A very similar argument was made when the government Do Not Call list went into effect. That it would put many thousands of telemarketers out of work (it probably did, but I imagine most went to work in other less annoying fields in short order).
So, you seem to say that we should continue paying ever higher insurance premiums (those that can afford to have health insurance to begin with... and they're getting fewer in number every year) so that those 2.5 million health insurance company employee's can keep their jobs? But since the number of people who can afford health insurance is constantly decreasing as premiums continue to climb, how long before those 2.5 million health insurance company employee's lose their jobs anyway as the system unravels?
This is why it's oh so important to get the system reformed... it's unsustainable and leaves more and more people without access to affordable health care. The problem is only going to get worse if not addressed.
On the bright side though, at least those 2.5 million unemployed health insurance workers would have health insurance coverage, presuming health care reform passes and EVERYBODY get's coverage one way or the other! There has to be an "other" way though.
Just saying... if you're going to have every American covered, then you have no choice but to have a public option available. At least, I don't see any other way of going about it.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Never did apologize for claiming I said things which I did not say nor even imply... instead kept right on saying I said more things which I did not say, and I insulted her by calling her on it?
I have to wonder just how many things being attributed to President Obama, President Obama did not actually say or even imply?
Weird.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Oh, IC... so if somebody says, "I think you're mistaken" then that's an insult to you. In that case you're far too easily insulted then Sky. Heaven forbid I look at you the wrong way! Eeek!
You just don't like what I had to say so you claim Insult and I'm supposed to lie down on some sword in pentence I guess... not going to happen babes.
But it's ok for you to put words in other people's mouthes, to say they said things which they did not.
Believe whatever you want Sky, it's no skin off my chin. Let's blame Obama for Global Warming and Hurricane's Katrina Ike Rita and Andrew even. Let's not forget Plate Tectonics too while we're at it. Probably Obama's doing too.
But, there will be health care reform whether you like it or not, simply because the system cannot continue as it is. There are too many of us who have no health insurance and our numbers are growing daily as companies and individuals can no longer afford the ever increasing premiums... that, is a fact.
I believe from what you said that your problem is with your state health insurance coverage, and not President Obama. I think you should write your local state level representatives about it. But believe whatever you want it really matters not to me.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
I didn't! I disagree with you, we're not sending more troops to Iraq now we're actually pulling troop levels there down constantly. What you are seeing is troops being rotated to relieve those units which aren't yet scheduled to be withdrawn. That's not the same thing as sending more troops to Iraq.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
That sounds really weird to me... but, welcome to the club of the uninsured in that case!
(ps. You'll find that there's alot of us in this club.)
Ok just thinking here... something about that still doesn't make sense. Obama's health care reforms are designed and intended to insure EVERY American citizen has health care insurance in some way or other... so if it passes and is signed into law, and your state covered insurance does drop you (though I don't understand why they would... I think you should write to your state representatives on that one!), then as I understand it you'd be covered by the health care reform legislation itself... that is the point of the thing after all, to make sure EVERY American has coverage.
So either, the health care reform legislation never sees the light of day and millions of us Americans remain without any coverage while you keep your state insurance coverage, or it passes and becomes law and you lose your state insurance coverage but gain federal coverage (assuming a federal public plan is included as the President would like). I'm not sure I see where you lose either way Sky.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Oooh! Now we're going to get into gender stereotypes then!
Nope, I'm not on social security and I doubt I ever will be.
I never said you were or are stupid Sky. Why is it you keep putting words in my mouth? I said I think you have your facts wrong and/or have some misunderstandings.
It is wrong to blame the person in charge for things that happened BEFORE that person was in charge... there'in lies the problem Sky.
And why do you keep putting words in my mouth anyways?
Insults? I haven't called you a single name used any profanity nor called you stupid as you have claimed... so, what insults? You don't deserve insults, and I don't deserve you putting words in my mouth and yet you persist in doing it...
How dare I question your understanding? How dare I not if I think you have misunderstood something!
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
That's not sending more troops in Sky, that's rotating and relieving exising troops... the total number of troops IS constantly decreasing in Iraq. You cannot move an entire army and all it's support people and equipment out overnight unless you want them to be slaughtered in the process. It would be pure chaos to even try. Insurgents and Al Qaida people ARE still there in Iraq no doubt, don't you think they'd not hesitate to kill American troops en-mass if given the chance? You don't have 100's of thousands of troops and support personnel drop their weapons and tools and go stand in line to get on boats and planes to leave the country all at once!
I'm sorry but I do believe you have your facts wrong Sky. There is no increase in American troop levels in Iraq... all you're seeing is troop rotations and relief. That's part of the process of decreasing the overall troop numbers in Iraq.
Obama has only been Commander in Chief for 9 months, and you might consider that it's been a very busy 9 months.
Your misunderstanding of this troop thing makes me really wonder about your understanding of the SS medicare benefits and how health care changes may or may not affect you, Sky. You are getting alot of things really backwards from my reading of your posts here, and you're placing blame where it does not actually belong as a result.
You need to do more research and ask more questions, IMO.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
I gave my opinion, and you accused me of speaking for all American's, Sky. You were wrong and I've yet to see an apology for that.
Our country hasn't been "free" for many many years... in the old Soviet Union, if the police stopped you and you didn't have all your correct papers they'd haul you off to jail. In the United States now, if you get stopped and asked to present official ID the police haul you off to jail if you don't provide it... even if you haven't done anything illegal! You don't even have to be driving a vehicle to get arrested for not presenting id... how free is that?
Be accused of a crime, and the government can seize anything and everything you own down to your socks and underwear even though you haven't been tried or convicted of anything... the phrase "innocent until proven guilty" has never been so hollow.
But, this is another topic entirely and has nothing to do with President Obama or health care reform or foreign wars.
Regarding pulling troops out of Iraq, as far as I can tell they are constantly and consistently pulling troops out... but there is NO way to pull them all out on the same day! They didn't all go in at once, they can't all come out at once. Ergo, some must stay for awhile and units that stay still get rotated while other's are removed for good. I'd not be suprised to see fresh troops going in to relieve existing troops, but the numbers as a whole are constantly being reduced.
There will in all likelihood be an increase in troops in Afghanistan however, and I have no argument with that! Afghanistan is where the people that committed the 9/11 terrorist attacks trained and where the attacks were directed from... we have the moral right to take on and kill the Taliban (who tried to protect and shield those who were behind the attacks) and Osam Bin Ladin and his thugs! These ARE the people who were behind 9/11 and there's never been any denying that.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Uh-uh Sky, that was a Republican Administration that put our troops over there in harm's way. You have to give President George Bush Jr. credit for that one Sky.
You should be very angry with President Bush over all those filled body bags that have been coming home on those cargo planes over the past 8 years, Sky... but the Bush administration wouldn't even let you see them, as I recall. Didn't want American voters seeing Amercian troops coming home in body bags and all that...
I'm personnally very angry with Bush, that his administration led our people to believe Iraq had and was actively developing weapons of mass destruction to attack the United States! Even Collin Powel has stated that he was very upset when he found out the "evidence" he'd presented to the United Nations on Iraqi weapons was false (he did an interview a few years after he resigned his position in the Bush administration). Saddam and Son's deserved what they got, but I don't believe we the American taxpayers and troops should have paid the price in money and lives spent!
And no, I wanted to see a list of things Obama has done that have affected YOU, not American's in general. Again, you aren't reading what I wrote or you are intentionally choosing to change what I wrote to suite your agenda... I appreciate neither.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God"!)
I wasn't, if you'll actually READ what I wrote I said that *I* don't believe that to be the American Way!
I speak for me. You need to learn to read what is actually written Sky and don't make things up. This looks to me to be the very root of most of the stuff I keep hearing about President Obama's health care reform proposals: people just making things up willy-nilly.
You took what I wrote, and changed it Sky. I don't appreciate that.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God"!)
Sky, check your dates... Wall Street cratered BEFORE the Presidential Election last year. A Republican administration held the White House and Obama was a mere Senator running for President at the time.
Obama's Administration did NOT take power till January 2008 and the official recession was well under way by then. Obama inherited the Recession, it did not begin during his administration and that is a fact nobody can deny!
This is what I'm talking about, people blaming Obama for things he has not even done. That's just not right IMHO. I don't know that Obama is that good, but I know that he is NOT THAT BAD.
Most everybody I know thought the Recession had begun sometime around December 2007. When the Bush administration finally conceded that the economy was in fact in a Recession (they denied it most of Summer 2008 in spite of their stimulus packages trying to stop it) they put the beginning of the recession at around December 2007 as I recall the official statement they made on the evening national news.
Regards!
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
I'm not. But I can't list a single thing... and I don't see anybody else listing anything factual either that he or his administration has actually done that has impacted their life negatively.
So why are you, who aren't even residing in the United States apparently, so anti-Obama? What's in it for you if his administration fails or we suffer from his policies?
Now what's gotten me riled up is all the lies and half-truths and pure BS that's being put out about the current administrations efforts. This crap does not serve our nation well at all. I'm hearing lots of criticism (much of which does not seem at all valid or even realistic) and I hear very few good ideas... that's the definition of a pundit.
I did not vote for Obama but I do not like seeing somebody demonized... that's just not right, and I don't believe that to be the American Way.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God"!)
Well I don't know what Obama thinks about you, but I think you're scewing the numbers something fierce! President Bush's administration was the one that started giving our tax money to banks and businesses left and right last year... alot of that 1 trillion was given away by them, not Obama!
Of course, the choice was to pump money into the economy ASAP or watch the economy go up in flames... deregulation under the rebublican administration led to Wall Street taking gambles that we the people couldn't afford for them to lose on!
Was it right? No and Hell No not from the very start when Bush started the bailouts it wasn't right! It didn't save jobs, instead it saved CEO's and top executives their million dollar bonus'... hindsight is of course 20/20.
I say point blank that if you want to get angry about government spending then you should START with Foreign Aid spending... that's hundreds of billions a year going to Israel, Pakistan, India, The Palistinions, and other countries that don't even much like us!
Health care reform is to benefit US, the American citizens. Foreign Aid lines the pockets of foreign governments so they can design and build weapons of mass destruction and live in luxury (their leaders, not their people). Which way do you want your tax dollars to be spent and why?
Why are you so angry at the idea of spending money on health care reform, but it's ok to give money away to foreign governments? That's just screwy IMHO.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God"!)
What wrong has he done, then? Please do list the actual factual wrongs that have been committed that harmed you or yours and how you were harmed by President Obama!
So far all I've read is people claiming Obama is GOING to do them wrong (almost always from Conservative Republican sources if you track the story back)... I heard the same and worse about President Clinton when he was 1st elected President. List something President Clinton did that made your life worse somehow.
Too many doomsayers, not enough actual doom.
Normally I wouldn't want to hang the messenger, but I've had growing doubts about the messenger's message and motives... and if the messenger is lying for personal or political gain, then he deserves his fate!
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
No and No it wasn't an inside job any more than Pearl Harbor was in 1941. The enemy did a good job thinking outside-the-box in each case, and in both cases the enemy awakened a sleeping-giant. Not the best of strategies that!
Better to let sleeping-giant's sleep, but some people have to learn the hard way I guess.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
If you look at the women's profiles on CS, note the last time they logged in... many Texas women (for instance) haven't logged into their profile's in over a month (and the system gives no indication how far over a month it's been). They'll likely never log into CS again, so sending them messages is absolutely pointless.
Like so many other social networking/dating sites, CS doesn't appear to delete old profiles. I've never been able to understand why they don't purge abandoned profiles after so long... if somebody hasn't logged in in forever and a day, then they never will. But that's just my opinion.
Regards and best wishes.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
"Read my lips: No new taxes!" That ring any bells with anybody else?
And speaking of "gimme gimme gimme..." which American President decided to give Pakistan billions in "foreign aid", and the Palestinians millions in "foreign aid"? Who was that nice guy who so thoughtfully gave away our very hard earned tax dollars to foreign peoples???
It's so funny to me that we can't afford health care reform to take care of our own citizens, but we can afford to give hundreds of billions to foreign countries... even foreign countries who have their own VERY expensive nuclear weapons programs!
And, wasn't President Nixon a... (gasp!)... Republican???
It's funny to me how people can have such a selective memory when it comes to typical conservative administrations.
Only history can truthfully tell who was a great President and who really sucked. President Nixon REALLY sucked for instance.
Time will tell with President Obama... the proof is in the pudding.
ps. Know your history, or repeat it... your choice.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God"!)
I think he's been just a little bit busy, with trying to keep the economy from going into a Great Depression, a continuing war against terrorism and stuff. There's also the goal of getting some kind of decent health care reform passed this year and that's not going too well so far... if you're on Social Security you probably are on Medicare as well if I understand correctly so at least you have that which is more than I and far too many others have (health care wise).
Point being, there's only so many fires anybody can stamp out at one time. See his hands? They're hands, not wands... he can't just wave them and make everything perfect! LOL!
SS hasn't gone broke and isn't likely to be allowed to go broke, at least for the time being. My generation will likely never see a penny of what we've paid into it however which really suxs but oh well.
Regards and hang in there.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
I guess it all depends on your point of view... here's my take: Virtually all legislation IS written by committee, Congressmen (and women!) rarely read the bills they vote on but instead rely on others to read and summarize for them. Those same Congressmen/women don't need this bill/legislation because THEY'RE already covered by a health insurance plan that WE the taxpayers are paying for! Aren't we just the nicest taxpayers?
President Obama has admitted to having smoked and still craving a cig every now and then, but he has for all intents and purposes stopped smoking as I understand it. The head of the Treasury Department is a prime example of why the tax codes are way too damned confusing (I don't even try to do my own taxes, I pay an accountant and even he admits it's often a guessing game with the IRS). The Surgeon General needs to get the lead out eat less and move more (but so do 1 in 3 Americans as I understand it, so let thee without sin cast the 1st stone!), AND maybe if we weren't so busy giving 100's of Billions of our hard earned dollars away to foreign nations every year we could afford to pay for a really top notch health care system for our own citizens for a change.
That's my take on it.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Keep people healthy and overall productivity goes up as well. Sick people aren't particularly productive people even though they may still try to go in to work... and end up getting their coworkers sick as a result.
And Dale, I wasn't meaning to criticize the VA system with that story about my grandfather's last year of life. I have no doubt they did the best they could for him... however I see it as 1 case where it might have been better off all the way around to have NOT treated him for the brain tumor. My grandfather walked into the VA hospital on his own with a cane, but was wheeled out of it a few days later drooling in a near vegetable like state. Something not right about that don't ya think?
I think this is what President Obama is talking about when he talks of reducing the cost of health care by deciding when NOT to treat a patient... some pundits want to claim Obama wants to set up "death committee's", but that's so far from the truth it's ridiculous. Medical journals have repeatedly warned over recent years of men with prostate tumors going thru all sorts of invasive treatments, even for tumors that would never have caused any problems in their lifetime! We've become conditioned to want and demand immediate treatment for anything that we can find wrong, but sometimes just because a test comes back Positive that doesn't mean that treatment is the best course of action... we need to treat intelligently and where applicable, instead of treating blindly no matter the cost (cost isn't only monetary peeps, as my late grandfather's example shows!).
Regards!
ps. Be careful about lowering expectations... you might get what you wish for Dale! If the end result doesn't make a significant improvement to the overall health care system, then this entire debate is for not.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
I agree 100%! We are who and what we are because looks do matter and our parents and grandparents and ancestors further back were physically attractive to one another. Unfortunately, it's often politically incorrect to admit to it. Oh well...
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Actually Ray, that very thought has crossed my mind a few times in recent months. From a certain point of view, Health Insurance has itself created this beast (of a health care system) because the beast could feed off patient's insurance policies.
I'm not sure if we need to kill the beast or merely tame it down. But I agree 100% with President Obama when he says that the status-quo cannot stand. Something's gotta change or else eventually nobody under the age of 65 will have health insurance or be able to afford health care! We'll all be sitting in the ER, and the wait time will stretch into days or weeks even. I wonder if they deliver pizza to the ER around here?
What's making me downright angry now is the people who not only want but INSIST on keeping the status-quo, saying we can't afford to reform the system... in spite of all the money this country gives away to other nations (many of whome don't particularly even like us). That just disgusts me to no end.
If you don't like President Obama's plan, then kindly put your own plan together and submit it... let the best plan win!
Is that too much to ask for? Really! I'm so tired of the pundits.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")
Michael211_2000 Forum Posts (775)
RE: Obama Rocks! Could the job being done better by republicans?
A very similar argument was made when the government Do Not Call list went into effect. That it would put many thousands of telemarketers out of work (it probably did, but I imagine most went to work in other less annoying fields in short order).So, you seem to say that we should continue paying ever higher insurance premiums (those that can afford to have health insurance to begin with... and they're getting fewer in number every year) so that those 2.5 million health insurance company employee's can keep their jobs? But since the number of people who can afford health insurance is constantly decreasing as premiums continue to climb, how long before those 2.5 million health insurance company employee's lose their jobs anyway as the system unravels?
This is why it's oh so important to get the system reformed... it's unsustainable and leaves more and more people without access to affordable health care. The problem is only going to get worse if not addressed.
On the bright side though, at least those 2.5 million unemployed health insurance workers would have health insurance coverage, presuming health care reform passes and EVERYBODY get's coverage one way or the other! There has to be an "other" way though.
Just saying... if you're going to have every American covered, then you have no choice but to have a public option available. At least, I don't see any other way of going about it.
- Michael ("American by birth, Texan by the Grace of God!")