in the world has a 2nd amendment. Eat healthy foods too.
Waterbearer63: This debate has gone on for years and probably will never be satisfied to everybody`s expectations. What do you believe?. Should all guns be banned or do you believe that your rights supercede the rights of innocents to live.
afew nuts kill n police cant stop them,like when we lived,in the country/grandpa said a good shotgun,changes folks minds/no 911 rhen.galrads: Why do you suggest we give up our guns? That's a very funny notion. You have some very silly thoughts about reality. Maybe if you studied world history you could have a better understanding why the most powerful country in the world has a 2nd amendment. Eat healthy foods too.
Still living in dreamland I see. Most powerful country but hasn't won a war since WWII? And won that with allies.
Lost in Vietnam, Drew in Korea, Stalemate in Iraq and Afghanistan. Dream on. On the subject of arming citizens. I could not care less if American people are allowed be armed or not as I don't live there. But it is a fact that countries that don't allow citizens to own guns have far less gun crime and deaths from guns. That's a fact that can't be argued with.
But if the majority in the US want to allow gun ownership well that's their right.
sofarsogood74: Still living in dreamland I see. Most powerful country but hasn't won a war since WWII? And won that with allies. Lost in Vietnam, Drew in Korea, Stalemate in Iraq and Afghanistan. Dream on.
On the subject of arming citizens. I could not care less if American people are allowed be armed or not as I don't live there. But it is a fact that countries that don't allow citizens to own guns have far less gun crime and deaths from guns. That's a fact that can't be argued with.
But if the majority in the US want to allow gun ownership well that's their right.
On the subject of arming citizens. I could not care less if American people are allowed be armed or not as I don't live there. But it is a fact that countries that don't allow citizens to own guns have far less gun crime and deaths from guns. That's a fact that can't be argued with.
But if the majority in the US want to allow gun ownership well that's their right.
Oh, Please, Show us some facts you speak of.
Btw the USA has the potential to destroy most everything it wants to and we certainly can make a glass parking lot out of your tiny island if we needed to and w/o fear of resistance or retaliation or expense. Is this information not correct?
You are very entertaining. Are you an actor or wanna be comedian?
galrads: Oh, Please, Show us some facts you speak of.
Btw the USA has the potential to destroy most everything it wants to and we certainly can make a glass parking lot out of your tiny island if we needed to and w/o fear of resistance or retaliation or expense. Is this information not correct? You are very entertaining. Are you an actor or wanna be comedian?
Btw the USA has the potential to destroy most everything it wants to and we certainly can make a glass parking lot out of your tiny island if we needed to and w/o fear of resistance or retaliation or expense. Is this information not correct? You are very entertaining. Are you an actor or wanna be comedian?
We are an island of 6 million people. More people in London. Ant nuclear power could destroy us. As any nuclear power could destroy most everything.
You talk like a 7 year old boasting about how your Daddy can beat up a smaller Daddy. Facts are facts. You could not win in Vietnam, Korea, Afghanistan or Iraq so I dont know why you think you're this unstoppable force. You're living in your own little dreamland.
As far as gun deaths goes just Google how many deaths there are in the US compared to other countries. You had 32,000 gun deaths in 2011. The UK had about 150 in that year. Now multiply the 150 by 6 as their population is one sixth of yours you get 900. So you had 32,000 per 360 mill they had 900 per 360 mill.
Do I think this "law" should be repealed? Quick and simple answer NO - this is the second amendment to the constitution. So no - would I like to see changes to how this is enacted and interpreted - you bet - taken from the internet dictionary
The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights.
The right to bear arms predates the Bill of Rights; the Second Amendment was based partially on the right to bear arms in English common-law, and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. This right was described by Sir William Blackstone (commonly referred to simply as "Blackstone") as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state. Academic inquiry into the purpose, scope, and effect of the amendment has been controversial and subject to numerous interpretations.
The Second Amendment (Amendment II) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that protects the right to keep and bear arms. It was adopted on December 15, 1791, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights.
The right to bear arms predates the Bill of Rights; the Second Amendment was based partially on the right to bear arms in English common-law, and was influenced by the English Bill of Rights of 1689. This right was described by Sir William Blackstone (commonly referred to simply as "Blackstone") as an auxiliary right, supporting the natural rights of self-defense, resistance to oppression, and the civic duty to act in concert in defense of the state. Academic inquiry into the purpose, scope, and effect of the amendment has been controversial and subject to numerous interpretations.
sofarsogood74: I don't live in England either. But you asked for facts. I told you the facts! If the public are now allowed own guns there are far less gun deaths. You asked me to prove it I did. Deal with it!
I couldn't care less if you lot are allowed own guns or not. Doesn't effect my life one jot! I simply pointed out the FACT that if civilians are not allowed own guns there are far less gun deaths. Now do you want to tell me that your big country could bomb my little one into the ground again. Or ask why we need a president when there are only a few million of us?
I see you skipped the Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan thing too. Bet you thought you could bomb those places to the ground too.
If being Irish teaches me one thing it is that it may be easy for a bigger and more powerful country to invade another country but holding onto that country and keeping control of it is another thing. Just ask the last Super Power Britain. We are only a few miles from them, smaller than them, one tenth of their population and they could not hold onto our land.
I couldn't care less if you lot are allowed own guns or not. Doesn't effect my life one jot! I simply pointed out the FACT that if civilians are not allowed own guns there are far less gun deaths. Now do you want to tell me that your big country could bomb my little one into the ground again. Or ask why we need a president when there are only a few million of us?
I see you skipped the Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan thing too. Bet you thought you could bomb those places to the ground too.
If being Irish teaches me one thing it is that it may be easy for a bigger and more powerful country to invade another country but holding onto that country and keeping control of it is another thing. Just ask the last Super Power Britain. We are only a few miles from them, smaller than them, one tenth of their population and they could not hold onto our land.
Taking away citizens guns doesn't take away guns from criminals, and doesn't stop anyone from killing someone else. You don't have not provided any supporting information that means anything.
galrads: Taking away citizens guns doesn't take away guns from criminals, and doesn't stop anyone from killing someone else. You don't have not provided any supporting information that means anything.
OMG,Foghorn Leghorn has arrived! Now there are two!
If guns were banned would it stop murder and crime?
The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
Conrad73: OMG,Foghorn Leghorn has arrived!
Now there are two!
Now there are two!
It's the Google warrior.
See a topic.....Decide what position you're talking.....Google to find some "facts"
Then proclaim to be an expert! EU spying on US. What is the EU's intelligence agency called again?
Common Knowledge!
Ccincy: If guns were banned would it stop murder and crime?
The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
Of course not. It would lessen the amount of people murdered and lesses gun crime though.
Ccincy: If guns were banned would it stop murder and crime?
The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
That's what a Firearm insures!The Right to bear arms should be changed to "Right to live life.:
The figures below say it all really.
Homicide by firearm rate per 100,000 population.
United States -2.97
West Bank & Gaza-2.95
Sierra Leone -2.28
Ireland - 0.48
England & Wales - 0.07
Canada -0.51
Northern Ireland - 0.28
France -0.06
Germany - 0.19
Homicide by firearm rate per 100,000 population.
United States -2.97
West Bank & Gaza-2.95
Sierra Leone -2.28
Ireland - 0.48
England & Wales - 0.07
Canada -0.51
Northern Ireland - 0.28
France -0.06
Germany - 0.19
sofarsogood74: Of course not. It would lessen the amount of people murdered and lesses gun crime though.
why not just outlaw Murder?And there wouldn't be another killing again?
Blame the Criminal,not the Gun!
How come you all blame the Driver of a Car that kills someone,not the Car?
How come you blame the Suicide-Bomber and not the Bomb?
How come when someone is killed with a Gun,you blame the Gun,not the one using it?
You all have some strange notions!
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