Those who don't believe in God or Jesus, why don't you? ( Archived) (852)

bay163: do you ever think about what the bible is trying to tell you?

looking at it like it has a message you want to deschifer, instead of criticizing, think this way for one time, try yourself to figure out what it really means, and dont let other people tell you. If you had a map to a bury treasure would you tell everyone how it doesnt make sense or would you try to find the treasure??????????

mortonian: there is a very simple answer to your question and nothing complicated about it CHOICE!!

bay163: Jesus is God, and the Holy Spirit, and God the Father. So God takes different forms, but to get to the Father you need the son in your heart.

K_rational: Why don't atheists and agnostics believe in religious mythologies? Because of a complete lack of any evidence. If you visited a newly discovered tribe living in the Amazon basin who grew up oblivious to outside mythologies, do you honestly believe you could convince them? It has been tried and failed; the tribe converted the missionary.



If you want atheists and agnostics to believe, there's only one way, and it's not more dogma and diatribe: perform one of the claims of the supernatural from the book o' blood. Go to a hospital morgue with the non-believer and raise someone from the dead, such as a person who was dismembered in a car accident three days ago, thus could not be simply comatose and alive. (Other demonstrations of the supernatural that defy rational explanation would also suffice, such as separating the water between Florida and Cuba.)

If you can bring the person back to life, we'll believe because it's something inexplicable by rational thinking and science. If you can't do it, your "god" doesn't exist. If you won't even try to do it, it means you know your "god" doesn't exist. If you say, "You don't test 'god'!", you are afraid to admit you can't prove it. Regardless of which, it's claim in the buybull, therefore the burden of proof lies with the religious who claim it's possible, not with those who refute it.

If anyone disagrees about the burden of proof, remember this: the burden of proof I'm demanding, false until proven true, is the same burden of proof used in a court of law: innocent until proven guilty. Those expecting different burdens of proof (one for their religion, a different one for themselves) are hypocrites: if one wants "true until proven false" for one's mythology, then to be ethically consistent one would have to accept being guilty until proven innocent if one were ever charged with a crime.

Also note the other fact which most ardently religious people ignore, gloss over, or (sometimes) lie about: admitting that you (the religious) can't prove there is a "god" doesn't prevent you from believing in it. All it does is prevent you from imposing religion on others, which is all that atheists and agnostics are asking for. Nobody is asking you not to believe, only to keep it in your church and home and out of schools, law and government. (Discussion and debate sites are no-man's-land where anything goes.)

For any non-believers reading this, remember and quote these phrases whenever someone asks you "Why don't you believe?":
Put up or shut up.
Show it or stow it.
Evidence, not avoidance.
Demonstrate, don't remonstrate.
Also remember that most fervently anti-religious countries are those where there is only one religion or dogma and it bans the practice of others to prevent competition. A secular society is not an atheist society.